Wiring diagram - Yamaha 115 AET V4 - Page 2

JSP · 05 July 2009, 10:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davie

Try another battery, I had a new one that had been charged reverse polarity and thats exactly what happens when your battery leads are on the wrong way!

Thanks Davie, but I know it's not that. It's had 3 different batteries on, 2 off 2 different boats.

JSP · 05 July 2009, 13:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by willk

Upon further reflection, I was just thinking that it was a while since we got flung in the bilges - should we "start" something? I don't think I could manage any personal abuse, but I'm sure I could rise to some innuendo, it being Saturday night and all

.

I missed this mate. Must have gone past it and onto the next opening. No offence but the next opening was allot tighter and helped me release my tension allot quicker.

willk · 05 July 2009, 14:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSP

No offence....

....none taken - knew you'd missed it!

JSP · 05 July 2009, 14:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by willk

....none taken -

Always the giver eh?

Bugger off you, I need this thread

JSP · 05 July 2009, 15:53

I forgot to mention that the engine was running fine before all this. And after I'd fitted the new cables and before this problem started I launched the boat and started the engine with out problems. Then this started to happen soon after.

DJL · 05 July 2009, 17:09

Have you got hold of a Multimeter yet? 5 min job to trouble shoot this if you have

JSP · 05 July 2009, 17:34

Not yet, home alone with the kids today.

jyasaki · 06 July 2009, 03:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSP

I'm really sh!t at electrics!
Found a wiring diagram of a Starter solenoid on line that is a bit like the one on my Yam as far as where the ignition connects to the battery lead.
How the hell does the ignition lead not burn out connected to such a high current lead???

Here's what going on inside:

The solenoid has a large switch (basically) that is either supplying power to the starter or not. In and out are on the sides in your pic. Normally, it is open (not supplying power.)

That switch is controlled by the other two wires (coming out the bottom in your pic); those wires are run through a coil that lies between the wires. Inside that coil, floating free, is a magnet. That magnet has contacts that bridge the big-ass switch that controls the power.
When the keyswitch is off, no current flows through the coil, and the contacts do not bridge the switch.

Turn the key on, and current flows through the coil, essentially making it an electrmagnet. That drives the magnet up into the switch, and the solenoid starts supplying power.

The switched line sees very little current (just enough to energize the coil). The magnet and attached contacts are the things that see high current.

That's what a solenoid does: Allows control of high current conductors with small current controls.

Hope that's clear;

jky

p.s. Sorry, don't have a clue yet about your problem...

chewy · 06 July 2009, 07:03

Thought you knew which bit the smoke was coming off?

JSP · 06 July 2009, 10:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by jyasaki

Here's what going on inside:

The solenoid has a large switch (basically) that is either supplying power to the starter or not. In and out are on the sides in your pic. Normally, it is open (not supplying power.)

That switch is controlled by the other two wires (coming out the bottom in your pic); those wires are run through a coil that lies between the wires. Inside that coil, floating free, is a magnet. That magnet has contacts that bridge the big-ass switch that controls the power.
When the keyswitch is off, no current flows through the coil, and the contacts do not bridge the switch.

Turn the key on, and current flows through the coil, essentially making it an electrmagnet. That drives the magnet up into the switch, and the solenoid starts supplying power.

The switched line sees very little current (just enough to energize the coil). The magnet and attached contacts are the things that see high current.

That's what a solenoid does: Allows control of high current conductors with small current controls.

Hope that's clear;

jky

p.s. Sorry, don't have a clue yet about your problem...

Cheers for that

JSP · 06 July 2009, 10:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by chewy

Thought you knew which bit the smoke was coming off?

Ah that was something a bit different. When trying to get the RIB started to get to the trailer my dad tried to use a bit of fuse wire as we had blown the two we had, turns out the fuse wire was 30amp instead of 20amp and a bit of smoke appeared before I could rip the leads off the battery.

chewy · 06 July 2009, 10:39

Ahh, so where was the smoke coming from?

JSP · 06 July 2009, 11:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by chewy

Ahh, so where was the smoke coming from?

The fuse

PeterM · 06 July 2009, 12:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSP

Ah that was something a bit different. When trying to get the RIB started to get to the trailer my dad tried to use a bit of fuse wire as we had blown the two we had, turns out the fuse wire was 30amp instead of 20amp and a bit of smoke appeared before I could rip the leads off the battery.

Is it since this 'smoking' that you have the probs ? Has somehting melted together somewhere - shorting things & blowing fuses each time you switch it on ? HAve I Missed something ?

You have my sympathy - I hate electrics - usually they take weeks to find the problem then fixed in a few minutes ! The problems are mostly simple in my experiance - most engine electrics are also simple - but not when you have hundreds of simple things running off the same wires !

Good luck

JSP · 06 July 2009, 13:29

No the smoke was after this all started as we needed to get the RIB back to the trailer.
It's the ultimate ball ache!

Used a little 2.5hp to move it in the end. And it went really well. Just kept flying off the transom as it had nothing to grip on to.

With the neg wire sparking so bad when it touches the neg terminal on the battery. Could this be something to do with the Stator ?

PeterM · 06 July 2009, 14:20

Sounds to me if its sparking when you connect the battery then either something large is trying to pull power all the time (even with the switches off) , or there is a big short somewhere !

Probably not much help - but if I was closed I'd offer to come round & help (drink tea while looking at it and agreeing something was not right)

chewy · 06 July 2009, 14:41

I offered to do him a breakfast and watch my brother work on it but apparently he's having to use his trailer to put a boat mould on.

PeterM · 06 July 2009, 14:45

Never forget the more tea you drink while looking at a problem like this is directly proportional to the chances you have of fixing it !

Poly · 06 July 2009, 20:22

John - are you getting anywhere? I think you might be on a red herring looking for the fault with the starter solenoid. I've just looked at your wiring diagram, and the fuse does not just protect the starter circuit - but I think all the gauges/instruments/alarms etc too. i.e. its one fuse for everything that is turned on when the engine is on.

In terms of the "short" you are looking for. If it blows a 20A fuse at 12V it will have a resistance of ~ 0.6 Ohm. I would be suspicious of anything reading less than 1 Ohm on a cheap multimeter, and would probably expect each circuit to be >3-4 Ohm so that multiple things can be on at once.

doggypaddle · 06 July 2009, 20:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polwart

John - are you getting anywhere? I think you might be on a red herring looking for the fault with the starter solenoid. I've just looked at your wiring diagram, and the fuse does not just protect the starter circuit - but I think all the gauges/instruments/alarms etc too. i.e. its one fuse for everything that is turned on when the engine is on.

In terms of the "short" you are looking for. If it blows a 20A fuse at 12V it will have a resistance of ~ 0.6 Ohm. I would be suspicious of anything reading less than 1 Ohm on a cheap multimeter, and would probably expect each circuit to be >3-4 Ohm so that multiple things can be on at once.

I would agree, there is a short and a big one, and its absolutley nothing to do with the starter solenoid or starter .a neat trick i learned is to replace the fuse with a 21 watt bulb from a car indicator or a 55 watt headlight bulb. this allows you to connect the battery and wiggle all the wiring around/disconnect various wires until the lamp dims or goes out when you find the short. works every time for me

cracking visual indicator and current limiter.
i would do this and unplug the remotes to see if the short is there, then everything else thet the red wire feeds starting with the rectifier pack which is a common culprit.