Best Photo Boat - In the Long Run...

[B-more Andy]

Hey All,

I'm currently looking at two boats with the intention of using them primarily as a platform for water-based photography - . I must add I'm new to RIBs and powerboats in general but that I'm fully sold on a RIB being the ideal boat for my purposes.

So here's my current quandry -

I'm looking at two boats as follows:
- 2001 Apex A-19 Open with a 2001 Evinrude 115hp FICHT - Boat and motor in good condition - Ready to Go - I think I could offer $11-12,000 (which looks in line with NADA, etc.)

- 1998 Zodiac 600 SRMN with a 1998 Mercury 75hp 2-stroke - Needs work on everything - hull needs attention (bottom painted and some barnacle growth) plus some missing and broken parts (console door gone, 2-person jockey seats missing, bilge pump missing, electronics and running lights need rewiring and that's just what I saw) and motor needs complete overhaul if not replacement. Asking $5,000 (no idea of value as these aren't in NADA and none of this vintage on the market). I'm guessing another $3-5,000 to get it in dependable working order.

I guess it really boils down to my asking for opinions on which boat would be better for use as a photography platform in the long run. The Apex seems more consumerish and from what I've researched, the FICHT engines had some troubles though supposedly not the 115's. The Zodiac looks more durable and the console and jockey seat setup look better vs. the Apex's starboard offset console and bench seat, but she needs work and with a max HP rating of 150 seems underpowered with the old 75hp.

Arrgghh...a good problem to have to choose between two boats but any help and advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!!!

B-more Andy

[Lugnut]

To me this seems a no brainer. If photography is your main goal, go with the boat that requires the LEAST amount of work to get on the water safely!

If you're looking for a second hobby get the fixer-upper lol!



What will you be photographing? I recently started taking my gear with me when I go out and have picked up a few decent shots of herons, osprey, and the odd jet skier or two. I'm a canon guy and take a 70-200L. I don't have anything longer than that yet.

[PacificNWrib]

One of the most important things to look at is the condition of the tubes. Check the seams, sun fade or any signs of wear or leakage.

Second would be the transom for stress cracks and moisture.

Third, would be compression on each of the cylinders on the outboard. Even across all cylinders is ideal.

John

[prairie tuber]

Neither of those boats cause me to jump up and down and scream "Buy it!" Keep your eyes peeled for other options as well. Every so often some really good deals come up in the classified section of the North American forum. Also consider the RIBs that don't come with outboards, since finding a suitable outboard is much easier than finding a suitable RIB in North America.

[prairie tuber]

Here are some examples;


http://www.rib.net/forum/showthread.php?t=24366

http://www.rib.net/forum/showthread.php?t=23504

http://www.rib.net/forum/showthread.php?t=23108


http://www.rib.net/forum/showthread.php?t=22121

http://www.rib.net/forum/showthread.php?t=21825

[limeydal]

Hi Andy,
right up my street for this topic.
What is going to be your main "target" ?

I use my 5.5m XSRib for my photography in San Diego and is great.
www.Bayshots.com
The pod seating allows for you to hold on with your knees and steady yourself for the shot. I built a shelf next to the console to hold my Pelican case, so you can stash your camera away in a second if need be.
As you said the RIBs are great for this. Hard boaters dont mind you getting in close ,as you are really one big fender

The only problem I have is that if you are getting in between smaller sailing craft who are racing, then your wake can upset them a touch.
Check out the site below for a couple who have really got it together
http://thephotoboat.com

The small ribs they use are very manouverable and get in close, (but then you do need to protect your photo gear more.)
Also smaller boats mean smaller engines and less gas!!! Important for your profit line nowadays,
Good luck and post some examples soon

cheers Dal

[Lugnut]

Originally Posted by limeydal

Hi Andy,
right up my street for this topic.
What is going to be your main "target" ?

I use my 5.5m XSRib for my photography in San Diego and is great.
www.Bayshots.com
cheers Dal

Now THAT is a way to marry two hobbies!!!

I've taken my camera gear out a few times hoping for decent shots of the local birdlife, but I'm also interested in shooting the sailing club races as well. Unfortunately I don't know anybody in the local sailing club and I'd rather not just scoot up and start taking pics without prior notice ya know?

[jyasaki]

Should be able to hail the vessel on Ch 16 and ask permission.

Or, if it's like here, and they're racing, there's usually a committee boat that you can talk to.

Or, if you plan things better than I do, you could just walk into the sailing club and talk to someone.

jky

[B-more Andy]

Originally Posted by Lugnut

To me this seems a no brainer. If photography is your main goal, go with the boat that requires the LEAST amount of work to get on the water safely!

If you're looking for a second hobby get the fixer-upper lol!



What will you be photographing? I recently started taking my gear with me when I go out and have picked up a few decent shots of herons, osprey, and the odd jet skier or two. I'm a canon guy and take a 70-200L. I don't have anything longer than that yet.

Lugnut,

Thanks for the sanity check by way of helping me to remember that getting on the water ASAP is my priority vs. spending hours and dollars refitting/TLC-ing an older boat.

As for my subjects, I'm an emerging/aspiring/semi-pro sailing and marine photog and the RIB is the next step in my plan for world dom...err I mean taking my game to the next level. Everything you see on the site has been shot from begged, borrowed, or race committee boats which have for the most part been out of my control as to where to set up, etc.

Anyway check the site at http://www.andyherbickphotography.com/old/ . I'm currently working on a website refresh and that link goes to the previous version.

Thanks again!

Andy

[B-more Andy]

Originally Posted by limeydal

Hi Andy,
right up my street for this topic.
What is going to be your main "target" ?

I use my 5.5m XSRib for my photography in San Diego and is great.
www.Bayshots.com
The pod seating allows for you to hold on with your knees and steady yourself for the shot. I built a shelf next to the console to hold my Pelican case, so you can stash your camera away in a second if need be.
As you said the RIBs are great for this. Hard boaters dont mind you getting in close ,as you are really one big fender

The only problem I have is that if you are getting in between smaller sailing craft who are racing, then your wake can upset them a touch.
Check out the site below for a couple who have really got it together
http://thephotoboat.com

The small ribs they use are very manouverable and get in close, (but then you do need to protect your photo gear more.)
Also smaller boats mean smaller engines and less gas!!! Important for your profit line nowadays,
Good luck and post some examples soon

cheers Dal

Hey Dal,

I actually checked out your site from another post somewhere on the forums - killer boat! I'd love to see your pelican case setup as that kind of stuff is on my mind as I tweak the boat as a dedicated photo platform. I once rode along with another photog who mounted flower boxes lined with foam onto the rails of a fishing tower to hold his cameras while he was up there.

And I've thought about the photoboat.com idea but I'm developing a bit of a different business model than those guys which a larger boat really fits better with.

Anyway, see my previous post for a link to my site and thanks for the insights and support.

Andy

[Lugnut]

Originally Posted by B-more Andy

Lugnut,

Thanks for the sanity check by way of helping me to remember that getting on the water ASAP is my priority vs. spending hours and dollars refitting/TLC-ing an older boat.

As for my subjects, I'm an emerging/aspiring/semi-pro sailing and marine photog and the RIB is the next step in my plan for world dom...err I mean taking my game to the next level. Everything you see on the site has been shot from begged, borrowed, or race committee boats which have for the most part been out of my control as to where to set up, etc.

Anyway check the site at http://www.andyherbickphotography.com/old/ . I'm currently working on a website refresh and that link goes to the previous version.

Thanks again!

Andy

Andy, if you ever make it down to Solomons let me know. I'd love to grab a beer and talk boats and photography! I've been taking the gear out a bit and REALLY love the way these two hobbies blend.

[limeydal]

Hi Andy,
checked out your site and some nice stuff
We have a local "charachter" who does a lot of the race events and so I tend to stay clear of those. Still enough business with hard boaters and individual sailors to keep me busy at the weekends.
I attached a few quick shots of my setup. I originalt tried the case across the rear seats, but got really tired of turning around and too slow when I get buzzed by PWC users.
I built the shelf out of thick ply and secured to the console and supported the "tube side" with galvanized pipe.Not ideal, but couldnt stretch to stainless at the time. Made a windscreen from sheet ABS to give a little protection (easier to work than lexan or plexi !! )
The case slots on the shelf and is held by two quick release clamps at the front.
Works well and keep the camera safe on the boat and for carrying around.
cheers Dal

[slimtim]

I have been out in all sorts of conditions taking photos from my RIB. These are a few things I think make a good photo RIB and I tried to take them into consideration when building mine:

- Its got to be dry. The tube attachment flange on my RIB is angled downwards making it very dry, even in some real choppy seas. Some RIBs are just crazy wet (Avon 5.4 for example) which doesn't really help with getting the shot. See if you can test the boats out in a good chop.
- 360deg vision. There is nothing more annoying than tracking a moving boat with your camera only to have an A-frame get in the way.
- Stable helm position standing or sitting. Its always nice to have a driver who can mind read and predict exactly where you want to be for the next shot, but most of the time you end up driving yourself while shooting. In my rib i can sit and stand in a comfortable braced position while still using both hands for the camera.
- Dry storage. Necessary for keeping camera gear dry. If its real handy like Dal's then thats super good.

Hope that helps a little bit.

Tim

[limeydal]

Tim
definately agree with the 360' vision.I recently removed my 8ft antenae from the transom and replaced it with a 3ft whip behind the helm pod. You would be amazed how many shots were lost prior.
Now I shoot over the top of the antenae.
Also the A frames are great and really add to a Rib. But not for photography.!
The other reason my Rib is good for photography is the high bow on the XS-ribs (and many of the "European workboats" ) rather than tenders.
Very little spray comes over the bow at the speeds you are taking photos at.

Dry storage at a moments notice is essential! I have had several PWC users come in close for shots and then turn away quickly only to drench you with the "rooster tail"
As well as dealing with the bow wave from "considerate hard boaters who like to bob me up an down like a cork " after having their photo snapped .
cheers Dal

[Lugnut]

Dal, is that a 70-200 lense? The 70-200F2.8 is the longest lense I have and the only one I've had any use for out on the water.

I've been tempted to shell out a bit of cash for a larger lense but just can't justify it for hobby use ya know?

[limeydal]

actually its the Canon 28-300 L IS lens.
A touch heavy but great range that covers anything I come across.
And yes,it gets expensive
cheers dal

[slimtim]

Lugnut, a 70-200 is perfect for on water action, especially if it has vibration reduction (VR, IS or OS). Anything longer of good quality (ie 300 f2.8) is gonna be bulky, heavy, expensive and difficult to hold still while bobbing around. Don't forget on a DSLR 70-200 is equivalent of a 105-300 (on nikon)

I hardly ever find the need to have a further reaching zoom, I just try and get where I what to be before the action starts. I only ever find I need extra zoom if I am in another boat and have no control on boat placement.

You could always get a 1.4 or 2x converter, but they are generally crap.

[limeydal]

Tim
totally agree, the 70-200 is great for this stuff. In fact the Canon IS version of this lens is probably their flagship glass
Really depends on what you shoot. I earn a little on the side with shots of tourists on the charter boats.
Being able to "get onboard" and up close sometimes gives me that capability and a selling shot. Not arty or action packed ,but they like it as a momento.
Also able to fill the frame with the 300 on jet skiers ,without getting splashed is a bonus
As you said without a full frame sensor you have that magnifying factor; so your 70 ends up at 105 mm or so. Not that wide if you are trying to get full length on a tall mast or a close up over the transom.
I got tired of swapping lenses (not good in the spray!) and so found that 28-300 suited me great.
Love your new site and some great captures in there!
cheers Dal

[slimtim]

Thanks Dal. Might be coming down your way after my summer in whistler so I'll look out for you if I do

[Lugnut]

Originally Posted by slimtim

Lugnut, a 70-200 is perfect for on water action, especially if it has vibration reduction (VR, IS or OS). Anything longer of good quality (ie 300 f2.8) is gonna be bulky, heavy, expensive and difficult to hold still while bobbing around. Don't forget on a DSLR 70-200 is equivalent of a 105-300 (on nikon)

I hardly ever find the need to have a further reaching zoom, I just try and get where I what to be before the action starts. I only ever find I need extra zoom if I am in another boat and have no control on boat placement.

You could always get a 1.4 or 2x converter, but they are generally crap.

Hey thanks slimtim, I've gotten used to the 1.6 crop factor. Don't even notice any more! My lens is a F2.8 non IS version. I picked it up for indoor sports, basketball, wrestling, and Mixed Martial Arts. I could have picked up an F4 IS for the same price but I REALLY needed the wider apperature. I'm pretty happy with it

Originally Posted by limeydal

Also able to fill the frame with the 300 on jet skiers ,without getting splashed is a bonus As you said without a full frame sensor you have that magnifying factor; so your 70 ends up at 105 mm or so. Not that wide if you are trying to get full length on a tall mast or a close up over the transom. I got tired of swapping lenses (not good in the spray!) and so found that 28-300 suited me great.
Love your new site and some great captures in there!
cheers Dal

That 28-300 is very sexy indeed and I'll take a look at it in the future, right now I can't quite justify $2500 to myself. Maybe once I've been out on the water for a while, then again, I've talked myself into much more expensive toys recently (RIB) lol!