Taking your Kids out of School outside Official Holiday Time

Biggles · 22 May 2007, 18:37

I'm looking for some advice from those good with words. I'd like to take my daughter out of school one week before her normal Half Term time during the skiing season next year so I can pay normal prices for a holiday and not get ripped off.
Has anyone got any excellent letters they have written to get the time off. Apparently my daughters school is run by a bit of a battle axe who is very much against taking kids out of school during normal school time.
Any words of wisdom would be appreciated.

vince · 22 May 2007, 18:43

Could say :"the PE lessons at this school are woefully inadequate, so she`s going skiing to make up for it" or will that make the HT more angry?

Ian M · 22 May 2007, 18:46

Nick,
When we have done this (between you and me reasonably often!) we have always gone along in person to ask. We have found that it is much harder to deny someone face to face than it is to be negative to a somewhat impersonal letter.

Biggles · 22 May 2007, 18:49

Thats the route I was thinking of going down. Do you think it would be reasonable if I went down now for time off next february ?

MikeCC · 22 May 2007, 19:28

Nick,

The rule of thumb is 10 days authorised absence per school year. If you take this in one chunk you need a pretty good reason but 5 days out should be OK.

As Vince says, a sesible purpose will help ie not just sunning your backside.

If you want to be really creepy you can ask what they'll be covering that week and get some worksheets to take with you. Most teachers will say "don't worry, they can catch up later"

Also, it depends on how you and your daughter are viewed by the school. I'd have you down as someone with a reasonable take on getting homework done etc so as long as your daughter's doing OK, that's another plus point.

Ultimately it is at the head's discretion and if you take it without a rubber stamp, no doubt a few choice comments from the head. (And possibly contact from the EWO . . . but unlikely for a one-off)

The arrangement at our local junior's is just fill in the form and hand it in. It's worth a call to the school first, but I wouldn't make a appointment to do it - head's are too busy. Timing wise, just do it before you need to commit for the booking.

Cheers

Mike

codprawn · 22 May 2007, 19:29

Tell her you have lined up a trip to visit a glacier with a climatologist so that the kids will learning about climate change - that should impress her cos it's educational.....

Ian M · 22 May 2007, 19:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biggles

Thats the route I was thinking of going down. Do you think it would be reasonable if I went down now for time off next february ?

Nick,
Think I would wait for a bit, let them get the hassle of the summer holidays out of the way first!

Poly · 22 May 2007, 20:00

Or they could just be sick ?

Nasher · 22 May 2007, 20:05

Though I do understand about the cost of holidays etc, I have a problem with taking kids out of school during term time, I just dont think its justified to save a few quid, just me being old fashioned.

I understand this will set me apart from the majority, and I will probably get some stick over it, but my kids education is very important to me and we all have our own views. In other words I don't want to fall out with anyone over something I know I have strong views about and that others may not feel the same way about.

Nasher

Biggles · 22 May 2007, 20:25

Thats fair enough. I've never done it before. The eldest went through education without doing so. But then I did low budget self catering type holidays. Now I'm trying to catch up with everyone else and jump on board the cheap package holidays.
Anyway I thought the government was supposed to be stopping the practice of the Travel companies hiking prices. Or maybe school holidays could be staggered.

And I would have totally agreed with you 100 % but we have even had the report of a teacher go outside holiday time to get a better deal. Somethings wrong somewhere.

Biggles · 22 May 2007, 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nasher

Though I do understand about the cost of holidays etc, I have a problem with taking kids out of school during term time, I just dont think its justified to save a few quid, just me being old fashioned.

Nasher

Its not a few quid though. For the skiing trips the cost nearly doubles.

vince · 22 May 2007, 20:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nasher

Though I do understand about the cost of holidays etc, I have a problem with taking kids out of school during term time, I just dont think its justified to save a few quid, just me being old fashioned.

I understand this will set me apart from the majority, and I will probably get some stick over it, but my kids education is very important to me and we all have our own views. In other words I don't want to fall out with anyone over something I know I have strong views about and that others may not feel the same way about.

Nasher

I agree, you dont get much of a second chance with an education, so it is an important time for kids. At the same time, if the children are still fairly young, ie not doing important exams or taking options etc, then 5 days off isnt going to harm them really. Also, this 10 days absence deal from the government, is designed to stop all the "habitual" skivers that have no reason at all to not go to school. In my experience, my girls have not had a problem with our annual ski trip and getting time off, but then they are never usually off, and do very well at school. My eldest will be 14 next year, so probably wont bother going skiing next season as she is now probably at the most important stage of school life. But then, what works for one might not for someone else....

codprawn · 22 May 2007, 20:59

Travel broadens the mind and it's true - kids often learn far more out of school than they do in it.

I am a firm believer in education being the main responsibility of the parent - not the school.

I always had it drummed into me how important academic qualifications were - now I am not so sure. I achieved a very good degree but it hasn't been of much use. These days degrees are 10 a penny.

The most successful people I know aren't that bright - in fact one of them can barely read and write and yet he is worth in excess of £50 million!!!

Hightower · 22 May 2007, 21:46

I think you'll find Nick that schools have slightly different policies for authorised/unautherised absence.

My Daughters School allows 10 days authorised but you can go over this, it's just that a black mark is put against every day she's off after this period. This can be used against you if it is deemed by the authroities that her education is suffering.

I have also heard that some schools have a zero tolerance policy when it comes to time off, these have probably come into effect because of parents misuse of the system.

Go see your kids school and ask in person, I'm sure they'll listen and it'll be OK

The Jackeens · 22 May 2007, 21:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hightower

Go see your kids school and ask in person, I'm sure they'll listen and it'll be OK

Agree with this advice. Best to work with school Nick and if your children's attendance is already excellent you should receive a reasonable response.

(Nash has also made a good point tho'. The regs are there to help ensure children don't miss out.)

Hope all goes well (the travel companies really do take advantage at times).

Kathleen

Poly · 22 May 2007, 22:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Jackeens

the travel companies really do take advantage at times

thats capatalism for you - and the laws of supply and demand...

...I would agree with the arguments for not taking children out of school - but they will be learning to ski...

Jimbo · 22 May 2007, 23:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nasher

Though I do understand about the cost of holidays etc, I have a problem with taking kids out of school during term time, I just dont think its justified to save a few quid, just me being old fashioned.

I have to say I agree with you there Nasher. Climbing onto my high horse, over 7 years of secondary school I only ever took 8 days off, with 3 due to illness, 2 due to such bad weather I couldn't get in, and 3 to visit uni open days. When I worked in the school, it became clear that the number of parents that took their kids out for trips/holidays caused a huge amount of hassle for the teachers, who are, at the end of the day, trying to deliver a consistent standard of education. It's alright to say "oh, but just the one kid is ok", but with 20 parents saying that, it becomes a problem.

I appreciate I may be joining Nasher in the minority here, but my reasoning is two fold - one, I made the effort for 7 years, and two, it does cause a problem in the delivery of education, which is, after all, what you go to school for.

Biggles · 23 May 2007, 00:05

Its obviously a problem. And if we RIBNET members see it as such why haven't our wonderful all seeing, all knowing government sorted it out. Its wouldn't take the brains of a Rocket Engineer to sort this little problem out. As I said earlier the government were looking at doing something about it but to date haven't done so. I certainly wouldn't take my kids out when its exam time but once or twice during their whole school time doesn't need to be that much of a problem. Along with all the days they lose for Teacher training (We never used to have that), Elections, a little bit of snow, its the day before the end of term so we won't do anything anyway days etc. I don't really see another 4 days chosen wisely as a great problem. Unlike me my kids have a great sick record.
All I can do is ask.

Aidan · 23 May 2007, 00:22

Never mind all that auld bollux, just book the holiday and do it.
Do not tell anyone outside friends and family.

Do not tell the Battle axe cos its my understanding that the law is the law and she cannot give you permission. SHe can only deny your request. Thus if you ask, she cannot agree to it without breaking the law too.

Unless youar seriously comprimised (such as being a local Super in the police or if you happen to be a Minister for Edu etc, then tell no one and do it.

I did it last year (with absolutely no regard to such laws, they are my children and I am ultimately responsible for them along with my wife who happened to agree with me and that is rare enough!!), we went to the USA and had a brilliant time. It was the best family holiday and fantastic for all teh kids confidence. Having been toboth Europe and USA I would recommend without any shadow of a doubt the USA. The quality of service they provide is second to none for starters and learners. They actually put the effort into the service where you feel they appreciate you really learning the sport (their sport).

We went to Killington Vermont and didnt leave the place. We had great value with an all in (not meals). I would not call it cheap but my friend spent as much on a shitty trip to Bulgaria.

E-mail me if you want more detail. PS the school didnt care as they know that we (especially/more so my wife) are fussy enough about having them always in school, as in those laws are really designed to protect the education of the child and to know where they are of Kids already known to several State agencies. That is just my opinion.

As someone said already" take a sickie" do not go teh honest route or she will have to report you if she is expected to have such knowledge...
Honesty is the best policy as in Honestly dont tell her!!!!! Good lucj with it, it is worth it. My lads age at the time ranged from 7-16 and the schools over there catered fully for their training and safety

tcwozere · 23 May 2007, 01:29

We used to when the girls were younger, (Junior school age, 1st year Seniors,) after checking with the school with regard to exam time, or SAT's, or anything else the school was planning.. If you show consideration when asking Biggles, the Head Teacher should really show you the same back.. (Although requests at the senior school went through Head of Year..)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aidan

Do not tell the Battle axe cos its my understanding that the law is the law and she cannot give you permission. SHe can only deny your request. Thus if you ask, she cannot agree to it without breaking the law too.

pssst Aidan, you may not have realised it by now, but your laws differ greatly to our laws, being a foreign country an' all that..

As an aside Biggles, if you did take her out saying she was sick, sods law dictates something will happen on holiday that will filter back to the School..