Bit of a legal question...

[HughN]

My parents keep a launching trolley hidden out of sight (in dense hydrangeas) and chained to a stake. It gets used twice a year. When they came to use it today it was missing.

Rumours suggest a launching trolley had been on some hard-standing along the road with 'please remove' written in washed-out biro on a soggy piece of A4 attached to the trolley.

Yes, it was their launching trolley but after a few weeks the owner of the hard standing sold it at a car boot sale (for naff-all). It obviously wasn't stolen by him (more like someone 'borrowed it' but one scrappy bit of paper doesn't seem a 'reasonable' attempt to track down the owner.

He knew it wasn't his and effectively deprived the owner of its use by selling it without making 'reasonable' efforts to do so - any ideas where my parents stand?

Even if they had spotted its absence earlier and reported it to the Police, the other party hadn't reported it, so 2 and 2 wouldn't have added up...

[whisper]

Sorry dude, did they have permission to leave it there?

[HughN]

Nope.

The person who left it there didn't have permission to do so.
The person who left it there didn't have permission to remove it from my parents property in the first place.

[whisper]

So your parents leave it on their own property?

[treerat]

Originally Posted by HughN

Nope.

The person who left it there didn't have permission to do so.
The person who left it there didn't have permission to remove it from my parents property in the first place.

But did the parents have permission to leave it in the undergrowth in the first place?

[HughN]

Originally Posted by treerat

But did the parents have permission to leave it in the undergrowth in the first place?

Yes. sorry - unclear on my part. It was originally hidden / locked on their property. Someone nicked it, left it on someone else's property who, after a few weeks, flogged it.

The soggy bit of paper was on a private road, facing away from the proper road and therefore all but invisible.

It had been used twice so "brand new" - not a rubbishy old rust pile that might have been abandoned.

[whisper]

It was stolen at the point when it was removed from your parents property so therefore you should contact the police and report it stolen and tell them the rest of the story and let them advise you on what to do next.

If it was covered by insurance then I would try and claim for it.

With regards to the guy who sold it, he should have reported it to the police when it was dumped.

How much was it worth?

[HughN]

Originally Posted by whisper

It was stolen at the point when it was removed from your parents property so therefore you should contact the police and report it stolen and tell them the rest of the story and let them advise you on what to do next.

If it was covered by insurance then I would try and claim for it.

With regards to the guy who sold it, he should have reported it to the police when it was dumped.

How much was it worth?

£250 new, so £130 or so (?). It is a bit of a unexpected bonus if something saleable gets left out for you by the 'trolley fairies!'

[thomas]

Go and see the police, they'll tell you like it is.

In my opinion, as it was stolen from their land then the owner of the slipway was dealing in stolen goods, simple as that.

[kerny]

Originally Posted by whisper

With regards to the guy who sold it, he should have reported it to the police when it was dumped.

Thats exactly what he should have done, so in my opinion, he is liable.

[matt h]

I picked up a lovely little launch trolley whilst in Sussex last week, If you want it .. £129.99??

[HughN]

Originally Posted by matt h

I picked up a lovely little launch trolley whilst in Sussex last week, If you want it .. £129.99??

[ShinyShoe]

I know you cant believe whats written on Wiki but often worth a look...

Lost, mislaid, and abandoned property - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In my completely unlegal opinion it would be classed as mislaid.

Would need a court to define reasonable time. But if the owner 'assumed' you knew it was there rather than it being stollen and dumped he would assume you'd come back for it at some point and I'd say 28 days is more than reasonable..

[Poly]

https://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q441.htm

[HughN]

Originally Posted by ShinyShoe

I know you cant believe whats written on Wiki but often worth a look...

Lost, mislaid, and abandoned property - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In my completely unlegal opinion it would be classed as mislaid.

Would need a court to define reasonable time. But if the owner 'assumed' you knew it was there rather than it being stollen and dumped he would assume you'd come back for it at some point and I'd say 28 days is more than reasonable..

My parents "don't want to make a fuss", but I might!

Unfortunately (for him, maybe), he can't identify when it "arrived". The best way to record someone leaving something expensive on your property is, I would suggest, reporting it as 'found' to the Police.

Apart from his 'advert' being washed-out biro on a soggy bit of paper it faced his house on a private road, facing away from the actual road that runs parallel.

"When, exactly, did this item arrive?"
"Can you prove this unambiguously?"
"Did you report it as a found item?"
"Why not?"
"What steps did you take to find the owner?"
"Did you ask locally?"
"Did you place a notice?"
"...highly visible?"
"...placed so as to give the widest possible potential audience?"

Would make a good scam: move something, put a little label on it and after 28 days flog it!

[HughN]

Originally Posted by Poly

https://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q441.htm

If they class it as a car, they'll also want tax and MoT details!

I now believe (hope) that in this case the Police will be getting further involved...

Watch this space. But don't hold your breath.

[SPR]

http://www.rya.org.uk/SiteCollection...20TRAILERS.pdf

I know this is for clubs but...

S.

[Poly]

Hugh, your parents may be wiser than you. Often the only thing making a fuss achieves is giving you high blood pressure! It almost certainly wont endear the police to helping you (although I suspect this is just the sort of nightmare case than no bobby wants to waste his shift pushing the paperwork for). If you really get carried away you'll end up in a heated argument with a breach of the peace or assault charge!

Bear in mind that they also presumably have to live close to this guy? £130-250 is both a lot of money and not a lot of money (if that doesn't sound too daft) - is it really worth hysterics over with the guy who just had it dumped on his land? It is certainly not worth the cost of pursuing legal action against him - as I suspect you(r parents) would only get the amount he sold it for at the boot sale at best. In theory successful claims are "free" but in reality they take time, travelling to court, and a whole load of stress.

[Poly]

Originally Posted by HughN

If they class it as a car, they'll also want tax and MoT details!

Trailers are vehicles - there is stuff out there on abandoned vehicles which includes trailers (caravans most likely). Technically it may not be a trailer but I think it establishes the principle - the only difference is with vehicles the last registered keeper is usually easier to determine.

[colcreate]

Seems straight forward if your parents can identify the trailer photo/ serial number and prove/claim ownership then they should report the theft to the police. They can also make a statement that the other land owner acquired it by means unknown and has effectively sold or disposed of stolen property. He is then liable to prosecution for handling stolen goods and/or possibly, aiding and abetting, councilling and procuring of a criminal act. Or something like that I can't remember all the exact words.
His defence does not seem to stand upto the scrutiny of a reasonable person which is the way in which county courts look at these things. If the goods cannot be recovered from the buyer then the seller is bound to make restitution to your parents.