Complicated remote camera question

Tim M · 16 January 2010, 12:02

Heres the problem:
We want to mount some sort of camera on the lightship so that when we go past in the RIB with punters on board, a camera will take a photo which will then be beamed back to the kiosk (in Gunwharf) which can be printed as a souvenir. We also want the facility to be able to take a photo of any boat (with the Spinnaker tower and Gunwharf in the background it makes a nice shot) which can be uploaded onto a website for purchase.

Obviously the images need to be decent quality. The idea would be in principle that the person working in the kiosk can view the feed from the camera in real time so he or she can hit the "take photo button" to get the shot at the right moment. It would then need to be automatically uploaded or sent somewhere so they can download it and print it off.

Has anyone got any thoughts about how we can achieve this? I'm baffled!

C2 RIBS · 16 January 2010, 12:08

Tim I am not technical for this but I have the remote camera head cam which takes images on the boat. Another colleague has spent near on £20,000 to gain a 360 remote facility on board recently. I hope someone can give you a good idea as we would use it. The other cheaper is a cameraman / woman taking shots but that could be a ,long day

Steve_B · 16 January 2010, 12:14

I would use someone who already works on the lightship. Give them a camera and pay them for every shot you use. Got to be cheaper than £20,000. You or the Kiosk can give them a "heads up" call before you leave or enter port.

Someone using a camera correctly will always produce better shots than any remote will.

Steve

Poly · 16 January 2010, 12:21

Tim,

How busy is the person in the kiosk? I wonder how likely they are to capture the right moment? I wonder if you need a solution which is automated in some way?

I'm guessing you are looking at relatively small pictures (6x4 - 7x5 - 8x6?) rather than poster size? That makes a difference to the camera requirement - but I guess you need to think in terms of 'zoom' also i.e. you want the boat and towers etc. all in the frame. You can probably work it so your drivers are in the right place for the money shot - not sure it will be so easy with random passers by.

What are your options for "feeding" the data from the camera - wireless? or 3G (with speed/data cost implications). What power have you got available? And can you enclose it all from the elements / security - or are you looking for a package that does that too?

Tim M · 16 January 2010, 12:23

Ian, what sort of remote camera thing have you got?

If it's going to be seriously expensive we won't do it. Originally I thought about just getting someone to take a photo next to the pontoon as we're leaving, then the lightship idea came along.....

Using the lightship staff isn't really an option as they won't have time to take photos and email them over to the kiosk every half an hour on a summer's day when they're supposed to be serving customers.

chewy · 16 January 2010, 12:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim M

Using the lightship staff isn't really an option as they won't have time to take photos and email them over to the kiosk every half an hour on a summer's day when they're supposed to be serving customers.

I know just the man for this job.

Tim M · 16 January 2010, 12:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

Tim,

How busy is the person in the kiosk? I wonder how likely they are to capture the right moment? I wonder if you need a solution which is automated in some way?

I'm guessing you are looking at relatively small pictures (6x4 - 7x5 - 8x6?) rather than poster size? That makes a difference to the camera requirement - but I guess you need to think in terms of 'zoom' also i.e. you want the boat and towers etc. all in the frame. You can probably work it so your drivers are in the right place for the money shot - not sure it will be so easy with random passers by.

What are your options for "feeding" the data from the camera - wireless? or 3G (with speed/data cost implications). What power have you got available? And can you enclose it all from the elements / security - or are you looking for a package that does that too?

Doesn't need to be huge resolution. We've got mains electricity and broadband in both locations. Security isn't an issue, but it does need to be waterproof obviously.

I have a feeling this isn't going to be possible, on a budget at least!

Tim M · 16 January 2010, 12:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by chewy

I know just the man for this job.

Who's that then?

chewy · 16 January 2010, 12:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim M

Who's that then?

JSP, he'll sit down there and click away.

Poly · 16 January 2010, 12:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim M

Doesn't need to be huge resolution. We've got mains electricity and broadband in both locations. Security isn't an issue, but it does need to be waterproof obviously.

I have a feeling this isn't going to be possible, on a budget at least!

Tim, I think it might be! One more question - How far away is the boat from the light ship...

People are doing remote photography for wildlife stuff - which is not disimilar. See here: http://ohioline.osu.edu/w-fact/pdf/0021.pdf for an idea.

Hightower · 16 January 2010, 12:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by chewy

JSP, he'll sit down there and click away.

You could feed him with regular trips out

On a more serious note.

I doubt that a Photo taken from the lightship would be practical anyway. You wouldn't be able to get the Spinaker tower into the shot and still encompass a big enough shot of your charter to identify the people on board. I wouldn't buy a generic looking photo if I couldn't see myself or my friends and family on your RIB. I just think that it would be too complicated and expensive to do.

A much more practical way would be to have a bullet cam on an extendable pole mounted on your RIB with a monitor on the console and do it that way. That way you could move the bullet cam around the RIB to get some Video footage too. Imagine how cool a video would look like with the cam set 5' in front of the bow looking back!

C2 RIBS · 16 January 2010, 13:01

Tim I have the Go Pro head cam system that is attached to A frame of or consul which holds an hour of image on video or takes still in batches of three. Battery run and you would probably need to down load on each return but if you bought 2 or 3 cards this would do it, Also waterproof. A few vids have been posted before by othes with it. Not sure I have the hang of Vids yet but stills work
If you look at the following link there are loads of attachments on right of first page
http://www.goprocamera.com/index.php?area=2&productid=1

slimtim · 16 January 2010, 13:52

Tim, this is a pretty big undertaking I think and would require a fair amount of research. Hightower has made a very good point about not being able to identify people.

For remote use:
I THINK some high end nikon DSLRs like the D300 and above (ones with live view) have the ability to control them from a computer and download images directly to the hard drive. Its a system used in many photographic studios. Nikon sell a wireless adaptor for the high end DLSRs but you would need to sell at least one kidney to pay for the equipment. Controlling it over broadband could be a problem. One solution might be to set up a webcam on top of the camera that shows roughly the same frame coverage as the DSLR. That can be easily set up to view over broadband I'm sure and then the camera just needs a remote shutter and download facility. To be honest, I think it'll be a waste of time.

The best thing would be to have an on board camera that you use throughout the day. Buy a cheap Nikon DSLR, a D50 or something and the Nikon 10.5mm fisheye lens (lens is about £500 though) or a wide angle. Shoot in JPEG then upload straight away when you return so customers can view the picture immediately.

Let me know if you ever need a photographer

EDIT: come to think of it, the computer thing with the nikon cameras may only be for downloading the images and not for remote controlling.

Poly · 16 January 2010, 14:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by slimtim

The best thing would be to have an on board camera that you use throughout the day. Buy a cheap Nikon DSLR, a D50 or something and the Nikon 10.5mm fisheye lens (lens is about £500 though) or a wide angle. Shoot in JPEG then upload straight away when you return so customers can view the picture immediately.

Realistically though that means the skipper or crew need to bring the camera up to the office, plug it in and upload the images every time the boat gets back ashore. If I understand Tim's business model its about getting as many people out as quickly as possible. At peak periods I am guessing his crew are trying to turnaround the boat with ryanair efficiency! Also having once been sucked into buying a picture like this on impulse from a roller coaster - you really want the picture(s) on display as they walk off the boat/pontoon - not people standing around for 2-3 minutes while you upload them from camera, that gives people too long for rational thought to take over and think £6 for a postcard your taking the piss! But as you say you do need faces to be recognisable.

Channel Ribs · 16 January 2010, 15:32

I helped set up the remote Puffin Cam here last year, it did something similar to what you want: Live preview in compressed video, with the option to remotely control pan and zoom from anywhere on the net; then you click capture and get a hi res still saved to an ftp folder for you to print etc.

I am sorry to say that it was pricey, but it was also self powered.

The camera came from Sesys...

If you contact them please mention Alderney Marine.

http://www.sesys.co.uk/

SPR · 16 January 2010, 16:21

Axis IP security cameras, and the correct software. If recording all the time they save montion jpegs ie a pic every x fps.

Regards

S.

Sonar · 17 January 2010, 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim M

Heres the problem:
We want to mount some sort of camera on the lightship so that when we go past in the RIB with punters on board, a camera will take a photo which will then be beamed back to the kiosk (in Gunwharf) which can be printed as a souvenir. We also want the facility to be able to take a photo of any boat (with the Spinnaker tower and Gunwharf in the background it makes a nice shot) which can be uploaded onto a website for purchase.

Obviously the images need to be decent quality. The idea would be in principle that the person working in the kiosk can view the feed from the camera in real time so he or she can hit the "take photo button" to get the shot at the right moment. It would then need to be automatically uploaded or sent somewhere so they can download it and print it off.

Has anyone got any thoughts about how we can achieve this? I'm baffled!

Well Sorry to say I know nothing about this subject.

However I know what I would like to have in the form of photographs for what would be a great day out.

I would like to have pics of the boat in action crashing through the waves Turning and a photo of the vessel near out the water. and of course a pic of me enjoying the day.

And I would have thought a small rib and a photographer at a predetermined spot would do the trick as a temp thing.

A small rib racing by the side would take some I am sure fantastic shots.
A few trips around the boat in the small rib would be able to take pictures of all on the boat.

The small boat would be in a position that NO fixed camera could be.

after all we all like to wave to a camera.

Tim M · 17 January 2010, 19:02

Sonar. I totally agree; someone in another boat would definitely be the best solution. However the idea of doing photos is to generate an extra bit of easy cash. If I have to start paying a competent boat driver/photographer to keep razzing in and out of the harbour to take photos and print them out it's going to cost me a fortune in wages and fuel!

At this stage I'm tempted to give them a nice stock photo of the boat crashing along with a pic of them sat in the boat leaving the marina. A fiver a go?

Sonar · 17 January 2010, 19:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim M

Sonar. I totally agree; someone in another boat would definitely be the best solution. However the idea of doing photos is to generate an extra bit of easy cash. If I have to start paying a competent boat driver/photographer to keep razzing in and out of the harbour to take photos and print them out it's going to cost me a fortune in wages and fuel!

At this stage I'm tempted to give them a nice stock photo of the boat crashing along with a pic of them sat in the boat leaving the marina. A fiver a go?

Yes I see what you mean.
a nice stock photo and as you say and a pic in the boat prior to setting out would be still a good memory of the day.

and for £ 5.00 i would pay it .

Jimbo · 17 January 2010, 19:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim M

At this stage I'm tempted to give them a nice stock photo of the boat crashing

Shouldn't do that, might give them the wrong impression.

Seriously though - I think the way forward would be a high res video camera targetted on the "frame" you want, that snaps a shot at a pre determined interval. You'd have a lot of photos of the course of a day - but knowing what time you go out it would be relatively easy for your kiosk staff to locate the relevant ones.

Not sure if this has data protection issues though?