Pulling VHF cable

Bucksribster · 10 July 2022, 07:27

I have to run a replacement VHF cable from the consul to the antenna on the A frame at the back on my RC585. Any tips on how to join the old and new cables to ensure they do not part or get stuck when I pull them through?

Jon Tallis · 10 July 2022, 08:31

Use the old cable to pull a cord (a mouse) the full length of the cable run, then use the mouse to pull in the new cable.
If you can get to any cable exits en-route, do it in sections rather than one pull.
Space of probably going to stop you tying the cord to the cable so overlap the two by at least a foot, wrap really tightly with electrical tape, turn the last 2-3 inches of cord back over the tape and re-wrap it to stop it pulling out. Make the transition from cord to cable smooth with tape.
Take your time pulling in the new cable

GuyC · 10 July 2022, 08:36

If you are going to use the old cable to pull the new one through, I tend to slit the casing of the old cable for about 6" and remove the inner. I then do the opposite on the new cable i.e. slit the casing but remove about 6" of the casing. You can then put the new inner inside the old casing and tape the whole lot up.

You can then use lots of lube - I use silicone grease but only because it is what I use on electrical connectors.

The other option is to use a cable pulling tape which you can pull through using the old cable. I use the same technique to join them up but probably not 6". The tape should go through more easily as it is thinner. You can then use the tape to pull through the new cable.

Patience and swearing is what I find works best.

I overlapped with Jon's but the principle is the same.

willk · 10 July 2022, 09:16

All good advice above. I'd add the (obvious?) point, it's much easier if someone feeds the new cable in as you pull the mouse)old cable out. Much easier...

Nasher · 10 July 2022, 10:02

It's one of my pet annoyances(I have many) that boat builders do not leave a mouse line of well over twice the length of the conduit in place when they fit out the boat.

If it's the owner or a paid professional, both would really appreciate it when upgrading or adding additional equipment.

Bucksribster · 10 July 2022, 11:19

Thanks for the advice guys - appreciated. Fingers crossed!

Orwell boy · 10 July 2022, 11:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by willk

All good advice above. I'd add the (obvious?) point, it's much easier if someone feeds the new cable in as you pull the mouse)old cable out. Much easier...

This is good not so obvious advice ,we all tend to do these things on our own but this is so true ,the second not so obvious advice ,is pull very slowly ,the cord or cable can friction burn the fuel pipe causing a small leak into the trunking ,had this on my 5.3 ,Seamarks only found it when they fitted the new engine ,trunking was full of petrol and had to renew everything that went through the trunking

Oldman2 · 10 July 2022, 12:42

Pull 2 cords through and leave one in just in case if you have room.

This is what happens if you pull too fast or have no help feeding pvc sleeved cable. These stayed undetected in a 1963 build house until I rewired some 50yrs later.

IMG_1739.jpg

willk · 10 July 2022, 13:04

Another thing I do is lube the cable - most recently with silicone oil, rubbing on with a cloth. It's a mortal enemy of inflatable tubes so care must be taken. I believe KY works too

Jon Tallis · 10 July 2022, 13:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by willk

Another thing I do is lube the cable - most recently with silicone oil, rubbing on with a cloth. It's a mortal enemy of inflatable tubes so care must be taken. I believe KY works too

Silicone is a bit of a double edged sword - makes the cable more slippery but also encourages the tape joining the cables / mouse to become un-stuck. KY might just be a better option.......now where did I leave it......ah, there it is [emoji15][emoji15][emoji15]

jncunliffe · 10 July 2022, 22:28

I’ve always found Yellow 77 the best for cable pulling. It’s much cheaper than silicon and dries over time. https://www.screwfix.com/p/ideal-yel...B&gclsrc=aw.ds

CJL · 12 July 2022, 14:23

We use these on our RC585 to run the cables under the deck -
Draper Cable Access Kit
Best purchase I've ever made!

Make sure once you've got them through you pull the cable back and a mouse line so its easier next time you need to do it. Also it might be worth asking somebody to gently feed the cable you are pulling, into the duct just to make it a bit easier.

Good luck

Chris

jeffstevens763@g · 12 July 2022, 18:25

Use washing up liquid as a lube,I use a conduit threader never had probs

Bucksribster · 16 July 2022, 15:01

Thanks for all the advice, and a quick update on this. I have pulled the new cable through the A-frame to where it comes out, and have taken the ribber 'boots' of the access points in the conole and at the back by the A-frame. The problem I have is that all the wires from the A-frame are bundled together and wrapped in a curly plastic cover. I have unwrapped this cover back to where the cables disappear into the rear boot and duct, but it seems to continue into the duct as far as I can get my fingers in. So I cannot sperate the antenna cable to just pull that one, and I am reluctant to take out the other two cables they are bundled with (presumably power cables for the nav lights). So I think the only viable solution is to run the new cable seperatly using the tool that Chris / CJL mentions, which I have on order now.

As an aside I am having to re-run this, as it seems the screen in the existing cable is broken somewhere, as there is no continuity end to end. There is another coax cable that used to be for the GPS antenna, but is unused now, and that also seems to have a break on the screen. Odd that they should both have the same fault. The central wire is OK in both cables.

Orwell boy · 16 July 2022, 21:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucksribster

Thanks for all the advice, and a quick update on this. I have pulled the new cable through the A-frame to where it comes out, and have taken the ribber 'boots' of the access points in the conole and at the back by the A-frame. The problem I have is that all the wires from the A-frame are bundled together and wrapped in a curly plastic cover. I have unwrapped this cover back to where the cables disappear into the rear boot and duct, but it seems to continue into the duct as far as I can get my fingers in. So I cannot sperate the antenna cable to just pull that one, and I am reluctant to take out the other two cables they are bundled with (presumably power cables for the nav lights). So I think the only viable solution is to run the new cable seperatly using the tool that Chris / CJL mentions, which I have on order now.

As an aside I am having to re-run this, as it seems the screen in the existing cable is broken somewhere, as there is no continuity end to end. There is another coax cable that used to be for the GPS antenna, but is unused now, and that also seems to have a break on the screen. Odd that they should both have the same fault. The central wire is OK in both cables.

Yep that Ribcraft shambles with the Spiralwrap is a pretty poor solution and aloow water in ,have you not got trunking kit to your 140 here is a link to my en suite fitting which has improved my set up drasticaly ,might be helpful
https://www.rib.net/forum/f8/engine-...ket-84649.html

GuyC · 17 July 2022, 08:26

The link that Orwell Boy has attached has some good ideas.

The key is to make any penetrations through the deck weatherproof including between the cables. This is where the spiral wrap falls down as it allows water into the loom which tracks along the loom before finding its way out on the 'dry' side of the penetration. Post 13 in the attached thread is a potential example of that.

If you are using flexible conduit / convoluted tube to run your cables in, you still have to make sure the entry point for the cables is weathertight. You can do this with sealant or make a gooseneck so the hole is facing downwards.

In the right situation, spiralwrap makes for a neat installation as it allows the addition and subtraction of cables from a loom without having to resort to conduit tee's. It does however make pulling through other cables impossible as you have found out.

Good luck.

Bucksribster · 17 July 2022, 16:51

Thanks for this, and my last hope is to be able to run a new cable using the tool recommended by Chris. Not sure what I can do if that does not work.

As you say, the spiral wrap must give the possibility of water getting in.

I should have taken a photo of it, but the duct finishes in a moulded pipe that sticks up vertically from the deck. The rubber boot fits over this. As a load of other stuff comes through the same hole (fuel, steering hydraulics, power etc), I do not think there is any chance of re-routing it for example to a swan neck. If I can get the new wire down there, I will try and add some sort of sealant to stop any ingress. When the boat is stored, it is all under the cover, so it is only spray and rain when it is in use.

Bucksribster · 21 July 2022, 14:03

Further update - I could not get the tool CHris recommended to work. I tried fro m both ends, but I could not get it in even to the first rod. I guess the ducting has quite a sharp turn from vertical to horizontal, and it was that I could probably not get past. Very disappointing. As I am meant to be going down to Cornwall at the weekend, I shall run the cable along the inside of the hull where it meets the tubes, and then across the the console. I guess it means drilling a hole in the console, which I hate doing, and having a cable run across the floor from the side to the console, but I cannot see an alternative.

Orwell boy · 21 July 2022, 21:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucksribster

Thanks for all the advice, and a quick update on this. I have pulled the new cable through the A-frame to where it comes out, and have taken the ribber 'boots' of the access points in the conole and at the back by the A-frame. The problem I have is that all the wires from the A-frame are bundled together and wrapped in a curly plastic cover. I have unwrapped this cover back to where the cables disappear into the rear boot and duct, but it seems to continue into the duct as far as I can get my fingers in. So I cannot sperate the antenna cable to just pull that one, and I am reluctant to take out the other two cables they are bundled with (presumably power cables for the nav lights). So I think the only viable solution is to run the new cable seperatly using the tool that Chris / CJL mentions, which I have on order now.

As an aside I am having to re-run this, as it seems the screen in the existing cable is broken somewhere, as there is no continuity end to end. There is another coax cable that used to be for the GPS antenna, but is unused now, and that also seems to have a break on the screen. Odd that they should both have the same fault. The central wire is OK in both cables.

I think you have to get a s..t or bust attitude here ,you need to just pull that spiral wrap so it untwirls out of the trunking area ,that will let the cables hang loose ,lets be honest you cant make a poorer job than the original ,when you reinstate with new spiral wrap you can wrap it outside of the trunking and then little at a time push it down through tthe gator .....putting some antclockwise turn into it will loosen it and clockwise will tighten later
good luck

Pikey Dave · 21 July 2022, 22:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orwell boy

I think you have to get a s..t or bust attitude here ,you need to just pull that spiral wrap so it untwirls out of the trunking area ,that will let the cables hang loose ,lets be honest you cant make a poorer job than the original ,when you reinstate with new spiral wrap you can wrap it outside of the trunking and then little at a time push it down through tthe gator .....putting some antclockwise turn into it will loosen it and clockwise will tighten later

good luck

Agreed, the spiral wrap that RC use is an abomination & one of the reasons I chose to rig my current RC myself. I used proper rigging hose from the witches hat to the grommet on the engine. The hydraulics & other sundry cables come up the side of the hose. It’s all sealed & tidy.