Which 50/60hp would you buy?

[HUMBER P4VWL]

Originally Posted by NSS

Must admit I have been very impressed with my current Suzuki DF25. Very quiet and very economical, but have done less than 20 hours on it so barely run in.

Out of interest, have the etecs you mention done significant hours before developing faults? My use will be relatively light.

Nope. All within warranty, just, and v low hours, ie liesure use. Just a pain though.

[NSS]

Originally Posted by HUMBER P4VWL

Nope. All within warranty, just, and v low hours, ie liesure use. Just a pain though.

Just had a chat with an Evinrude dealer. He says that the 'no scheduled maintenance for 3 years' is a bit misleading, and suggests that if the engine is used in salt water that it should still be serviced every 12-18 months to avoid potential issues. If looked after, he says it's as reliable as any of the other manufacturers' engines he sells (including Suzuki).

[J.W.W.]

Hi,
Exept from being a former outboard mechanic and an active boater private, I'm also member of a beach life guard team in the south of Holland (NorthSea).

In this team we are using both Yamaha 60efi (2009) & 70efi (2011) engines and are very happy with both. Never had any problems with these, but their quite expensive to buy. We also have a Mecury 60efi (2010). Fuel consumption of this machine is also very good and never had any problems with this engine too. The Mercury was a couple of thousands cheaper as the Yamaha's when it was bought. From that opinion I would buy a Mercury again.

We have also had 3 Evinrude 60 Etec's too in the near past. These were quite loud machines compared to the fourstrokes and the fuel consumption is worse compared to the fourstrokes (10-20% more). All the three of them are not alive anymore, because they all fell of the bracket between the fourth and fifth year of usage.

Good luck buying!

[NSS]

Originally Posted by J.W.W.

Hi,
Exept from being a former outboard mechanic and an active boater private, I'm also member of a beach life guard team in the south of Holland (NorthSea).

In this team we are using both Yamaha 60efi (2009) & 70efi (2011) engines and are very happy with both. Never had any problems with these, but their quite expensive to buy. We also have a Mecury 60efi (2010). Fuel consumption of this machine is also very good and never had any problems with this engine too. The Mercury was a couple of thousands cheaper as the Yamaha's when it was bought. From that opinion I would buy a Mercury again.

We have also had 3 Evinrude 60 Etec's too in the near past. These were quite loud machines compared to the fourstrokes and the fuel consumption is worse compared to the fourstrokes (10-20% more). All the three of them are not alive anymore, because they all fell of the bracket between the fourth and fifth year of usage.

Good luck buying!

Many thanks for that. Very useful

[HUMBER P4VWL]

Originally Posted by J.W.W.

Hi,


All the three of them are not alive anymore, because they all fell of the bracket between the fourth and fifth year of usage.

Good luck buying!

Really. Interesting Kerny!

[kerny]

Originally Posted by J.W.W.

All the three of them are not alive anymore, because they all fell of the bracket between the fourth and fifth year of usage.

Good luck buying!

When you say they all fell of the bracket do you mean the transom saddle ?? Can you elaborate please.

As for fuel consumption my 60 Etec pushing a 5.4 rib is exellent.

[matt h]

Mobile Marine engineers were doing the new Merc 60 four stroke for 5k with smartcraft etc. seems to be a good deal, with ref the the Etec, ive never been a fan, they just seem to have a shit load of issues more so than any other make.does anyone use them commercially ? rescue organisations etc ? they do look good tho and go well. with the right prop the hole-shot and acceleration is superb.

[9D280]

Beware lumping all engines by one manufacturer together.

The old Clamshell issues that have given them a bad name are a prime example- i rebuilt mine with many Merc designed mods not found on the engine i bought.

Problem is global perception of that engine is one of powerhead destroying unreliability. By the of of production 20 odd years later they were pretty good, but sh!t sticks...

60hp, 83kg, 0.83L / nautical mile. I can live with that.

Moral of post: do your research, and remember your proverbial meat might be the next owner's poison...

[Turbodiesel]

Originally Posted by Boats&Outboards

I think that's pretty wise all things considered. They are all battling against each other and it's a tough industry right now.

I was chatting with our supplier for new motors and he said they are killed by the mail order options out there offering them at almost cost price just to get the deal. The money is all in the servicing so it's hard to see where these suppliers make it worthwhile, as chances are they won't go back for a service if the distance is restrictive.

"POA" pricing gives them at least one chance (when you enquires) to seal the deal.

Totally agree, we dont put prices on our website mainly because we cannot compete with many of the big dealers offering massive discount and pretty much selling for cost price plus a few quid. Also there are so many bargains coming out of the factory the buying prices change quite often so we now do individual prices if some one wants. Plus if its a big engine say 60hp plus i will call the factory first and see what sort of a deal we can get, so then we can try and compete with the bigger online dealers.

Anyway buy a Mercury/Mariner better than all the other engines!!

[thomas]

Merc/Mariner don't seem to be getting much airtime, aren't Mercury the ones who invent and the others follow.

As for warantees, most are not worth anything, go and speak to an approved engineer and find out how easy it is to claim, the smallest thing out of place and it will be void.

[spartacus]

5 pages on which 4-stroke 50/60hp engine is best? This is like the tow-car thread!

If you're buying new, then any of the big manufacturers including Yamaha, Honda, Mercury, Mariner are going to be fine for leisure-use. I'll avoid the E-Tec debate which is bubbling just now. Anyone mentioned Tohatsu?

Couple of other things you should factor in:

Rigging: Expect to pay up to £500 for dealer to mount the engine on the transom and install instruments, steering, throttle cables, etc.

Security: With engine theft seemingly rife just now, make sure you fit a half-decent engine lock as a matter of course and know how the boat will be stored. Your insurance company will advise on what precautions they expect you to reasonably undertake - especially on a brand-new engine. Yamaha's Y-Cop is a step in the right direction. Available on engines above 30hp.
Y-COP

[Downhilldai]

or Selva...

[ppenman]

As a private owner I've owned the following outboards all without problem.

2 Johnson
3 tohatsu
4 yamaha
4 Suzuki and
A mariner

However for some reason I feel happiest with the Yamaha outboards maybe because I've worked with Yamaha engine development guys when I worked in automotive R and D and also owned a number of very fastYamaha motorbikes . I'm sure their marine side are similarly competent hence my perception although I have no data to back that they are reliable.

However, when my Suzuki df150 was stolen last year I really fancied an etec 150 and got a number of quotes etc. but was put off after performing a number of Internet searces on reliability, rejected warranty claims, time to get fixed etc. as such I got another Suzuki.

My mates had a new etec 90 some years ago which was constantly going wrong. After some time and arguing this was replaced under warranty after lawyers became involved but this engine was no better despite there supposedly having been an engine upgrade for the new engine. Eventually the dealer (after yet more lawyers) replaced it with a Suzuki. These were both very low hours engines. For me boating is meant to be fun and relaxing and I think if I'd bought the etec I would always have had doubts about reliability.

[clydeoutboards]

Originally Posted by thomas

Merc/Mariner don't seem to be getting much airtime, aren't Mercury the ones who invent and the others follow.

As for warantees, most are not worth anything, go and speak to an approved engineer and find out how easy it is to claim, the smallest thing out of place and it will be void.

sorry I 100% disagree with the warranty statement. Honda are paranoid about their brand and we have never had a problem on the few times we have put in warranty calls even when it is dubious about what caused it. I also know yam are the same.

re Tohatsu. again a good make but they would fall in the Merc/ Mariner/ Suzuki, bracket and not in the same league as the very respected Yam, or Honda with their 6 year / 2 commercial year warranty.

[thomas]

Maybe I was a bit unfair but never had an experience with Honda.

The most important factor is re sale value as you're probably going to sell it before it get too old and Yamahas hold their price better than any other - on the flip side, as they are more valuable they're also attractive to thieves.

Modern engines are going to perform in a similar way and on leisure craft are not really stretched when it comes to reliability - just look at some of the ancient things they use in Asia, they get little or no maintenance and seem to have throttles that are either full or off but seem to go on forever, we tend not to realise how fussy we are sometimes.

Originally Posted by Downhilldai

or Selva...

Selva 4 strokes are Yams, 2 strokes have very poor reputation

[NSS]

Many thanks all for your input. I think I've heard enough horror stories to cross the E-Tec off of my list, and sufficient positives to bring Mercury/Mariner into contention.

In summary, I guess this is what you're all telling me.

Yamaha - Very reliable strong residual values but premium price. Y-COP security.
Honda - Very reliable, great warranty/back-up but again pricey.
Suzuki - Seems to be in same bracket as the above, and I already have (limited) positive experience of.
Mercury/Mariner - Certainly worth a look. May not be quite up there in terms of quality/reliability/residuals of Japanese options, but priced accordingly.

Please feel free to add further experiences, but as things stand those are the manufacturers that I'll be concentrating on at the boat show.

Cheers

[Black]

I was in the same situation a couple of years ago.

I choose a Honda, for the following reasons it suited us;

1.the dealer is 100 yds from where I keep the boat
2.lightest 4 stroke I could find at the time
3.once I actually spoke to the dealer and negotiated a bit best total price to supply and fit bar an ETEC which I had ruled out.

In hindsight the most important thing for me is the access to the dealer - I ring John up and his lad pops up with the fork lift, tows it down the lane, services and puts it back again - sorted.

I can't emphasis how much easier this makes my life as I'm not lucky enough to be there permanently!

[Downhilldai]

Originally Posted by thomas

Selva 4 strokes are Yams...

Spoilsport - that could have run for a bit.

[NSS]

Hmmm! Now I have a real conundrum. Have been offered a brand new Etec 60 at a VERY attractive price - over £1200 cheaper than the Suzi DF60.

£1200 buys a lot of time on the water.

Do I chance it?

[PeterM]

Originally Posted by NSS

Hmmm! Now I have a real conundrum. Have been offered a brand new Etec 60 at a VERY attractive price - over £1200 cheaper than the Suzi DF60.

£1200 buys a lot of time on the water.

Do I chance it?

Nope- there will always be a reason its cheaper ....

Its the boat show next week - I'd get down there , show the Honda & Yam guys you are 100% serious - show them the Etec quote ( if its in writing - if not get it ) and job done ?