Radar is it worth it ?.

[Garygee]

Just trying to spec the nav and electronics set up for my new RIB.
I cant decide if radar is worth it on a RIB, low scanner height, covering ground fast etc.

Does anyone have radar fitted if so how usefull is it, was it worth fitting ?.
Also any other commenst on radar in RIBS welcome.

Regards Gary(going to be poor after the boat show) Greenwood

[Brian]

I think it is.
Mainly in fog/mist and at night.
But also v. useful for giving highly accurate distance and bearing data of various objects (fixed and moving). For moving objects it will also tell you their speed and bearing.
Mounted on a rib, there are of course many limitations. But, when trying to drive through thick fog in busy traffic areas, it can be invaluable.
I would counsel the following:
-get an enclosed array scanner i.e. the bit that goes round and round is enclosed in a GRP housing. (many, obvious reasons for this)
-make SURE you get one that has an ARPA or MARPA facility. This allows you to mark another vessel on your screen. The software then tracks that vessel continually updating data such as collision info. Most systems will track up to 10 "targets" simultaneously. Whats more, it will do it much more accurately and faster than your eyeballs and brain!
-Make sure your scanner is mounted high. Above any possible zapping range of your, or your crews head, and away from other antennae etc. which may mask it's signal.
-Do not expect to be able to pick up other small boats.
-Make sure that the screen orientation is firmly in your mind and preferably is the same orientation as any mapping plotter you may have.
-If you are using a mapping plotter AND RADAR make sure they are both set to the same scale.
-If like me, you get TERRIBLY BORED on long voyages, it's a great "other" toy to play with!!

[Daniel]

I've looked into it, decided it's a great idea and i want one, just 'avent got room on current boat really.

Remember something about GPS aeriel needing to be mounted higher than radar - that makes sense really 'coz GPS is looking almost straight up i think.

[Keith Hart]

Hi

As far as I am aware GPS will look right down to the horizon. I say this because when you turn to the satelite screen it shows you which satelites it is locked onto and their height above the horizon. This is why it needs to be high so nothing else on the boat obstructs it. Modern GPS lock onto up to 12 satelites - hence Garmin 12.

Keith (ready to be shot down on this) Hart

[Daniel]

Sounds right keith - looks like we agree on it needing to be above everything else - i wonder what the radar picks up if you use a stainless extension pole to mount tge GPS aeriel on?

Don't always follow the rule though - my handheld is a GPS 48, but still a 12 channel parallel receiver. 12 is the maximum number of sat's the unit can monitor at once (in terms of the electronics). This number is derrived from the earths geomatry vs. the number of satellites and 12 is the max. you can ever see at once. From memory there are 24 in total plus 3 spares, there is quite a bit on this in the front of the almanac - including the all important translation from various datums (WGS 84 for GPS i think).

Dan

[Charles]

The GPS antenna has no height restrictions, as long as it has a clear line of sight to the sky.

I have had radar on three of my various boats and had cause to use the radar on only two occassions in 7 years?! That said, anything that aids safety at sea, if you can afford it, is a good thing!

[Flanker]

Just for your info, I use a handhelp Garmin e-map GPS on the windscreen succer in my car for years, it is obstructed by people, metal (roof), glass e.t.c. and never fails to give me a perfect signal, apart from the Dartford tunnel!

I imagine it is all the same, has to get a lock on three or more of the twelve. I don't see a difference between a RIB with no roof and a car.

My first bit if partly useful info,

Pete

[MarkWildey]

Radar is one of those things that you will probably never need depending on your luck !

Twice this year, once in Lyme Bay and once off Jersey I have been in thick fog ( <100m vis ) and I can assure you without radar it would have been a big issue.

Off Jersey it was driving on gauges only, so the combination of GPS and Radar was indispensable to making a safe passage.

Not up on the costs but I suspect that a Radar comes in at less the 1000. If you have the money and space on the console go for it !

Regards

Mark

[Daniel]

Just for the record i was considering a JRC 1000, and was quoted £599.

It had a 6" LCD and a 1.5kW 12" spinny bit - not sure if it has the aforementioned features though.

This is the only link i can find in my favorites... http://www.bethel-marine.com/JRC_Radar1A.htm

[seafariskye]

I originally was gonna put a radar on the 8.5 - and am glad i didnt - depending on what size rib its going on, i would almost gaurantee it would shake itself to bits on the a-frame??

I have been out every day (weather permitting) since easter, and would have used it once - get a good gps plotter instead.

You will also find that the warranty on a new radar will not be covered once the makers find out it was on an aframe .

Wait for the mist to clear (always best to look at this from the inside of a pub?)

Pete F

[Alan]

I personally believe that Radar is impractical on a RIB shorter than say 8.5m. Firstly you need a substantial radar arch or extension to your A frame to a) get a decent range and b) avoid microwaving your crew every few seconds! More fundamentally at any speed and in any sea its bloody difficult to use if the boat is bouncing all over the place as medium/smaller RIBS do. My experience is limited to Cyanide and whilst its a good piece of kit it was still difficult to use in rough seas. And thats on a 9.5 RIB. Brian is right that given a calm and boring passage its one more toy to play with though!

Alan

[Rene]

Hi
just my experience on this subject,

I have a radar on a 6 meter Rib, with the dome mounted on the a-frame, that gives me about 5-6 miles coverage, depending on the height of the target of course.

Normaly i have the range set to 1.5 miles, because then I will be able to see the targets just infront of me, and the other stuff further out, i will think about them when I get closer.

In the dark or in the fog, the radar is the number one navigation equipment. But you have to remember to use the radar even when the sun is shining, and you are able the see further that the radar. Because if you can't read the screen to knoww what the little dot's are in a sunny day, you won't know in the fog either. So normaly my radar is started up together with my GPS as soon as I leave port. And I wouldn't miss it. When your out there the fog can come in on you pretty fast.

And if you are in the fog, you are normaly going to slow down a bit anyway, so you have time to read the screen, and it can be done even if the boat is jumping around.

Regards
Rene

[Garygee]

Hi folks

Some interesting replies

The boats a 7.8M Ribcraft, inboard diesel so it not that small or light, but still not 9.5 M.

I was planning to have it about 18" above the A frame but I never thought about the vibration. Now I think about it the higher it is the more G the radome sees in relation to the boat and may be more suceptable to oscillation.

As we all do I never plan to go out when its pea soup fog, but was interested how much people used radars. The cost is a bit more than 599 Daniel, more like 2500 ! as I was looking at the Raymarine RL70 Plus intergrated to the chartplotter to give overlay, MARPA, linked cursers etc. (they dont tell you you need a 600 quid fast fluxgate compass the make everything work toghther!) I think the sets like the JRC1000 may be hard work to use not being same scale, orientation etc as the chart plotter.

From your comments I plan to ask some question at Southampton about warranty and A frames. I have already discounted Furuno as they would not give a waranty unless they installed or inspected the work whic put up the price quite a bit.

Things are still out a bit but I think radar has already dropped down my buying list.

Thanks Gary