90 or 100???

[GJ0KYZ]

I have a large ETec myself; they're great engines. However, with a rib that size, engine weight would be a consideration and if the 90hp is that much lighter than the 100hp engine I'd go for the 90. Yes, the larger engine will give you better top-end speed and torque but (with respect) the 5.3 Ribcraft isn't a large boat and so you won't be flying around at 40kts very often, especially with kids aboard. If you're still unsure about 2- vs. 4-strokes then don't forget the 2-stroke oil; ETec HD100 oil is about £40 a bottle - it all adds up. Jason at Ribcraft will give you a good deal on Suzukis; I'd listen to what he has to offer before deciding.

[willk]

Originally Posted by lakelandterrier

Being used to running a 4-stroke I'm happy to stay with that although i appreciate the weight/power benefit of an E-tec (don't really want to spark off the 2/4 stroke debate again

I obviously need a large whisky and consider overnight!

I'm not sure that the 2/4 stroke debate is applicable. Forget for a minute that Etecs are 2 stroke.

You are buying a small rib and need the most Hp for the least weight. I should mention size here too. The Etec 90 is a very compact motor, much smaller than it's competitors, handy if you're using that transom space for other things. Fewer moving parts and reduced servicing costs are a bonus. The only difference you'll notice in use is that every few trips out (300Nm), you'll have to pop the hood and top up the oil reservoir, but then, you're used to dipping the sump on your 4 stroke anyway.

I'd be reluctant to put an extra 45kg hanging off the back (for ever) to gain another 10hp

[HUMBER P4VWL]

Originally Posted by Mollers

Bang, bang, ding, ding, bang,ding, bang.

Not the 3cyl. But yes the 2.5 v6, Grrrrowl!

[Mollers]

Originally Posted by GJ0KYZ

then don't forget the 2-stroke oil; ETec HD100 oil is about £40 a bottle - it all adds up.

So does yearly servicing as opposed to once every 3yrs.

Anyone know the cost of a seasonal service for a Suzy 90?

[willk]

Originally Posted by GJ0KYZ

ETec HD100 oil is about £40 a bottle - it all adds up.

It does, but in the Etec's favour.

The average engine does about 50 hours a season (adjust as required)

Lets do the "sums"

50 hrs @ 30kts X 1L/Nm = 1500 litres gas @ 100:1 = 15L XD100 = 4 cans @ £40 = £160 per year.

More than offset by reduced service cycles and costs.

In reality the Etec 90 should use less gas than this and mine are cruising at 130:1 on XD100 (no fibbing, just ribbing )

[lakelandterrier]

Thanks for all the advice people - it's widened the debate from the simple 90 or 100 HP question but I'm finding it really useful.

I hadn't considered an E-tec as an option

To be fair to the guys at Ribcraft, I haven't pushed on detailed engine spec or costs yet....from initial discussions their view was 90 or 100 Suzuki (obviously as they are main agents). The consideration of getting the complexity of getting parts done by different people is one I had in my mind - not anything to do with anyone not guaranteeing warranties, this debate has certainly led me tro think I should consider all the options. When the engine & rigging is c.33% of the cost is warrants more though than i've yet given it.

There are I think 2 things I need to decide:

1) What is the best engine for the rig - lighter E-tec 90, or a heavier 4 stroke (I'm still not sure how the pros & cons of 2-stroke v 4 stroke weigh off) considering reliability, noise, running costs, weight etc.... but if a 4 stroke I think a 90 would be more than adequate.

2) What are the differences in cost going to be between boat less engine - which as quite rightly been pointed out is a perfectly valid option, with an engine sourced elsewhere (whatever the marque), and factory fitted with their recommended engine. Indeed what wolud the factory price be with an E-tec fitted.

So I will ask the questions and get some engine quotes from elsewhere.

Any other recommendations apart from the E-tec?

[Mollers]

It might by an interesting exercise to run the Etec alternative by Jason at Ribcraft.

[BogMonster]

Originally Posted by Mollers

I think the opposite, having Ribcraft supply and fit everything is a good way of paying 'full list' for every component on the boat.

From recent experience, I don't agree with that - the discount deal that I was offered on a Ribcraft fairly recently - for a fully fitted out and ready to go boat - was miles and miles cheaper than the total of the "full list", the difference between the sum of the full list prices and the offer price for a built up boat was about £5000 ... now obviously I realise that when a company is selling something the "list price" is the maximum margin and set with enough to allow a discount built in, but even so that is a lot of discount and the final boat price was very competitive and much less than I thought it was going to be based on the downloaded price lists.

Jason was extremely helpful when I was looking at the different boats and the reason I eventually went for an Osprey was just that it was the boat I really wanted - if Osprey didn't exist I would have probably ended up with a Ribcraft 5.85. Moral of the story is if you think you want something, ask, and it may well be cheaper than you thought

I never asked the question about whether they would offer an Etec because I was happy enough with the Suzuki option at the time.

From feedback on RIBnet, the Etec 3yr service interval doesn't necessarily mean that you won't need to do something to the engine through that time - spark plugs apparently don't last 300hrs whatever Evinrude say.

[Mollers]

Originally Posted by BogMonster

From feedback on RIBnet, the Etec 3yr service interval doesn't necessarily mean that you won't need to do something to the engine through that time - spark plugs apparently don't last 300hrs whatever Evinrude say.

Didn't touch mine in 2.5yrs, admittedly, it hadn't done 300hrs. I feel that some of the fears expressed on Ribnet re. Etec service intervals are based on 'fear of the unknown' rather than experience or research.

As for Ribcraft pricing? My direct experience of purchasing a new Ribcraft was through my pal Roycruse. He bought a new fully loaded 585 in '06/07. He certainly paid 'all the money' for the bits and pieces, vhf, plotter, stainless etc. Having said that, the RC stainless was some of the nicest work i've seen.

[BogMonster]

This was earlier this year so maybe the competitive boat market has lead to sharpening of pencils

[lakelandterrier]

Maybe I'm being a bit thick, but I thought one of the main benefits of an E-tec was the weight saving. I've been looking at engines technical sepcs and the 90 E-ted is listed as 145Kg, the suzuki DF 90 at 155Kg. The Suzuki DF100 is heavier at 189Kg.

With only a 10Kg weight difference for the E-tec and Suzuki 90s what is driving the view that the E-tec will be better on a 5.3m? - I thought it was mainly the weight. I can't see 10Kg making much of a difference. I really want to get these issues straight in my head.

[Mollers]

Originally Posted by lakelandterrier

I've been looking at engines technical sepcs and the 90 E-ted is listed as 145Kg, the suzuki DF 90 at 155Kg. The Suzuki DF100 is heavier at 189Kg.

With only a 10Kg weight difference for the E-tec and Suzuki 90s

What's written on the cowl is not the whole story. The Etec 90 will give the punch of the Suzy 100 with a big weight saving. The Suzy 90 would feel somewhat lethargic in a straight shoot-out with an Etec 90.

End of sales push. Enjoy your rib.

[lakelandterrier]

Thanks Mollers - understand now - it was me being dense!M uch appreciate your thoughts & contibution...thinking hat's going back on now!

[BogMonster]

The new Suz 90 is much lighter than the old one I think ... perhaps the 4 stroke manufacturers are starting to wise up to the fact that people don't want a ton of outboard hanging off the back of a smallish boat

[Mollers]

Originally Posted by BogMonster

The new Suz 90 is much lighter than the old one I think ... perhaps the 4 stroke manufacturers are starting to wise up to the fact that people don't want a ton of outboard hanging off the back of a smallish boat

I wonder where/how they've made those weight savings without sending the cost through the roof. There's a whole heap cogs, wheels, valves and pullies in there.

[willk]

Originally Posted by Mollers

I wonder where/how they've made those weight savings without sending the cost through the roof. There's a whole heap cogs, wheels, valves and pullies in there.

Maybe they filled 'em wiv 'oles

[Mollers]

Originally Posted by willk

Maybe they filled 'em wiv 'oles

That's a bit of an 'oxy' ya moron.

[GJ0KYZ]

Originally Posted by Mollers

So does yearly servicing as opposed to once every 3yrs.

Anyone know the cost of a seasonal service for a Suzy 90?

That's a good point actually. ETecs are only serviced once every three years; mine's yet to have its first service. The only time my engine has needed attention is after I've damaged it by running aground or hitting submerged objects.

Talking of damage, I must thank the person who reversed their boat into mine at some point today, taking a chunk out my bow in the process. Matt - if you're reading this check Martini II for damage as I was moored next to you last night and knob breath may have hit your boat as well.

[Mollers]

Originally Posted by GJ0KYZ

....and knob breath may have hit your boat as well.

He got that close?!!

[GJ0KYZ]

Unfortunately not, else he would be boat-hook breath by now.