Yachtmaster pre-requisites

martini · 28 August 2011, 17:31

I'm getting confused again (easily done)

depending who I ask I'm getting different answers.

Do passages undertaken in a rib count towards the required sea time for a yachtmaster offshore exam? Even cross channel passages etc?

Alan Priddy · 28 August 2011, 20:05

Not as far as I am aware Your sea miles have to be in the same sort of boat you are getting the qualification for. If it is a sail Yachtmaster it has to be a cabin yacht and if it's a power Yachtmaster it has to be a cabin rib.Alan P

cyberstoker · 28 August 2011, 20:09

If the vessel used to make the passages was one that the practical exam could be taken in then I would have though it was fine.

But if you're after a Yachting YM then I would say not.

GaryC · 29 August 2011, 10:13

I thought there was a minumum standard for YM. I'm sure the Sail YM states greater than 7 metres in length and cabable of overnight accommodation. i.e you have to live on it so it must have a cabin and catering facilites. Would of thought there was one for power YM too.

Gary

Channel Ribs · 29 August 2011, 10:36

From the RYA site:

"The boat used must be between 7m* (23ft) and 24m (78ft) LOA and be in sound, seaworthy condition, equipped to the standard set out in the RYA book Cruising Yacht Safety (code C8). The boat must be equipped with a full up to date set of charts and navigational publications and be efficiently crewed, as the examiner will not take part in the management of the boat during the exam."

* There is even some flexibility in the 7m limit, I imagine that if a boat were equipped for regularly making passages of over 60nm and the examiner were satisfied of it's suitability then something just under would be ok.

No mention in there of accommodation.

Though G18 used the phrase 'Motor Cruiser' in place of boat.

The log section of G18 uses the phrase 'Motor Yacht'.

Page 40 is perhaps the most important...

"... it would be impossible to lay down absolute requirements without producing an unduly complicated and restrictive set of rules."

"Motor Cruiser is a generic term covering a very wide range of boats with different handling characteristics and sea-keeping abilities."

There is an over-night element to the pre-exam requirement of Coastal Skipper, but not in the same section for Yachtmaster Offshore. (Page 41)

Yachtmaster Ocean carries a requirement of 96 hours non-stop, which effectively demands accommodation.

Since the requirements for Offshore is five trips of over 60nm, then any motor vessel capable of safely undertaking such trips would qualify? If you tell the examiner you have regularly done Weymouth to Jersey in a 5m dory then he is likely to question your experience and wisdom.

In your case Matt I suggest that you contact John Elliot who is the man that would asses you if you took the exam in the Channel Islands. At the end of the day he is the one who has to be satisfied that you and the boat you use have met the criteria.

(My understanding of the exam is that it is not a specific set of boxes to tick, it is about making a very experienced examiner confident in your ability and your breadth of knowledge.)

GaryC · 29 August 2011, 12:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Channel Ribs

There is an over-night element to the pre-exam requirement of Coastal Skipper, but not in the same section for Yachtmaster Offshore. (Page 41)

From the RYA G15 Logbook...

Pre YM experience. "50 Days on board. A day on board is a period of 24 consecutive hours living on board the vessel. Periods of less than 24 hours may not be aggregated to increase the total but a day is not invalidated by leaving the yacht for a few hours during a cruise."

I am assuming the few hours is not to go and get shore accommodation. That is also from the Sail YM Log book. I would presume the motor YM would be similiar? (30 days are required for Coastal Skipper)

Gary

Channel Ribs · 29 August 2011, 12:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by GaryC

I am assuming...

... That even though the RYA produce two separate sylabi for sail and power, that the requirements are the same?

In the case of power, the book to refer to is the one I have extensively quoted from. As far as I can see there is no requirement to live aboard in the (power) Yachtmaster coastal or offshore sections and it is necessary for Ocean only because of the durations required.

The reason for the living aboard stipulation with the sail exam may have more to do with the time it takes to cover great distances when under sail. 60nm at 6 knots is clearly a very different boating experience to doing the same at 20kn.

SPR · 29 August 2011, 13:04

the RNLI definition is of motor boat is one that has a head! maybe buying s porta loo & solar power might convert rib to motor boat!

s.

Alan Priddy · 29 August 2011, 13:59

I am a Yacht Master Ocean both power and sail and at this time Commercialy Endorsed and I think that some of you may not be interpeting the "rules" correctly. What you think is ok is not so. Call the RYA MCA and ask for the exact requirements. Alan P

Channel Ribs · 29 August 2011, 14:03

My advice to Matt stands Alan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Channel Ribs

In your case Matt I suggest that you contact John Elliot who is the man that would asses you if you took the exam in the Channel Islands.

martini · 31 August 2011, 18:37

Thanks for the replies so far, so who is John Elliot exactly? Not sure if I would take the exam in CI given the choices on instructor and vessels etc overseas but I guess my local knowledge would allow me to concentrate more on other things during assessment.

Does look like I'll have to settle for a YM shore based course.

I'm also thinking of doing an STCW95 package on the off-chance a vacancy opens up locally but it looks like I'll need to go away for that.

Erin · 31 August 2011, 19:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by martini

so who is John Elliot exactly?

He's the Guernsey based RYA instructor/assessor that gives the tickets out for this kind of stuff. I'd have thought Peter Colback locally might be able to do it too, though he tends to be sailing rather than motor as I did my Dayskipper Sail practical with him.

Channel Ribs · 31 August 2011, 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by martini

I guess my local knowledge would allow me to concentrate more on other things during assessment.

I expect you would be taken outside of any comfort zone the examiner might spot.

Channel Ribs · 31 August 2011, 19:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by martini

who is John Elliot exactly?

I am sure I gave his contact details already, maybe I just thought I had.

martini · 31 August 2011, 19:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erin

I did my Dayskipper Sail

Everyone can read this you know

martini · 31 August 2011, 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Channel Ribs

I am sure I gave his contact details already, maybe I just thought I had.

Might well have done...

Quote:

Originally Posted by martini

I'm getting confused again (easily done)

Erin · 31 August 2011, 19:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by martini

Everyone can read this you know

Yeah yeah, but it was years ago before I saw the light

SPR · 31 August 2011, 21:40

I refer to myself as a reformed dinghy sailor!

tim griffin · 01 September 2011, 08:07

I am with AP on this you are misreading the rules as to what is allowed.
5 passages over 60 miles two of which are made at night.

Its all about how you manage the boat and the running of the vessel watch keeping for example organising the navigation and feeding the crew and so on as well as the close quarter stuff.

2500 NM miles is impressive but open boats don't fit the Motor Cruising scheme or Exam Criteria.

Do YM theory by all means (I offer that online) do STWC 95 you have your Advanced is it commercially endorsed ? if so that can lead to work on bigger boats where you start to qualify for the passages but its the boat handling that lets people down .
Going from a single outboard to twin outdrives does not always work well
same applies for shafts so time is needed to get familiar with a large boat .

My 2p worth
Tim
.

martini · 01 September 2011, 11:28

Thanks Tim, I know we've spoken about this before, obviously different people interpret the rules in different ways.

The important thing for me is not just getting the ticket but getting the experience and skills that are meant to go with it. There's a local YM instructor who's been doing deliveries for the last 3 years, he's on his 3rd insurance claim already and none of them small!

It's a bit of a chicken & egg situation here, jobs afloat in Jersey are extremely rare and the ones worth having are generally public sector. The only way to get your foot in that door is to know a lot of the right people and a list of qualies as long as your arm.