Needles - Cherbourg - Saturday 12 October 2013

[Ian M]

Originally Posted by biffer

Now two questions, who had charts and who had an accurate compass, no fibbing now

Engage smug mode paper chart in waterproof A4 zip loc bag, two compasses, one on console, one handheld. Compass was set up 3 years ago, should still be accurate I think??
Still went slightly off course occassionally, and contrary to most, I used my plotter for direction most of the time (when I remembered to look ), and it was always visible, even with sunlight behind me.

[Ian M]

Originally Posted by hadd

I'm having problems at the moment transferring footage on to iMovie sorry may take some time to sort out.

Same here, two attempts to upload to Youtube at present, both failed

[willk]

With reference to a few posts above, I may have not made myself entirely clear (a habit, I'll admit)

Compass: I didn't mean that I actually NAVIGATE by compass. I simply use it as a reference to steer to over intermediate distances. You certainly can do this in a RIB, I do it regularly. You need a decent (read BIG) well damped unit though. I've used plotter/s alongside compass in fog or rain and they compliment each other very well. Crossing the North Channel in rain with a F7 blowing in yer gob means you have to steer allowing for the sea first and direction second. The combination approach works well in those circumstances. Now, if there's a rock in your general path.....

Rain-x: OK up to a point. Works when you're going fast, works if the rain is heavy. Doesn't work so well if you're going slowly and the droplets are fine. It's shite in mist and fog.

Drysuits: I don't wear one (well, sometimes my scuba drysuit), I wear a Fladen floatation suit. If it's properly rainy, the Fladen and I get soaked. Even Musto wearers get soaked. It needs cuff and neck seals if it's gonna be really rainy/splashy for prolonged periods. Soaked isn't the worst thing if you stay warm. I stay warm by using walking layers and a buff etc. Geckos keep you warm and help with morale generally. When finances permit, I'm buying a Black Shadow.

No, only kidding

[Brian]

Following on from wot Willk just sed..........

I wear a Musto, and I have found that if you put your hood on first, then put your Gecko on and then turn your collar up......it all works together. I was fed up with water running down inside my jacket no matter how tightly I fastened the collar, and tried this method, first of all as an experiment-and it works!

[Nick Hearne]

Originally Posted by biffer

I've been reading through these post while consuming large volumes of tea, a few things that I want to throw into the po if you guys are going to do more, compasses, it's ok to follow a compass heading if you're old school and I'm not opening a debate here, you need to have a compass swung every year if you're going to use it to navigate and swinging one on a rib is next to impossible, I'll explain, compass senses magnetic field so if you get anything metal near it you will put it out, push your control lever forward will put your compass out, if they're both on the console, so will cable steering when turning the wheel, something you can't adjust against, secondly if you're using a compass you will need paper charts and a plotted course.
If you're a few miles out when you get to land there is no way of knowing where you are without a chart of some sort and going back to old school, you can tell a lot from a chart, from depth, land marks, sea bed composite.
A plotter, you'll miss it if it doesn't work but have a back up planer plotter and don't rely on it entirely.
Now two questions, who had charts and who had an accurate compass, no fibbing now

Had route in the plotter to follow which I did check as we progressed, but also had the heading to follow with the compass which worked well for me. Paper charts in my small rib in those conditions would have been useless!
One thing which I should have done was to check which entrance other people had to Cherbourg as I was the only one heading for the west entrance which is quite some distance off the east!

[tony t]

Originally Posted by Ian M

Same here, two attempts to upload to Youtube at present, both failed

Have you tried saving the movie to your desktop then up load direct from YouTube it works for me

[tony t]

Originally Posted by willk

. When finances permit, I'm buying a Black Shadow. No, only kidding

I'll start a collection off you if you like Willk

[willk]

Originally Posted by tony t

I'll start a collection off you if you like Willk

Now there's an interesting moral dilemma!

[John Kennett]

Originally Posted by willk

Compass: I didn't mean that I actually NAVIGATE by compass. I simply use it as a reference to steer to over intermediate distances. You certainly can do this in a RIB, I do it regularly. You need a decent (read BIG) well damped unit though.:

If you take your heading from the GPS, once you're pointing the right direction you can easily make a note of the bearing shown on the compass and steer to it. Like willk says, steering by the compass, not actually navigating by it. This way it doesn't matter if it hasn't been accurately swung.

On lots of RIBs the plotter isn't ideally placed for the helm to see easily while driving in poor conditions, especially standing up, and a decent compass in line of sight is often easier to keep an eye on.

Little bouncy compasses are next to useless, but something like one of the big Plastimo compasses is good.

[Hightower]

Never use my compass! If I want to stay on a true course I program the waypoints in to the chart plotter and then use the "road" screen or by chart and digital compass contained within the plotter to navigate.

Just a few notes from the trip.

Gecko...Love it!
Seal Skin Gloves...Wet hands and slippy on stainless. Kept hands warm though.
2 piece Floatation suit...Wet Wet Wet, kept me warm though.
Need some boots for future adventures.

[tony t]

Originally Posted by Hightower

Never use my compass! If I want to stay on a true course I program the waypoints in to the chart plotter and then use the "road" screen or by chart and digital compass contained within the plotter to navigate. Just a few notes from the trip. Gecko...Love it! Seal Skin Gloves...Wet hands and slippy on stainless. Kept hands warm though. 2 piece Floatation suit...Wet Wet Wet, kept me warm though. Need some boots for future adventures.

Do you not like Fancy dry suit then, we have been out in some wet weather round Anglesey and have been bone dry all day.

[HUMBER P4VWL]

Have to say that if I used our rib more than once a year, a dry suit would be a must...

[Maximus]

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

+1, IMHO the best I could get from a compass on a RIB in those conditions , is that I'm heading generally in the right direction.

Exactly!... when its (Proper) Knarley i.e 6m+ Beam sea's dumping you off course on each Rise...its all you want!!..In the conditions we had... Being off course a little (Not making exact landfall) on a longish out of site of land Passage is of no real consequence.
Keeping the Boat even and SAFE i.e..watching the next set and deciding on tactics most definatley IS!
We were going from displacement-to WOT in seconds, (Hole shot is Paramount!) to get up and over some very steep stuff, against the wind..and VERY glad of all the 250 horses!....for over 4hrs.The idea of a Chart or even naving on a plotter is a Joke!...You adapt and overcome!!!...Or DONT!
As to checking the compass I do it every time....Taking a Compass Bearing on the Plotter..i.e Plotted course BEFOR!! you hit the rough Stuff!..
THAT way, even if the Copass is not 100% accurate (very few are!) any discrepancy is factored in.
Then if you do for any reason loose the Plotter...the Compass will get you SAFE!...Pluss its simple to do a reciprical bearing to get home.
To re-cap. No we didn't carry Paper Charts...not needed.
We did carry a Very Comprehensive Passage Plan including Tidal Ranges..and Streams.. Compass Bearings and courses.ect ect... All provided on 3x A4 Sheets and fully laminated by Avocett
We Both had spare Hanheld VHF's.
PLB.. Flares.. Throw Ropes ect .
I would also agree with Wilk about a BIG....WELL DAMPED COMPASS...I would repeat it needs to be in your line of sight for best results!..I have an Offshore 105 Plastimo...highly reccomened!
As to Vision... I purposely lowered my Consul when I specd my Boat (see original thread) so I can see over the consul rail when semi-seated on the Ulmanns...(they do sit quite high).Realy worth doing!
Also I'd definitely say The Rain Off absolutely works for me!..I put it on my screen and Visor..(a tip)...if its realy Rough,put it on the inside of the Visor too! It did wear off after a few Hours though.
With an Experienced Capable Boater (Avocett) in another well founded/spec'd Boat (RC750)
in our two boat Flotilla....all we had to do was enjoy the Ride!! and an extra night in France!...Oh and the Wives enjoyed it too!!

[Maximus]

Originally Posted by HUMBER P4VWL

Have to say that if I used our rib more than once a year, a dry suit would be a must...

Save a Few Quid there then P

[willk]

Originally Posted by Maximus

and an extra night in France!...Oh and the Wives enjoyed it too!!

That'll be the Fear at work

[Hightower]

Originally Posted by tony t

Do you not like Fancy dry suit then, we have been out in some wet weather round Anglesey and have been bone dry all day.

I used to have one. Still might somewhere in the garage but the cuffs and neck seals had gone and was looking scruffy too. Might have to dig it out one day.

[rocknrolla]

Originally Posted by Maximus

Exactly!... when its (Proper) Knarley i.e 6m+ Beam sea's dumping you off course on each Rise...its all you want!!..In the conditions we had... Being off course a little (Not making exact landfall) on a longish out of site of land Passage is of no real consequence.
Keeping the Boat even and SAFE i.e..watching the next set and deciding on tactics most definatley IS!
We were going from displacement-to WOT in seconds, (Hole shot is Paramount!) to get up and over some very steep stuff, against the wind..and VERY glad of all the 250 horses!....for over 4hrs.The idea of a Chart or even naving on a plotter is a Joke!...You adapt and overcome!!!...Or DONT!
As to checking the compass I do it every time....Taking a Compass Bearing on the Plotter..i.e Plotted course BEFOR!! you hit the rough Stuff!..
THAT way, even if the Copass is not 100% accurate (very few are!) any discrepancy is factored in.
Then if you do for any reason loose the Plotter...the Compass will get you SAFE!...Pluss its simple to do a reciprical bearing to get home.
To re-cap. No we didn't carry Paper Charts...not needed.
We did carry a Very Comprehensive Passage Plan including Tidal Ranges..and Streams.. Compass Bearings and courses.ect ect... All provided on 3x A4 Sheets and fully laminated by Avocett
We Both had spare Hanheld VHF's.
PLB.. Flares.. Throw Ropes ect .
I would also agree with Wilk about a BIG....WELL DAMPED COMPASS...I would repeat it needs to be in your line of sight for best results!..I have an Offshore 105 Plastimo...highly reccomened!
As to Vision... I purposely lowered my Consul when I specd my Boat (see original thread) so I can see over the consul rail when semi-seated on the Ulmanns...(they do sit quite high).Realy worth doing!
Also I'd definitely say The Rain Off absolutely works for me!..I put it on my screen and Visor..(a tip)...if its realy Rough,put it on the inside of the Visor too! It did wear off after a few Hours though.
With an Experienced Capable Boater (Avocett) in another well founded/spec'd Boat (RC750)
in our two boat Flotilla....all we had to do was enjoy the Ride!! and an extra night in France!...Oh and the Wives enjoyed it too!!

Sounds like u ad a ball Looey

[Trevor G]

Originally Posted by willk

Drysuits: I don't wear one (well, sometimes my scuba drysuit), I wear a Fladen floatation suit. If it's properly rainy, the Fladen and I get soaked.

On the way across to Cherbourg I used my 7 year old Fladen 2-piece flotation suit (cost about £80) - it's still waterproof and would have kept me dry if we hadn't taken a wave such that the water went straight down my neck. As per Hightower, if anything it was too warm! For anyone thinking of what to buy for their 1st waterproofs I can't recommend them enough. fantastic value for money.
On the way back I used my Helly Hansen Ocean Drysuit (cost about £600) - it kept me dry but not as warm, and is certainly more hassle to get on and off - and taking a comfort break in choppy conditions in a drysuit is almost impossible!

[willk]

Trevor G - my Fladen is a onesie (pitseáma aonphíosa) from 2008. I've never been cold in it (often too warm) but regularly soaked. It was the best £66 I ever spent. That said, I refuse to oversell it. It is absolutely perfect for farting about in boats, deals with cold, showers and splashes with aplomb. What it can't handle is prolonged rain or heavy splashing. It REALLY can't handle a heavy splash. If sitting in wet conditions, I will be soaked in minutes. I think the water enters via seams, zips, etc. I accept this as a £66 suit thing. However, for long distance cruising in poor conditions, I'd prefer a good self don dry suit with lots of pockets and flaps and a decent "con zip", for quick piddles.

A note to light drysuit users - you CAN wear a raincoat/jacket over the top.

[Trevor G]

Originally Posted by willk

Trevor G - my Fladen is a onesie (pitseáma aonphíosa) from 2008. I've never been cold in it (often too warm) but regularly soaked. It was the best £66 I ever spent. That said, I refuse to oversell it. It is absolutely perfect for farting about in boats, deals with cold, showers and splashes with aplomb. What it can't handle is prolonged rain or heavy splashing. It REALLY can't handle a heavy splash. If sitting in wet conditions, I will be soaked in minutes. I think the water enters via seams, zips, etc. I accept this as a £66 suit thing. However, for long distance cruising in poor conditions, I'd prefer a good self don dry suit with lots of pockets and flaps and a decent "con zip", for quick piddles.

Hi Wilk
Maybe it's a onesie thing regarding waterproofness! We also have one piece "breathable" MarinePool floatation suits for Mrs G and the kids - and they too also leak in very wet weather - whilst the two piece Fladen seems to be much more water proof. Maybe because the salopet trousers give you an extra layer on the front? I've not as yet had any problems with the water coming through the suit - just down any gaps left exposed.
That said - for summer wear the Fladen is just too warm!

If I were out on my own in rubbish weather - like you I'd prefer to have a good drysuit on - but it's taken me 7 years to swallow the cost!
Trev