DT200EFI Reverse Woes.

[Nasher]

All.

I have a 1998 Suzuki DT200EFI That is absolutely great on my 6.5M Ocean, it only cost me @£2000 used @4 years ago, and up to now it’s been very reliable. It returns nearly the same MPG at cruising speeds of @25-30knots as ETEC’s and Optimax’s, but importantly only weighs 200kgs.

Unfortunately I now have an issue with it. After crashing in and out of forward and reverse to hold the bow on a beach in Devon whilst I lifted some people off, the engine won’t go into reverse, but just makes lots of clicking noises whilst the revs rise. It will go in perfectly without the engine running, so I’m expecting the dog clutch for reverse to be mangled, or the webs on the back of the reverse gear itself to be bent. Fortunately I have a complete spare set of gears etc.

Am I being paranoid, or is there anything else I should check before diving into the gearbox itself?
I’m expecting big trouble getting the threaded stopper and shaft housing out.
I have already ensured the cable is adjusted properly, but haven’t touched the ‘soft shift’ mechanism.

I'm going to carry on using it for the time being, and managed OK yesterday. I think Doggypaddle put it very well, "Reverse is very overrated as a gear".

The engine has also done a lot of work now in all weather conditions and is starting to show its age.
I’d like to replace it with another exactly the same, but as they are so rare over here they, or the DT225EFI, don’t come up for sale very often, and those that do are very well used. I’ve seen a couple on US ebay that look in much better condition than mine for a very good price, but would need help with importing one to the UK. Does anyone know how easy this is?

Of course the ideal scenario would be for me to buy Codprawns DT225EFI for a good price when he gets his 350HP V8 Yammie.

Thanks

Nasher.

[Dirk Diggler]

Originally Posted by Nasher

I’ve seen a couple on US ebay that look in much better condition than mine for a very good price, but would need help with importing one to the UK. Does anyone know how easy this is?

.

Yeh, done it loads of times. It's a bit like buying a motor from somewhere like Scotland, but it tends to arrive quicker.

The hardest job is getting a yank to package it for you, they're none to bright you know!

[willk]

Originally Posted by Nasher

Of course the ideal scenario would be for me to buy Codprawns DT225EFI for a good price when he gets his 350HP V8 Yammie.

Troublemaker!

[codprawn]

Wouldn't touch that Yam V8 with a bargepole - almost as heavy as twin 300xs!!!

It may be worth hanging on for my 225 efi - unless I stick it on a Ring or Phantom that is...........

Yes we can sort out shipping for you from the USA if you need it. Cost about £500 last time.

[Nasher]

Originally Posted by Dirk Diggler

The hardest job is getting a yank to package it for you, they're none to bright you know!

Yes it's that bit I was worried about, suppose it's best to stick to dealers that should have a special pallet laying around.

Originally Posted by codprawn

Yes we can sort out shipping for you from the USA if you need it. Cost about £500 last time.

Well done mate

I'll be in touch if it happens.

Nasher

[jambo]

Can i ask what is wrong with buying a motor from Scotland?
J

[Dirk Diggler]

Originally Posted by codprawn

Yes we can sort out shipping for you from the USA if you need it. Cost about £500 last time.

That's a £150 more than i normally pay.

[Chris]

I asked this question once of a dealer and was told that outboard gearcases are very difficult to rebuild well and often have a limited lifespan even if they are put together right.

If you have the spare gearset already then I guess its no biggie however.

No doubt you will need dozens of special tools to do the job

[Downhilldai]

Originally Posted by Chris

No doubt you will need dozens of special tools to do the job

I don't think you would for a Soozook 200.
You would need a box of shims though

[spartacus]

Originally Posted by jambo

Can i ask what is wrong with buying a motor from Scotland?
J

There's Scotland, then there's the west coast of Scotland. Honestly, when I've had stuff shipped over - they think you live in Tristan da Cunha! About time this country had a flat rate for the whole of the UK - considering it's tax-payers hard-earned cash that keep it from going tits up!

[codprawn]

Originally Posted by Dirk Diggler

That's a £150 more than i normally pay.

Ahh but that was to Guernsey!!!

[Nasher]

I'm hoping it's just the dog clutch thats buggered as it's a sliding part and doesn't effect the build up of tolerances that the shims sort out.

If I have to change the reverse gear itself I'll have to go through the whole proceedure to work out what new shims I'll need to buy.

The Genuine Suzuki manual I have explains the proceedure in great detail, and there are good enough images of the few special tools to enable me to make my own or improvise. The expensive requirement is a dial gauge which I have already.

Having read the proceedure there isn't anything that really frightens me, I'm more concerned at the moment about getting the thing apart, as my past experiance has been that the stopper ring will have attached itself firmly to the inside of the gear case, and I'll end up carefully cutting it up to get it out.

I won't be doing it for a while, as I want to buy a new Stopper ring(@£40) first to use as a pattern to manufacture a special tool to try taking the old one out, and of course I can use it to put the new one in.

In the mean time I'll be looking out for another used bottom end just in case, but the chances of finding one are almost Zero.

Nasher.

[jambo]

Originally Posted by spartacus

There's Scotland, then there's the west coast of Scotland. Honestly, when I've had stuff shipped over - they think you live in Tristan da Cunha! About time this country had a flat rate for the whole of the UK - considering it's tax-payers hard-earned cash that keep it from going tits up!

I agree whole heartedly!! Even living 60 miles sw of Glasgow they want to charge as if I were in Stornoway but that shouldn't matter it makes the price of things expensive. I boat on the sound of jura and when I need spares from 'down' south they take over a week and I am charged the prverbial arm & leg.
J

[codprawn]

Maybe it's the Scottish depots to blame................

After all it only costs £35 +VAT to send a pallet from say Leeds to Swindon!!!

We don't charge as much in Wales either - even St Davids costs the same as Swansea and it's 72 miles away and the back of beyond!!!

[Downhilldai]

Originally Posted by codprawn

... St Davids costs the same as Swansea and it's 72 miles away and the back of beyond!!!

I agree - Swansea is really not worth seeking out.

[Tim M]

I bought a boat from a man in Swansea once. Checked out his other items on ebay - there was some kinky gear on there!

Nasher, I've come across this several times: previously on a Suzi 225 4-stroke and on a couple of optis. Solved the problem on all three engines by adjusting the gear cable, although I think you've already tried that. Good luck!

[Nasher]

So the gearbox Woes continue.

I tried adjusting the cable again just to be sure, but then running the engine up on the muffs it still wouldn’t go into reverse gear with the engine running.

I decided to drop the bottom end off to check the shift mechanism and also change the oil to get an indication of the internal condition.

I was pleased with the condition of the oil, not a hint of any moisture and still a nice clear green.
I ran it through a piece of cloth and was pleased that there were no slithers of metal in it.

However my good mood was very short lived.
I extracted the shift mechanism from the top of the lower unit and was horrified at the amount of metal slithers stuck to the magnet that’s there to catch them so they don’t jam anything up or go through the gears. It looked like a small black hedgehog was living in there.

Obviously time then to dive into the box itself.
My main concern has been getting the stopper ring out (35 in the attached image) and sure enough it wouldn’t budge.
I ended up drilling a small pilot hole at the top and bottom, then a larger hole that would nearly break out of both sides. Then I ground the end of the larger drill into an end mill shape to square off the bottom of the hole. I was helped here as there is a Stainless Tab washer behind the stopper ring and it was easy to feel when the drill hit it.
The stopper ring came out in two bits.

Over the weekend I need to make up a puller to get the bearing carrier out, then I can make a list of parts I need to order. Hopefully it’ll only be seals etc and a new stopper ring as I have a complete set of spare internals already.
Re-shimming the assembly is going to be fun!

Just to make things worse the drive shaft has developed a problem I’ve never seen before on an outboard. I went to take the prop off and the split pin was missing. I’d only put the prop back on for the Searider gathering so I knew it hadn’t been gone long.
Then I realised to my horror that the end of the shaft has broken off at the split pin hole. I’ve no idea how this has happened, but luckily I can use a thinner washer and turn a mm or so off the back of the nut to give me enough room to drill a new hole. It looks like it must have been cracked for a while.

Anybody have a clue how this could of happened?

Nasher.

[Downhilldai]

I've never seen a split pin hole shear like that.

You may find you don't need a puller to get the guts out of the 'box. Grab hold of the shaft and give it a tug, in the good old fashioned way.

[codprawn]

Possibly rust or marine growth causing expansion? Or even heat and differences in expansion?

I am betting on rust - someone must have given you a plain steel split pin!!!

Could even have been the prop nut somehow unscrewing itself?

[jwalker]

Nasher, I wouldn't be too worried about the black hedgehog. I bet it'll squidge down to not a lot of metal if your rub it between your fingers. Gear oil always comes out like metalflake paint if you hold it to the light.