Yet again, another vote for madness. - Page 2

eupa · 27 October 2005, 07:18

By the way - remind me of the heroic Belgian and French stand in 1939... or was it less of a stand and more of a lie down and take it?

Neither- more a run, skip and jump!!!!!!!!!!

Jonathan

eupa · 27 October 2005, 07:27

Been out of the UK for 40 years just about sums it up.....

I know Codders-- but what a fanatstic 40 years!!!!!
Was back in Dover on Tuesday...... Wont say anymore.. might upset a few
little islanders-- and you could not hope to meet anybody more patriotic than me

Jonathan

Jono · 27 October 2005, 08:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate

. Japanese stereo,TV and computer. German drill, sander and router in my toolshed. ......German touring motorcycle

You might want to check the "made in" label on some of those japanese products more carefully....

and what model "German touring Motorcycle" do you own? That's far more interesting than boaty talk....

hard1 · 27 October 2005, 12:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

I see so if a member of the public phones in with something it MUST be true???

At the end of the day those two policemen KILLED an innocent man - it was THEY who pulled the triggers - THEY were to blame!!! Not a lack of training or anything else!!!

Obviously I don't think they intended to kill an innocent man - they made a mistake - an accident - there IS a term used for that - it's called manslaughter!!!

Similar case with that so called terrorist killed on the tube - the bloke running away with the bulk jacket who must have been a suicide bomber!!!

Isn't it strange that since they have banned handguns there are more and more Police carrying firearms?

Since 1982 there have been 4 Police officers killed by guns in the UK - do those figures REALLY warrent more and more of them carrying guns???

There speaks a man who has never faced a gun in a shopping bag. Plastic shopping bags are a common way to carry and/or conceal a gun for several reasons. Firstly they can be fired with the hand outside the bag thus not transferring the kind of forensic evidence required for a gun crime conviction. Secondly the bag will catch an ejected cartridge, again denying forensic examination and a link to a specific firearm. Thirdly, most people wouldn't react if a Tesco shopping bag was waved at them - seeing no threat. The police know this well. Another thing to consider Codders, is that gun crime in the UK has reached epidemic proportions. There are literally thousands of gun incidents in every major city. It largely goes unreported because the incidents are mainly black on black and the media are not interested in reporting this. I would ask you to consider what is is like to be either threatened with a firearm in a place you would consider yourself safe and in control and being actually shot by a firearm in similar circumstances (I have unfortunate experiences with both scenarios by the way) and then pause for a moment and think what it would be like to face this threat day after day as many of our Police Officers do.

Lastly, the case you are referring to is a classic case of 'Suicide by Cop' a well known phemonena in the USA and sadly on the increase here.

codprawn · 27 October 2005, 13:31

Having lived in Beirut amongst other places I have faced a few more nasties than just guns - we actually had wire mesh on the windows to stop hand granades!!!

The massive increases in firearms use is MAINLY down to the way it is reported - these days any call involving an airgun or even a waterpistol is regarded as a "firearms incident"!!!

What would YOU think if you saw a 7 yr old boy waving a gun around in the back of a car coming out of a Tesco car park? Personally I would think - "look at that kid with his toy gun" - believe it or not someone was stupid enough to report seeing a boy with a gun and the police surrounded the car with an armed response team!!!

Things like this happen ALL the time these days - even kids with waterpistols are chased by armed police!!!

Some Home Office figures:

"firearms are used in a very small proportion of all recorded crimes (0.17%)"

"Nearly two-thirds of non-air weapon firearm offences occur in just three police force areas – Metropolitan, Greater Manchester and West Midlands."

Deaths from firearms in the Uk account for about 77 deaths per year.

And yet despite this we see more and more Police carrying guns - and not just any old guns either - in Bristol Police have been carrying Steyer AUG assault rifles because the MP5 isn't powerfull enough!!! This is crazy - it is a military weapon - even the USA and South African police don't carry these openly on the streets!!!

I have now seen armed Police officers strutting around with guns on their hips in our local Tesco - in Swansea!!! What a joke!!! When they were called to a fight in a local night club they refused to go in in case someone nicked their guns!!!

As I said earlier - 4 Police officers shot in the UK in the last 30 years - how long will it be before someone grabs a gun off them if they are carrying them around so openly???

Nate · 27 October 2005, 13:45

"Plastic shopping bags are a common way to carry and/or conceal a gun for several reasons. Firstly they can be fired with the hand outside the bag thus not transferring the kind of forensic evidence required for a gun crime conviction. Secondly the bag will catch an ejected cartridge, again denying forensic examination and a link to a specific firearm. Thirdly, most people wouldn't react if a Tesco shopping bag was waved at them - seeing no threat. The police know this well."

Are you seriously suggesting its OK to summarily shoot and kill someone for possession of a Tesco's bag?

You're madder than Codders!!!

codprawn · 27 October 2005, 13:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate

"Plastic shopping bags are a common way to carry and/or conceal a gun for several reasons. Firstly they can be fired with the hand outside the bag thus not transferring the kind of forensic evidence required for a gun crime conviction. Secondly the bag will catch an ejected cartridge, again denying forensic examination and a link to a specific firearm. Thirdly, most people wouldn't react if a Tesco shopping bag was waved at them - seeing no threat. The police know this well."

Are you seriously suggesting its OK to summarily shoot and kill someone for possession of a Tesco's bag?

You're madder than Codders!!!

Hey hang on a minute - I am the maddest bloke in the village!!!

Seriously though you one sentence sums it up perfectly!!!

roycruse · 27 October 2005, 14:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate

Are you seriously suggesting its OK to summarily shoot and kill someone for possession of a Tesco's bag?

Stick to shopping in Sainsburys sounds like a good plan to me.

eupa · 27 October 2005, 14:37

Come on Roy pics of the Rib PLEASE???????
We are now day+1... dont tell us that you did'nt get it??

Jonathan

roycruse · 27 October 2005, 14:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by eupa

Come on Roy pics of the Rib PLEASE???????
We are now day+1... dont tell us that you did'nt get it??

Jonathan

http://www.rib.net/forum/showthread.php?t=11896

Wake up Jonathan

eupa · 27 October 2005, 14:43

I have now seen armed Police officers strutting around with guns on their hips in our local Tesco - in Swansea!!

I always thought Swansea was twinned with Beirut!! now you have confirmed it.Brussels is a sea of tranquility cf Swansea. What were you doing in Beirut?

Jonathan

hard1 · 27 October 2005, 14:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nate

"Plastic shopping bags are a common way to carry and/or conceal a gun for several reasons. Firstly they can be fired with the hand outside the bag thus not transferring the kind of forensic evidence required for a gun crime conviction. Secondly the bag will catch an ejected cartridge, again denying forensic examination and a link to a specific firearm. Thirdly, most people wouldn't react if a Tesco shopping bag was waved at them - seeing no threat. The police know this well."

Are you seriously suggesting its OK to summarily shoot and kill someone for possession of a Tesco's bag?

You're madder than Codders!!!

Funny reply, but I didn't mean that and you know it. Endof.

donutsina911 · 27 October 2005, 15:07

codders, what on earth were you doing in beruit? Your tales get taller as the weeks go past. As for the police having steyr aug rifles in bristol - that is absolute horseshit. Even if this bore any resemblence to the truth, imho give the police the tools to do the job of keeping our streets safe - if this means they carry excocet missile launchers on the back of their panda cars then so be it, as long as they're trained to use the kit and know when is appropriate to use it....

anyone stupid enough to carry anything resembling a gun and / or not respond fairly quickly to a police challenge probably deserves what they get..one of the lefty papers did an analysis of all those who had been shot by armed police in the last few decades - with the obvious unfortunate exceptions (ie london recently) they have nearly all been when the police have been faced with what appears to be a firearms threat......i'm with hard1 on this..

Phil Davies · 27 October 2005, 15:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by donutsina911

codders, what on earth were you doing in beruit?

Codders actually spent his formative years on the Red Sea where, at the tender age of 2, he followed in Moses' footsteps and learned to walk on water, later helming his first RIB at just 3 years old. On leaving primary school, he enlisted with Mossad as a junior secret agent and subsequently saw active service in the Lebanon. Longing for a break from the stresses of combatting international terrorism, he eventually returned to his native Swansea where he was at last able to enjoy a life of anonymity amongst the UK's millions of IT consultants.

Alan · 27 October 2005, 16:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil Davies

Codders actually spent his formative years on the Red Sea where, at the tender age of 2, he followed in Moses' footsteps and learned to walk on water, later helming his first RIB at just 3 years old. On leaving primary school, he enlisted with Mossad as a junior secret agent and subsequently saw active service in the Lebanon. Longing for a break from the stresses of combatting international terrorism, he eventually returned to his native Swansea where he was at last able to enjoy a life of anonymity amongst the UK's millions of IT consultants.

codprawn · 27 October 2005, 16:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by donutsina911

codders, what on earth were you doing in beruit? Your tales get taller as the weeks go past. As for the police having steyr aug rifles in bristol - that is absolute horseshit. Even if this bore any resemblence to the truth, imho give the police the tools to do the job of keeping our streets safe - if this means they carry excocet missile launchers on the back of their panda cars then so be it, as long as they're trained to use the kit and know when is appropriate to use it....

anyone stupid enough to carry anything resembling a gun and / or not respond fairly quickly to a police challenge probably deserves what they get..one of the lefty papers did an analysis of all those who had been shot by armed police in the last few decades - with the obvious unfortunate exceptions (ie london recently) they have nearly all been when the police have been faced with what appears to be a firearms threat......i'm with hard1 on this..

Absolute horseshit???

I NEVER post anything unless I have checked it first!!!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/2665251.stm

Jono · 27 October 2005, 16:43

Defo Steyrs in the pic.... but are they the police spec 9 millies (Ie not .223s)... which are no more "powerful" than the H&Ks..?

I can't tell without a better piccie..

codprawn · 27 October 2005, 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jono

Defo Steyrs in the pic.... but are they the police spec 9 millies (Ie not .223s)... which are no more "powerful" than the H&Ks..?

I can't tell without a better piccie..

I checked up at the time - and well done for knowing the difference!!! They are actually the 5.56 versions!!!

Now I know that US SWAT teams etc would have such guns but for normal Police on street patrol??? The chance of a stray round hitting someone els is just far too great!!!

codprawn · 27 October 2005, 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil Davies

Codders actually spent his formative years on the Red Sea where, at the tender age of 2, he followed in Moses' footsteps and learned to walk on water, later helming his first RIB at just 3 years old. On leaving primary school, he enlisted with Mossad as a junior secret agent and subsequently saw active service in the Lebanon. Longing for a break from the stresses of combatting international terrorism, he eventually returned to his native Swansea where he was at last able to enjoy a life of anonymity amongst the UK's millions of IT consultants.

Spot on - and where the hell have you been hiding lately??? Been quite peacefull on here for a while!!!

Jono · 27 October 2005, 17:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

I checked up at the time - and well done for knowing the difference!!! They are actually the 5.56 versions!!!

Now I know that US SWAT teams etc would have such guns but for normal Police on street patrol??? The chance of a stray round hitting someone els is just far too great!!!

Mmm... just had a quick "nose" and discover that quite a few Police "units" have been isued with .223 AUGs...... shit! That's really gonna sting if it goes wrong

I understand if you're facing a villain wearing a vest it's much better to give him a smack with a .223 rather than a tickle with a 9 mill.. but jeez..... through and throughs?..