Etec efficiency claims

[BogMonster]

I've just been looking at some bumph on Etec engines, having been fairly set on going for a four stroke next time round.

One of the claims is "E-TEC direct injection provides up to 30% more fuel efficiency than 4 stroke engines...."

Is this anywhere near true? Or is it "30% more than a clapped out 10 year old carbed four stroke"...

The lack of requirement for any maintenance is very appealing to me as if it doesn't have to visit a dealer for three years it follows that the warranty is still going to be valid even if there isn't a dealer here .... in other words if it goes bang, I mean really bang conrods sticking out of the engine kind of bang, I can always send it back! This would be inconvenient but not as inconvenient as having to buy a new engine because the warranty was not valid on a 1 or 2 year old one

[J S]

Stephen

I recently downloaded an article from the evinride website that was written by an Austrailian magazine and they did fuel consumption on 75 and 90hp's test and they found that saving to be true at idle but it is no way near that at WOT.

Article can be found here http://www.brp.com/NR/rdonlyres/8BDD...IDE_ETEC75.pdf

James

[BogMonster]

Very interesting. Even if it isn't a lot better it is obviously at the top end of the fuel economy scale, which is what I want, as this thing I have now is damned thirsty!!

Question for those of you that run an Etec - do you like it and how does it compare to previous engines you have owned (if any)?

Also if anybody USED to own an Etec and got rid of it - why?

I like the idea of something so mechanically simple - seems there is really not a lot to go wrong

The electrical self-sufficiency is also a brilliant idea IMHO

Thanks

[dctucker]

I'll let you know in a couple of weeks. Just picked up my 5.4mR Searider with a brandy new 90 hp E-TEC this afternoon. I only took it for a 5 minute spin, with 3 or 4 hole shots and a few seconds at a time at WOT.

Initial impression, in a word: sweet.

The boat literaly JUMPS onto a plane with just me aboard. SmartTabs help too, but WOW! It is simply amazing how much quicker it is than the old 80hp Merc (at the crankshaft, probably more like 65-70hp at the propshaft). I can't compare it to an Opti or anything else, but WOW! Yeah, size matters, but WOW!

Fuel economy, simplicity of maintainence (including no oil changes), self powering (will run w/o battery), all factors in why I choose the E-TEC, after months of research, scouring websites and agonizing. I purchased from a pretty large dealer (also a very large Zodiac dealer), and the techs report only one failed E-TEC returning to them... as a result of a sinking. Any modern engine is going to be pretty equal in fuel economy and reliability. The E-TEC should be more economical than a 4-stroke in the large amount of idle and low speed running I do, not a big difference at WOT or higher cruising speeds. As I do more idle & slow planing speed stuff, I expect to see a 25%-35% increase in fuel economy vs. the 4 cylinder carbed dino juice slurper the E-TEC replaced.

They loved the Searider, BTW. Even in comparison to a C-27. Also said it was nice to rig a max HP motor on a boat that could actually use all of the power. I can't wait to spend some more time in the boat in the next two weeks, really wringing it out. I'll probably put 40 or 50 hours on it in the next couple of weeks, at the Miami Olympic Classes Regatta, chasing my wife around. By the time I get home, I should have a pretty good idea of fuel economy, oil usage, etc.

Right now, on initial impression, I'm VERY happy.

[jyasaki]

Note: Hope I don't get in trouble for flogging another forum, but...

Stephen: Try hitting www.thehulltruth.com and do a search for ETec. A lot of people love them, a lot hate 'em, and quite a few have had some pretty serious problems (Not saying it's any different than any other motor; just trying to get a maximum of input in where it's wanted.)

jky

[Milan]

Hi Stephen I used to have a 225 optimax on the back of my rib I sold it in order to buy the 225 ETEC I can only speak as I find and only up to the time now where I have about 28 hours on the clock, but what I can tell you is the engine is fantastic it so far has never missed a beat performance wise there is no comparison with the optimax the ETEC has far more power and torque in fact the first time I applied the throttle was coming out of the mouth of the marina at Dunstaffnage and I almost s**t myself, the arse end of the boat dug in and the bow came up like never before putting it simply I was not expecting such a vast difference between the two engines, I was totally taken by surprise!
I know there are other folk on the forum that have the ETEC and have many more hours on the clock than myself and from what I can gather they to are just as happy with there engine perhaps they will post there input.
The fuel economy bearing in mind I have a 7.3 mtr Rib is in my opinion very expectable, when I think back to all the days over a ten year or more period I spend out on ribs scuba diving with the old two stroke engines were you could count the miles you did in gallons of petrol per mile the difference is staggering there just is no comparing the two.
I had best end it here before folk think I’ am on some sort of commission or quest to convert the world to ETEC that’s not the case it’s just unless you have seen the difference you cannot believe it.
As I stated earlier I may live to regret my words but up till now I am more than happy good luck with your choice no matter what that might be

[BogMonster]

Originally Posted by jyasaki

Note: Hope I don't get in trouble for flogging another forum, but...

Stephen: Try hitting www.thehulltruth.com and do a search for ETec. A lot of people love them, a lot hate 'em, and quite a few have had some pretty serious problems (Not saying it's any different than any other motor; just trying to get a maximum of input in where it's wanted.)

jky

Thanks, searched for e-tec and etec and turned up a few, so I've registered and asked the question

[Rogue Wave]

Originally Posted by dctucker

I'll let you know in a couple of weeks. Just picked up my 5.4mR Searider with a brandy new 90 hp E-TEC this afternoon. I only took it for a 5 minute spin, with 3 or 4 hole shots and a few seconds at a time at WOT.

Initial impression, in a word: sweet.

:

Lucky boy I envy you

[GuyP]

I believe that, like Verados, they can be run at WOT from new, so no run-in required, and that they require less battery power than the equivilent Optimax.

I've also read on a Boston Whaler forum (Continuous Wave), that they can be pull-started (the lower HP models anyway) if the battery or starter-motor fail, as they come with emergency pull-cords under the cowling.

[BogMonster]

Originally Posted by GuyP

I believe that, like Verados, they can be run at WOT from new, so no run-in required, and that they require less battery power than the equivilent Optimax.

I've also read on a Boston Whaler forum (Continuous Wave), that they can be pull-started (the lower HP models anyway) if the battery or starter-motor fail, as they come with emergency pull-cords under the cowling.

I may be wrong but I think that only goes up to the 3cyl ones of which the 90 is the biggest - mine will either be a 115 or a 150 depending on what boat I get which depends on money, how many holes my Humbug gets it in between now and then, the phase of the moon and various other unpredictable factors

I really like the completely self-contained electrics, its a very similar principle to a light aircraft piston engine of the sort made by Lycoming etc, doesn't rely on any external power. Aeroplane engines that stop are usually bad for business so its probably a reliable idea

[J S]

Originally Posted by BogMonster

I really like the completely self-contained electrics, its a very similar principle to a light aircraft piston engine of the sort made by Lycoming etc, doesn't rely on any external power. Aeroplane engines that stop are usually bad for business so its probably a reliable idea

I agree with you about the lycoming engines i woked at a light airfield for a week in the maintenence and engineering hanger and there were some of those engines with thousands of hours on them and still going stong. But they have have a very good maintenence regime and they are sent away to be re-furbished evry so many hours.

James

[dctucker]

Originally Posted by BogMonster

I may be wrong but I think that only goes up to the 3cyl ones of which the 90 is the biggest - mine will either be a 115 or a 150 depending on what boat I get which depends on money, how many holes my Humbug gets it in between now and then, the phase of the moon and various other unpredictable factors

I really like the completely self-contained electrics, its a very similar principle to a light aircraft piston engine of the sort made by Lycoming etc, doesn't rely on any external power. Aeroplane engines that stop are usually bad for business so its probably a reliable idea

I think you're wrong. IIRC, there was a recent thread on THT about pull starting E-TECs and someone related doing it with a larger engine. Of course, I could be wrong too!

They "self" break-in, upping the oiling for the first two hours above 2500 rpm, per my mechanic's briefing. No problem to run at WOT right out of the box. Nothing you have to do to break them in, i.e. RPM limits, etc.

They will run without any external battery power whatsoever.

THT and the Bass Boat Central Evinrude forum were very valuable in my decisionmaking process. Lot's of opinions (everybody's got one) and lots of first hand experience with the E-TECs. Just be sure to seperate the "I heards" from the "In my direct experience". Also beware of people talking about E-TECs when they really mean FICHTs. Major differences between the two. When very experienced techs say they haven't seen very many failures, that's worth a lot to me. There are a number of those on the BBC forum.

Most all of the people running E-TECs seem to love 'em... Same is true for most other top brands. Lots of extreme Merc loyalists for instance. I think there probably aren't major performance advantages for one brand vs another. It's the subjective factors. I wanted a new tech 2 stroke for it's lighter weight. That limited me to a few brands, and the 90 Opti is a porker, weighs more than many 4 strokes, as I recall. That pretty much left Tohatssan or E-TEC for me... Not enough Tohatsu Nissan dealers around for me to be comfortable, so... And then there's the "shiny new object" cool factor.

"you pays your money and you takes your chances!"

[dctucker]

Originally Posted by Rogue Wave

Lucky boy I envy you

Thanks!

My wife was talking to another sailor this AM, told him about my new toy, said she didn't know what it cost... She threw out a number that she thought it was. I was more than please to inform her that her estimate was $2000 USD too high.

I'm not sure it really made her any happier to know the truth though!

[kwil]

Hi Stephen, you can pull start the 115/130 with no battery attached, not tried it but it can be done according to the handbook.

Not had mine long so cannot quote accurate consumption figures but I do not seem to be putting much fuel in it or oil for that matter even though it is probably using more as it is so new and they use more whilst running in. I am very pleased with it and it seems to have more go than other 115's.

The only thing I might do differently is I have the Commander Guages which are the mid range and the rev counter also works as a fuel computer if you put a flow meter in the fuel line and connect it to your fuel tank sender. But I am not sure of its accuracy as it does not match what I put in at refills, so it may be better and possibly cheaper to fit the basic guages and the Lowrance NMEA 2000 multifunction guage connected to the NMEA 2000 output of the ECU as this outputs the fuel used as metered by the injectors and as a by product you would have engine temp, trim, volts etc.

Keith

[dctucker]

Okay, back to the original question...

In four days of typical sailboat coaching duty, I used less than 2 6.5 gallon (US) tanks in my new 90 E-TEC. With my old 80 Merc 4 cylinder, 2 stroke, I would have used ~1.3 tanks in one day. So I'd call it something like <3 gallons/day vs. >8 gallons/day. Actually, this has been harder usage than in most of my typical past use. Much more towing of boats, many more long, fast runs in and out of harbor. All that, plus loads of idle to 2500 RPM running (4-5 hours/day), where the E-TEC really shines in terms of fuel consumption.

I can't tell, but I suspect that I'm probably through the high oil usage break in phase too, and haven't yet seen the low oil warning, so I've probably used <1 quart of XD100 oil. Maybe I'll pull the cowl off tomorrow and have a peek at the oil tank to see.

I'm more than happy with the increase in fuel economy of the E-TEC, it's cut my fuel consumption by over 50%!

It does have loads of grunt, but I think it's not propped optimally for my usage. I'm getting ventilation during hard turns, and I run a bit more heavily loaded with tools, spares and supplies, as well as usually having at least 1 more adult on board, vs. when the boat was propped. I'm seeing ~5000-5100 RPM at WOT when not too heavily loaded. I'm thinking a 4 blade SS Apollo might be a good change providing more bite for towing, better hole shot, less ventilation in turns and slighly slower planing speed. Currently have a 3 blade BRP aluminum 13.25 x 15 (?? need to double check).

So far, after 5 long hard days on the water, I'm loving this motor! Five or six more days to go.

And boy am I glad to have my Searider back!! I'd almost forgotten what a great riding and handling boat it is.

[prairie tuber]

dctucker,

Sounds like a fantastic setup! Can you post up some pictures?

[Tony]

Hi Stephen
i have a 250 DI and it seems good i get about 60ltrs pr hour if i dont push too hard. The only thing which surprised me was the oil consumption, its pretty bad. At £25.oo pr can its expensive.
maybe something to consider. As for performance woohoo its brilliant.
hope this helps

[Aidan]

Hi STephan,

I read on a few other forums that the ETEC was excellent at evrything except at the lower trawling speeds.
If I was buying one I would be inclined to over spec the size and then run it at less revs, this may appear wrong if what is said is correct. They both cannot be corect. I will try to chek back e-mails if needed.

I would be delighted if it works for you as it opens the door for me in the future to upgrade I was thinking about upgrading to 175 Suzi and i didnt get my boat yet). May upgrade to ETEC 200 instead.

Dont know if it is any less "Electronically complicated" although it does not need Camshaft and Hi Vo Chain servicing with upper head mechanis, timing etc. I have to draw the line with the verado tho.
I think you will need a Rocket Scientist to fix it.
I wish others will introduce drive by wire.

I think the real test must be how much better that the Opitmax is the ETEC.

ANy takers.
Also the ETEC looked good versus rest except for controls in last years RIB intl or buyers guide (*Amended)

[codprawn]

If oil is proving expensive why not use something like Rockoil's semi synthetic MP3 - works out about £2.50 per litre and is indentical to the quicksilver premium stuff - meets all the right specs!!!

[Nos4r2]

Any idea where to find rock oil mp3 codders? My 'local' chandlers (35 miles away) only sells quicksilver.