Ground Source Heat Pumps

Chris · 16 January 2011, 21:08

Anyone got one or do you all just burn 50:1 premix in a barrel to heat your houses

Erin · 16 January 2011, 21:15

I think air source are probably now the better way forward for your average heating requirements, unless you've already got a huge trench in your garden and you don't know what to put in it.

I saw a house the other day with air source heat pump and solar water panels combined into one system. Smart idea.

Siochair · 16 January 2011, 23:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erin

I think air source are probably now the better way forward.

Unfortunately it seems that air source pumps are only good above a certain temperature with their efficiency dropping dramatically once the air temp is below a certain point.

Mollers · 17 January 2011, 08:16

Done the maths with builder and architect, forget it. Look at solar, pv, biomass, mechanical heat recovery .

Erin · 17 January 2011, 15:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siochair

Unfortunately it seems that air source pumps are only good above a certain temperature with their efficiency dropping dramatically once the air temp is below a certain point.

Ah yes, quite possibly. I was viewing it from the persepctive of our local temperate climate in the Channel Islands

. 1kW of running cost for 3.5kW of heat output.

Channel Ribs · 17 January 2011, 15:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erin

Ah yes, quite possibly. I was viewing it from the persepctive of our local temperate climate in the Channel Islands

. 1kW of running cost for 3.5kW of heat output.

A friend of ours has one and finds that it works ok in said climate, but the recent cold snap was more than it could possibly cope with.

Siochair · 17 January 2011, 15:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erin

I was viewing it from the persepctive of our local temperate climate in the Channel Islands

.

Grrr!!!

In that case I imagine it will be fine for most of the year but you will need a more appropriate alternative during really cold weather.

Maximus · 17 January 2011, 16:25

Can put you in touch with a friend in France mate, real 'Techy'...RESEARCHED like you would'nt believe,spent Thousands,tore up lovely Paddock,took forever,...In the end Bought Wood burning boiler to suppliment the thing!! Great Blurb,F***ing CR**P IN THE REAL WORLD.

C-NUMB · 17 January 2011, 21:56

Think there are 2 different main types of Ground Source Heat pumps, the one where the collector is close to surface(on a large area) and the second one were a hole is drilled to 100-150 m depth and the collector is lowered down there. Believe the later one is the more efficient one and very popular in Scandinavia. Downside is high initial costs and You also need to have water based heating system(floor or radiator heating) increasing the costs further. What I heard from my neighbours, its working well, despite the fact that further heating (electricity) is need during coldest time of the year. In Sweden think the number of installed system is more than 250 000 units, can't be all crap. But You need to hit the hard stuff to get it working well, so it depends on the soil down under.

The newest trend is to build houses isolated so well that they are based on passive heating(technically no external heat source regularly in use, but isolation is huge). But moisture might be a issue(?) time will tell.

I have neither, as this area is connected to district heating(cooling water from a power plant some 20 km from here) so we just have e heat exchanger in the garage and piping from there to the house. That's also why we have floor heating in the garage

that would be normally considered insane....

Mollers · 17 January 2011, 21:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maximus

In the end Bought Wood burning boiler to suppliment the thing!! Great Blurb,F***ing CR**P IN THE REAL WORLD.

Yep, we're going wood biomass with a bit of solar.

Mollers · 17 January 2011, 22:01

As far as it's been explained to me by those that know.

The amount of elec required to transfer and compress the heat to produce anything that's of use, virtually negates any gain.

captnjack · 18 January 2011, 01:30

We have what you'd call an air source heat pump. Works fine here (Seattle area); the supplemental electric element only comes on a few times a year.

hank · 18 January 2011, 03:10

I just installed a 5 ton McQuay ground source heat pump in our house.
So far it has been working very well in our house and greenhouse in British Columbia coast area.
Water temperature going in is 47*F and and leaving 39*F with a 70*F heat output. I also have a wood furnace but don't seem to need it.
Nice being warm with out all the work packing wood.
hank

spartacus · 21 January 2011, 09:19

We're considering installing a wood-pellet boiler with solar panels too. I hate being held to ransom by the oil companies, as the price of kerosene goes up continually.

Poly · 21 January 2011, 09:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by spartacus

We're considering installing a wood-pellet boiler with solar panels too. I hate being held to ransom by the oil companies, as the price of kerosene goes up continually.

How much access do you have to pelletted wood? it strikes me that almost everyone I speak to is looking at woodburners and pellet fired boilers (either as "eco bling", lower cost, or whatever). If this is someone's main source if heating it will need a lot of wood - which if everyone goes over to that route the "wood pellet people" will respond to market forces and hold you to ransom instead (unless you have your own wood and the time and inclination to harvest, dry, pellet etc yourself). I wouldn't be surprised to see the local kerosene suppliers becoming the dominant supplier in wood either!

chewy · 21 January 2011, 09:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

How much access do you have to pelletted wood? it strikes me that almost everyone I speak to is looking at woodburners and pellet fired boilers (either as "eco bling", lower cost, or whatever). If this is someone's main source if heating it will need a lot of wood - which if everyone goes over to that route the "wood pellet people" will respond to market forces and hold you to ransom instead (unless you have your own wood and the time and inclination to harvest, dry, pellet etc yourself). I wouldn't be surprised to see the local kerosene suppliers becoming the dominant supplier in wood either!

I don't have a pellet woodburner, just a bog standard burn what you want one, as do my parents.
Part of the reason for my parents getting a woodburner was when you come to sell the house and have to produce gas/electric bills it will be significantly less as all the wood is bought cash and cheap at that.

Channel Ribs · 21 January 2011, 10:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by spartacus

I hate being held to ransom by the oil companies, as the price of kerosene goes up continually.

Wait and see what this year brings, if you think it has been bad so far.

I so hope to be proved wrong.

Erin · 21 January 2011, 11:46

Pity there's no oil reserves under that seabed you own

Solar heating has got to be the best option. Accepting the fact that it may need to be supplemented by some other fuel, at least when it is working it is practically free (or totally if on a gravity system)

spartacus · 22 January 2011, 10:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

How much access do you have to pelletted wood? it strikes me that almost everyone I speak to is looking at woodburners and pellet fired boilers (either as "eco bling", lower cost, or whatever). If this is someone's main source if heating it will need a lot of wood - which if everyone goes over to that route the "wood pellet people" will respond to market forces and hold you to ransom instead (unless you have your own wood and the time and inclination to harvest, dry, pellet etc yourself). I wouldn't be surprised to see the local kerosene suppliers becoming the dominant supplier in wood either!

Pellets. Good question. There are two suppliers in the Aberdeenshire area, either in Laurencekirk or Forres. More details here (for UK): http://www.nef.org.uk/logpile/fuelsu...s.asp?offset=0

The house and boiler is now 12 years old, and the oil-fired boiler is original. When we first moved here, kerosene was roughly 18p a litre. It's now over 59p a litre and climbing. The boiler engineer said it's efficient enough, but new boiler technology is better, and to start thinking of a replacement.

I thought the Scottish government was still providing incentive schemes for alternative heat/power, but after a quick check, it looks like the scheme closed last summer! Of course if I'd been a pikey with kids (not unlike a scene from Oliver Twist) I'd probably still qualify!

According to the Energy Saving Trust website, a wood pellet boiler for the average detached house (including automatic feed hopper) costs £11,500! That includes installation, flue, etc...

I did notice there could be a new scheme to encourage switching to non-fossil fuels from summer 2011. It will no doubt be over-subscribed, so I'm planning to do the research now.
http://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/...Heat-Incentive

spartacus · 22 January 2011, 10:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by malthouse

Wait and see what this year brings, if you think it has been bad so far.

I so hope to be proved wrong.

Exactly. The fuel duty regulator isn't likely to happen, and there's a further price rice due in April. The treasury simply can't afford to lose the revenue it makes, given the demands on national and local government.

Thought paying £65 for diesel was bad, spare a thought for the owner of this Bugatti Veyron! http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...l-station.html