Out of fuel.

danny · 01 August 2005, 08:40

Would it be a problem if our Optimax 225 went out of fuel ?

I would like to empty the tank completely so that I can see how big it is.

At this moment we don't have a sensor inside the tank and because it's made of GRP I am hessitating about mounting one.

With our Smartcraftsystem it's also possible to see how much fuel you have used but then I really need to know where the bottom is.

Turbodiesel · 01 August 2005, 08:55

Well, they say you should'nt do it because you can damage the pump, The pump itself uses the fuel as a coolant. So if you run it out of fuel you can overheat the pump. If you do make sure you filters are good if the boats old you might end up sucking loads of crap into the engine.

tomfalla · 06 August 2005, 18:42

I'd never run a boat out of fuel completely as even in new ones there will be dust/cr@p in the tank. Why don't you run it down to just before you think it's empty, fill it from there and use that as a capacity. That way you'll have more fuel in the tank than you think as a margin of safety.

Due to how my fuel guage is mounted I estimate I have 5-10 gallons remaining when it reads empty, I always fill it up when getting empty, but it's nice to know I have a bit extra if I was to get in trouble.

Rogue Wave · 06 August 2005, 19:20

Agreed with both posts but if you mudt why not jyst drain the tanj by disvonnecting the fuel line to the engine. Just after the syphon bulb is a good place to do it from!

if you evee run out of fuel in an Opti then consider you may need to reboot the electronics before the bastd will start!

Turbodiesel · 06 August 2005, 21:33

You wont need to re boot any of the electronics to get it started again. Its just like any other outboard.
If you really need to drain it you can manually. At the Back of the engine on the right hand side near were the cables go in is the fuel pump etc. Low down is a brass type plug. Its quite big and probably has a flat screw driver type head in it. Open that up and that will drain most of the fuel. You can also take the screw on Fuel filter off to get the fuel out of the too.

codprawn · 06 August 2005, 21:46

I think it's a bit of a myth about running a tank empty and sucking up crap - the amount a RIB bounces around the fuel is pretty stirred up - same with a car - I ALWAYS run my cars to the very last fume - never a problem!!!

Rogue Wave · 07 August 2005, 00:21

Whats the furthest your car has been at sea when you have run out of fuel then Codders!

Turbo diesel I am afraid that it is sometimes required to reboot the electrics after the boat runs out of fuel. I know a few Opti owners it hæs happened to and it happebed to me on a boat I chartered with a dodgy fuel guage and a 200 opti.

After an hour of fkkn about trying to get it started I was well annoyed when it sprang to life after I disconnected and reconnected the brown lead.

pellesmil · 07 August 2005, 10:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by danny

At this moment we don't have a sensor inside the tank and because it's made of GRP I am hessitating about mounting one.

Put a sensor in there, your best insurance for leaving out a out of fuel situation

I mouted a sensor from Wema
Y can get the sensors lenght from 150mm and up, mounts realy easy.
Get the depht of the tank, order the nearest sensor, before drilling eny hole in the tank make a ring that have the hole pattern as the sensor, transfer the holes to the ring and make threads for mounting skrews.
Cut the ring in the middle witout damaging the threaded holes.
Drill the hole in the tank + the skrew holes (cleanup the mess)
the ring can then easy be let inside the tank and secured with some petrol resistant sealing.
Put in the sensor, tighten the skrews , leave a thin layer of sealing all over, and you are fri to go.
My experience is that the tank (and boat) would be out of service not more than 2-4 hrs.

Good luck

Turbodiesel · 08 August 2005, 08:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rogue Wave

Whats the furthest your car has been at sea when you have run out of fuel then Codders!

Turbo diesel I am afraid that it is sometimes required to reboot the electrics after the boat runs out of fuel. I know a few Opti owners it hæs happened to and it happebed to me on a boat I chartered with a dodgy fuel guage and a 200 opti.

After an hour of fkkn about trying to get it started I was well annoyed when it sprang to life after I disconnected and reconnected the brown lead.

Well i just spoke to the technical manager at work, and no you dont have to do anything to the electrics if you run out of fuel. must be another problem somewere else.!!!

Pete7 · 08 August 2005, 11:52

Not sure how you are going to put a sender unit in a GRP tank and be able to ensure it doesn't leak or petrol seep into the laminate were the hole is cut. You are also going to have to clean the tank out of swarf. From memory Osprey mount the fuel filler pipe on a S/S plate and glass this into the tank, so this might be an option as a bigger hole would allow the tank to be cleaned out. Vetus do have a number of different tank plates for fitting into a tank, might be worth a look in there catalogue.

Or might be easier to run the tank down to near empty and then drain out any remaining fuel through the fuel pipe into cans. There will still be a bit left but ignore this. Once empty down to the level of the pick up, off to the fuel pumps and fill to full. You would then know the capacity of the tank. Use the opti fuel flow meter to keep a check on how much is used during the season etc and do a complete fill and reset the opti every so often.

Pete

danny · 09 August 2005, 16:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete7

Not sure how you are going to put a sender unit in a GRP tank and be able to ensure it doesn't leak or petrol seep into the laminate were the hole is cut. You are also going to have to clean the tank out of swarf. From memory Osprey mount the fuel filler pipe on a S/S plate and glass this into the tank, so this might be an option as a bigger hole would allow the tank to be cleaned out. Vetus do have a number of different tank plates for fitting into a tank, might be worth a look in there catalogue.

Or might be easier to run the tank down to near empty and then drain out any remaining fuel through the fuel pipe into cans. There will still be a bit left but ignore this. Once empty down to the level of the pick up, off to the fuel pumps and fill to full. You would then know the capacity of the tank. Use the opti fuel flow meter to keep a check on how much is used during the season etc and do a complete fill and reset the opti every so often.

Pete

I think all of the answers are inside this message.
Mounting a sensor in a grptank can give lots of leaking problems. That would still be a lot of work.
I will drain the tank with the bulbpomp and take the hose off the machine. Fill it in cans and then fill her up again. That will take a few hours but will give a real capacity off the tank.

Thanks guys !

Stuart M · 09 August 2005, 21:08

Surely the easiest way is to measure the tank (if its a rectangular tank) and calculate the volume! (or have I missed something) - I fill the tank (100 litres) to the top and use a Navman 2100 fuel gauge with inline sensor. I set the gauge to 90 litres (10 litre safety) and when I fill up add the amount filled to existing in the tank - seems to work fine.

No need then for any holes in tank, no draining into containers etc.

Jeff · 09 August 2005, 22:53

............. and apologies if I am stating the obvious

.. but set the Smartcraft gauges to read in litres/liters - as "gallons" on the system are US gallons not Imperial ( 1.2:1)

Jeff

danny · 10 August 2005, 10:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stuart M

Surely the easiest way is to measure the tank (if its a rectangular tank) and calculate the volume! (or have I missed something) - I fill the tank (100 litres) to the top and use a Navman 2100 fuel gauge with inline sensor. I set the gauge to 90 litres (10 litre safety) and when I fill up add the amount filled to existing in the tank - seems to work fine.

No need then for any holes in tank, no draining into containers etc.

It's not possible to measure the tank. It's below the floor and not reacheble fot inspection.

Searider · 10 August 2005, 11:33

[QUOTE=Pete7] Not sure how you are going to put a sender unit in a GRP tank and be able to ensure it doesn't leak or petrol seep into the laminate were the hole is cut. [/QUOTE

Hi Pete,

I have just been very close to my fuel system and tank having had fuel starvation symptoms.

Have replaced all pipes and looked in the tank. Didn't find any blockages or any crap in the tank so its still a mystery

On the Scorpion the fuel tank sender is fitted to the tank inspection plate. Both the tank and the inspection plate are GRP.

The sender is bolted in place with a gasket (rubber I think - I didnt take this off) and the threads sealed with minimal amounts of Blue Hylomar.

The inspection plate is bolted to the tank. Cork gasket and Blue Hylomar on the threads.

Doesn't leak, er well, it DIDN'T until I took it all apart last night. Hoping i've put it back together properly

As long as the edges of the GRP are sealed with the same fuel resistant resin that the inside of the tank is coated with there shouldn't be any problem with fuel wicking along the fibres. - Not sure exactly what the resin is though.