When Jerrycans go Bad

[willk]

I have a new petrol motor that refused to run properly recently. It looked like a carb issue and a trip to the Shop confirmed that the petrol was laden with crap that had blocked the carb. I'm pretty fussy about my fuel supply and storage so I was a little surprised. I almost thought the Shop was dodging a warranty job. Then the engineer asked me if I used old plastic jerrycans for my fuel - and of course I do, very old.

A little blushing and filtering later and I can confirm flakes in the fuel - see pic below. The can is a 1996 vintage Scepter 20L, made in Canada for petrol etc. The engineer was of the opinion that plastic cans were better than metal, but that they have a shelf life - maybe ethanol is an issue for some? Maybe it's just age.

Hands up who has fuel cans off the Ark?

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by willk

I have a new petrol motor that refused to run properly recently. It looked like a carb issue and a trip to the Shop confirmed that the petrol was laden with crap that had blocked the carb. I'm pretty fussy about my fuel supply and storage so I was a little surprised. I almost thought the Shop was dodging a warranty job. Then the engineer asked me if I used old plastic jerrycans for my fuel - and of course I do, very old.

A little blushing and filtering later and I can confirm flakes in the fuel - see pic below. The can is a 1996 vintage Scepter 20L, made in Canada for petrol etc. The engineer was of the opinion that plastic cans were better than metal, but that they have a shelf life - maybe ethanol is an issue for some? Maybe it's just age.

Hands up who has fuel cans off the Ark?

Hmmm!!

[willk]

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

Hmmm!!

Your Sceptors are MUCH fresher!

[GuyC]

Could that not be the ethanol that has separated from the fuel due to the presence of water vapour?

I think it is called phase separation.

[ShinyShoe]

Ethanol was a colourless liquid last time I checked.

I thought the issue with ethanol was it may affect plastics and rubbers AND it absorbs moisture which petrol doesn't.

The moisture can then separate out and or cause corrosion.

All(most) plastics contain plasticisers etc. Tiny amounts will be leached out into any solvent over time. That's the whole BPA thing with food plastics. If 27 years later there is not enough plasticiser left, the plastic can be more rigid and a scratch becomes a crack or pealing layer... Much like a rusty bit in a metal can...

[GuyC]

Originally Posted by ShinyShoe

Ethanol was a colourless liquid last time I checked.

It's only a colourless liquid until water contamination causes it to separate out

https://www.bellperformance.com/blog...tion-water-e10

[A1an]

I used to be sceptical about the whole ethanol scaremongering stories.

I’m converted, ethanol fuel IS the devil, Ive seen too many gooey fuel lines, clogged filters and stale fuel in the last 18mnths for it to be anything else. Come to think of it it’s all from the same fuel station.

[willk]

Originally Posted by ShinyShoe

...the plastic can be more rigid and a scratch becomes a crack or pealing layer... Much like a rusty bit in a metal can...

^ This is probably the best fit for what I'm seeing here. The engineer described it as "the lining" from an old tank, but flaking would fit well.

He also mentioned that wet & dirty fuel was at the root of a lot of his work.

[ShinyShoe]

Originally Posted by GuyC

It's only a colourless liquid until water contamination causes it to separate out

https://www.bellperformance.com/blog...tion-water-e10

If I take 96% ethanol and add it to water. The water goes cloudy and usually goes clear again. There is probably a critical point at which is doesn't in terms of concentration.

But at no point does ethanol plus water give a solid.

It's possible water ± ethanol + whatever other crazy stuff is in petrol can form a polymer as solidify. It's possible that happens when the ethanol evaporated off. What Willk is showing looks like solid flakes. I'd expect something sticky because there will still be some water, ethanol and petrol so I doubt it is flakey...

[Trello]

Originally Posted by willk

Hands up who has fuel cans off the Ark?

The number of old petrol containers I have in my garage bears a direct relationship to the number of times I have run out of fuel (in my car) over the years and had to do the walk of shame to the nearest petrol station.[emoji4]

I once did it having picked up a young woman for our first date. She walked to the petrol station with me... and then walked off. Never saw her again. [emoji17]

[willk]

Originally Posted by Trello

She walked to the petrol station with me... and then walked off. Never saw her again. [emoji17]Attachment 142885

A good test of Character - she wasn't a Keeper.

Add a 20L to your can collection and that's how many I drilled and skipped. And I kept a fresh one!

I now find myself with engines running 100% gas, 50:1 and 40:1, usage peaking at different times over the year. I'll need to sort a couple of small yet good quality cans for dispensing into.

[Fenlander]

Best plastic fuel cans in my opinion are the ones sold by Yamaha dealers, made by Scepter I think. I have the 5l and 10l. They are strong, a nice shape and stable. The integral spout arrangement is good too. The caps have a ratchet that prevents accidental loosening. All in all a very well designed can.

https://www.mes-marine-shop.co.uk/pr...tank-jerry-can

[Trello]

Originally Posted by willk

A good test of Character - she wasn't a Keeper.



Add a 20L to your can collection and that's how many I drilled and skipped. And I kept a fresh one!



I now find myself with engines running 100% gas, 50:1 and 40:1, usage peaking at different times over the year. I'll need to sort a couple of small yet good quality cans for dispensing into.

I think you are being very generous there, Will - I think the fact of the matter is that she actually just saw sense![emoji57]

So how long do you intend to keep your new plastic cans before chucking them?

[Trello]

Originally Posted by Fenlander

Best plastic fuel cans in my opinion are the ones sold by Yamaha dealers, made by Scepter I think. I have the 5l and 10l. They are strong, a nice shape and stable. The integral spout arrangement is good too. The caps have a ratchet that prevents accidental loosening. All in all a very well designed can.

https://www.mes-marine-shop.co.uk/pr...tank-jerry-can

Is the integral spout reasonably leak-proof, David? I seem to spill as much fuel as I decant.

[Fenlander]

Yep totally leakproof when the spout reversed in the can and pours neatly when the spout is on. I honestly couldn't better the design.

>>> ...having picked up a young woman for our first date. She walked to the petrol station with me... and then walked off. Never saw her again...

My totally true fuel/female story.... Back in the 70s as a late teen I worked 10pm to 8am at an all night fuel station on the A1. An American serviceman came in and filled up but turned out to have no means of paying. He wanted to nip back the 15ml round trip to his base for some pounds. I said I'd take his nice watch and hold it as deposit until his return. He refused and said he'd rather leave his (English) girlfriend and he'd be back soon. She walked into the place... I made her a coffee and we chatted... she seemingly accepted her inferior value to him vs his watch... I worried I might be stuck with her if it turned out to be the most crafty dumping method... but about thirty mins later he returned and paid. A bizarre experience and one of many at that place.

[Trello]

That story, David, is both shocking and hilarious in equal measure. What were you supposed to have done had she tried to leave? Grapple her to the ground and hold her captive?

If I were to do the same to the current Mrs Trello (I call her that to stop her becoming complacent [emoji57]), the explosion would score on the Richter scale....

[willk]

Originally Posted by Fenlander

A bizarre experience and one of many at that place.

I did my time in late night gas pumps (opposite a mental hospital in Melbourne) - you got what you got. We weren't allowed to keep spare wheels as collateral but back seats were Gold. I was never offered a Girlfriend in lieu of payment, unfortunately.

You may have misunderstood the thinking of the NAC - he clearly trying to determine the cut between Keepers and Timekeepers...

[willk]

In the interests of Full Disclosure, I should add that I have previously left Missus willk at a restaurant while I RTB to locate my wallet. My pace was kept up by the knowledge that she was working the cocktail menu as hard as she could...

[willk]

Originally Posted by Trello

(I call her that to stop her becoming complacent.

That explains Missus willk's habit of introducing me to others as her "first husband"

[Trello]

[emoji23]