decided on boat but which outboard?

timmy · 26 July 2004, 20:58

Hi all,

New to this forum, attempted to get going a few weeks ago but unable to. To be brief - i have a thousand questions to ask - :-

i have decided today to buy my very first boat and have a problem deciding on make of 2 stroke outboard.

To be fair to all i have ordered a Zodiac Futura 4.10 which is not strictly a RIB so before i go any further i hope this is the right forum to be asking advice on!

My first 'problem' is make of outboard. I have been told that Yamaha are very very good but have found a 2004 second hand 2 stroke Tohatsu outboard for a good price. It is as new.
My question is, will i be missing out on any benefits, if any, by not buying a 'better' outboard of same power and stroke, eg better grunt, auto mixing etc.

I have done my research but have no experience.

I hope you RIB people will help and/or direct me to the right place.

thanks

Tim

Simon Hawkins · 26 July 2004, 21:06

Tim. I have always had mariner 2 stroke engines and have never had a problem. I am no expert on outboards but have driven boats with the same size engine but 4 stroke and do not have as much torque but then again they are more economical. Someone may care to correct me.

tue · 26 July 2004, 21:07

What sort of size are you looking for? Yamaha are good engines, as are Mercury/Mariner (same engine 10% more if you buy Mercury??!!?). Johnson/Evinrude (same engines) are OK but since being taken over by Bombardier I don't think are as good as they used to be. Tohatsu tend to be old technology 2 strokes, which isn't a bad thing it just means it may not be quite as refined as say a Mariner or Yamaha.

timmy · 26 July 2004, 21:13

cheer guys for quick reply!

The boat is only between 69kg and 102kg depending on floor type.

I only want/need a maximum 30hp.

This Tohatsu is 25hp, 2 stroke, 2 cylinder, non oil mixer, 2004, long shaft.

How crude are they and does this mean they are not so powerful, quiet nor fruigal on the juice?

Simon Hawkins · 26 July 2004, 21:18

Wy go for a long shaft in a boat that does not have much of a freeboard. May I suggest a short leg.

tue · 26 July 2004, 21:21

You won't find many engines of that size which are oil injection without probably going over the boats max engine weight limit.

The Tohatsu will be just as powerfull as a Mariner of the same size it will just tend to make a bit more noise (due to there basic cowling designs and carb intake designs) and possibly use a bit more fuel (but I doubt it would be noticeable). From the Tohatsus that have come into work they do tend to be very reliable and pretty bomb proof they just look a bit outdated under the cowling, and the cowling design is an old looking type. If its the right price IMHO i would go for it.

Make sure you don't need a standard shaft length on the boat. I can't rember how high the transom is on them.

timmy · 26 July 2004, 21:27

I have heard they are reliable.

I guess then that 25 hp is 25 hp whatever the make. Zodiac recommend a long shaft for the 4.2 m Futura.

Ok, so Tohatsu is a little dated, i understand what you are saying. If i should opt for this make then, do you have any comments on whether i should opt for the 30HP outboard and......

.....will i notice a difference in performance between 25 and 30 hp?

timmy · 26 July 2004, 21:32

Tue, Simon,

Ive just noted your deatails and see that you both have powerful outboards and big boats! They look a bit beyond me at the moment, in terms of size, cost, power, storage etc.

This game is all new to me.

I also note Tue, that you are based 30 odd miles from my location - Plymouth.

tue · 26 July 2004, 21:33

I doubt if you went up to a 30hp 2 cylinder you would notice much difference. Not sure if they do a 3 cylinder (I know Mariner do), in which case you may notice a little difference as you will get a little more initial pull due to the extra cylinder, plus Mariner do an oil injected version (so I would imagine Tohatsu do a similar one). Though the 3 cylinder engine is a bit heavier so would probably not make it worth while

timmy · 26 July 2004, 21:44

i get what you're saying, thanks.

I want, at this stage to keep everything manageable and light but still want some fun with pottering, exploring and pulling doughnuts whilst i get the hang of this boat malarky and start learning.

The 3 cylinder 30 HP 4 strokes jump up to 90kg which is too big at this stage.

Went to the boat races at Plymouth recently, had a look round the manufacturers - was amazed at the physical size of the Honda 300HP outboards.

They were gorgeous.

Simon: the term 'freeboard ' means nowt to me!

but i can guess it has something to do with the transom.

John Kennett · 26 July 2004, 21:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by timmy

My question is, will i be missing out on any benefits, if any, by not buying a 'better' outboard of same power and stroke, eg better grunt, auto mixing etc.

If the price is right then you're unlikely to go far wrong with the Tohatsu. It is a no frills engine, using "tried and tested" rather than "cutting edge" technology but I wouldn't be too bothered.

It may not be the most fuel efficient of all outboards, but with a 30hp it's not likely to make a huge difference. It will also be a bit noisier than some, and on a boat that size you're going to be sitting pretty close to it, but you're going to be having so much fun that you probably won't notice!

John

tue · 26 July 2004, 21:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by timmy

Tue, Simon,

Ive just noted your deatails and see that you both have powerful outboards and big boats! They look a bit beyond me at the moment, in terms of size, cost, power, storage etc.

This game is all new to me.

We all have to start somewhere. I had a little 14' Marina with a 30hp Yamaha to start with (till I saw the light and found something with tubes round it

).

Quote:

Originally Posted by timmy

I also note Tue, that you are based 30 odd miles from my location - Plymouth.

When mines finishedand I bring it to Plymouth you'll have to come out and see how much fun big boats and powerfull outboards can be if a little more expensive to run than a 30hp on a 4.2m SIB

)

timmy · 26 July 2004, 22:47

Cheers John,

Tue was saying in earlier post that i may not notice the difference between 25 hp and 30hp on a light Zodiac Futura. I'm wondering if 5hp extra will make pulling rings etc, easier and give that little extra performance. The difference is £600 for that extra 5 hp.

Worth it?

Tue, as i am now back online, i will be following threads on this site now and hope to learn a thing or two.

This tube boat thing seems addictive, I'm hoping it will replace my main passion in motorcycles, which i have after 20 odd years, decided to put on the back burner for a change in direction.

tim

Phil Davies · 26 July 2004, 22:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by timmy

This tube boat thing seems addictive, I'm hoping it will replace my main passion in motorcycles

Nah, just run a boat and motorbike - they're not mutually exclusive as Jono, Jono Garton, MeMe and myself will happily testify

By the way, Timmy, the Honda 30hp weighs 71kgs which is the lightest 4-stroke engine on the market. In answer to your concerns re. 25 v 30 horsepower engines, my brother runs a Bombard 3.8m inflatable with a Yamaha 25 2-stroke and he can pull a skier without any problem, not to mention his doughnut.

timmy · 26 July 2004, 23:02

aha, you run a 4m with 30 hp i see! Is it a RIB or SIB?

BTW - does SIB mean 'soft inflatable boat'?

Just sold my BMW GS 1150!

Did not read the end of your reply at first go!

Thanks for the info on the 25 v 30 prob. I've considered the Bombard but went for the Futura cos of lightness. However i think that the Bombard is also a very light boat - not sure if it is a RIB or inflatable tho.

Phil Davies · 26 July 2004, 23:09

Timmy

Yes, you're correct about the meaning of SIB. My 4m is a RIB and, due to its heavier weight and water ballast hull, will not pull a skier, although it's fine with the doughnut. Sorry to hear about the Beemer! Incidentally, my brother's Yamaha 25 is oil injection and a damn fine piece of kit.

timmy · 26 July 2004, 23:21

Thanks everyone for your help.

Yep GS gone! Wouldnt know what to replace it with at mo. So buying a boat instead!

The Yamaha motors do seem like top bits of kit and well refined. I was going to buy 30hp Yam 2 stroke until i was persuaded to save my money and go for a mint 25hp Tohatsu - today

I agreed and now wonder if i should have gone for the 30hp as you know from previous posts.

I was told that the Zodiac - being 69KG with air deck - will 'fly' with the 25 and pull a doughnut with ease.

Its all too much for me! I am getting pressure from mates who want to ski. Only they're not paying!

Phil Davies · 26 July 2004, 23:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by timmy

I am getting pressure from mates who want to ski. Only they're not paying!

Sounds familiar! Everyone kept telling me to get a 50hp so they could ski behind my RIB, and some even suggested getting a bigger RIB altogether so I could carry them in more comfort

And, like you, I became confused, but unlike you, I was stunned into inactivity and stuck with what I had. I suppose the one thing I did learn was that if I ever get a bigger RIB it's going to have the maximum recommended horsepower on the back!

I wouldn't worry too much about the difference between the 25 and 30hp, because once you're hooked on your new hobby you'll undoubtedly want to upgrade your boat and engine in due course anyway. As John Kennett says, you'll be having too much fun to notice anyway. Enjoy!

Bilge Rat · 27 July 2004, 09:06

Timmy

Remember who your buying your boat for, its great your mates want to go skiing and the first few trips out will be a hoot, but eventually they'll get bored or the weather will get colder then your stuck out alone or have to join us sad muppets cruising if you get hooked

Phils correct, you wont notice much difference at this level with an extra 5hp

Enjoy the buying bit, the day you tow it home your'll never be more happier, then when things go wrong your'll curse the day you ever decided to get into boats

Jackwabbit · 27 July 2004, 11:04

Hi Timmy,
I wouldn’t worry about the engine not being auto-lube (oil injected), in fact I would be happier if it wasn’t.
Our dive club have just gone over to a RIB with a Suzuki 4 stroke engine, we still have 2 SIB’s both with Yamaha 2 stroke engines. One is a 30hp without auto-lube on a 5M SIB, this engine is over 15 years old and has been the most reliable 2 stroke engine we have ever had.
The other is a 40hp with auto-lube on a 5.2 SIB, this is about 7 years old and has had all sorts of problems, mainly jets in the carbs blocking. (we have had to strip down the carbs at least twice every year since we’ve had it) We also had another Yamaha 30hp for about 6 years which was also auto-lube this had the same problem’s.
I don’t know if we have just been unlucky with the auto-lube engines but now most of the clubs opinion is “if we cant get a pre-mix 2 stroke we’ll go for a 4 stroke”