100N lifejacket vs 70N PFD?

Fenlander · 17 March 2017, 21:45

So we go sibbing... dont't take risks... are usually running below 17kts... daylight hours... mostly in the warmer times of the year... and 99% of time with 1/2 crew.

Currently I use a 100N foam lifejacket as I'm the one to enter the water at launch/retrieve so an auto inflate is no good to me and I'd rather foam than manual toggle.

But it's time I replaced as it's a bit long in the body and restrictive to movement... and I wouldn't mind a few pockets and attachments for torch/radio/etc.

So I'm wondering about a 70N PFD such as these...

https://www.decathlon.co.uk/ba500-70...06915_ii__vi__

Yak Rakau 70N Buoyancy Aid | Marine Super Store

Baltic SAR Flotation Vest 70N - Marine Warehouse Ltd

or perhaps this 60N...

NRS Vista PFD - Shields Paddling Co.

As usual thoughts positive or negative appreciated.

Poly · 17 March 2017, 21:55

I'd happily wear any of them for the sort of boating you do. The yak rakau, like many kayak jackets has the buoyancy distributed in a smaller but very thick part, so personally I wouldn't buy one for sibbing, unless you also paddle.

Given the cost differences it takes quite a lot to get past the decathlon.

The Gurnard · 17 March 2017, 22:43

Hi Fenlander.. I generally wear PFD’s and prefer them to a life jacket .

One thing about them that Im not so keen on is.. jump in the water wearing one.. and it tends to ride up over my neck / head. (I have a bit of a belly instead of an hourglass waist ..so the side straps as in the decathlon one doesn’t keep it down around my waist when in water.)

I stitched a “crotch strap” on mine to keep it down.. so if going for one.. I would suggest getting one with a crotch strap.. or some way you can fix one if it doesn’t have one...as not all have them.

Early part of the season.. I prefer my floatation jacket instead.. its got 80N of inbuilt buoyancy (XL size) .. more pockets than a Parka .. whistle.. windproof..hood..crotch strap ..rain proof.. etc .. so all in all ... is perfect for me in the colder weather (summer is often cold in Scotland as you know)

Max... · 17 March 2017, 22:45

I'm the same. 'Proper' LJ's when I had a RIB but perfectly happy with watersport type buoyancy aids in the SIB.

Been using the same HH for a few years now:

http://www.fieldandtrek.com/helly-ha...FRATGwodiPcDng

Fenlander · 17 March 2017, 23:16

Thanks guys. No we don't intend to paddle Poly... well apart from shallows and the nightmare that investment in a 2016 OB proves less than reliable! So no need for the false pregnancy kayak specials.

Yes the Tribord BA500 70N at Decathlon is a value deal...

https://www.decathlon.co.uk/ba500-70...06915_ii__vi__

Your HH Rider looks similar value Max.

For me if money no object this Palm model ticks the slim look/big pockets boxes...

Palm Hydro Red | Buoyancy Aid / PFD - Canoe and Kayak Store

Poly · 18 March 2017, 00:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Gurnard

Hi Fenlander.. I generally wear PFD’s and prefer them to a life jacket .

One thing about them that Im not so keen on is.. jump in the water wearing one.. and it tends to ride up over my neck / head. (I have a bit of a belly instead of an hourglass waist ..so the side straps as in the decathlon one doesn’t keep it down around my waist when in water.)

I've tested many and find that more straps cinched tight usually resolves this - but if you find that is not comfy or your shape still pushes it up then you should be able to add a crotch strap to most just by passing the waist belt through this Single Lifejacket Crotch Strap - Marine Warehouse Ltd or for more comfort this Twin Life jacket Crotch Straps - Marine Warehouse Ltd

[cheaper alternatives are available - these were just reasonably clear pics!]

HDAV · 18 March 2017, 01:04

I have been using one of these for years (older model) but lasted very well keep thinking of replacing it but but then think why bother, I got one of the jelly Hansen ones for the missus and seems, to work fine.
https://www.wetsuitcentre.co.uk/o-ne...FUSfGwod3c4FSQ

The Gurnard · 18 March 2017, 09:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poly

I've tested many and find that more straps cinched tight usually resolves this

Yup..that makes sense to me Poly. Even a high strap under the armpit position is good design.

Sadly not all PFD’s are like that..my own one has only one side strap ..its very low down..has large arm holes.. with no belt at the back to attach a crotch strap to..which is why I sewed one.

In truth..its very comfortable for me in the boat without the crotch strap.. and even in the water.. the fact it rises up around my chin / lower face until my arms stop it coming too high over my head .. is not a real problem ... when I lie back..it behaves well.

However..when in the sea .. during my practice self rescue drills.. I discovered it quite difficult ..holding the PDF clear of my mouth with one hand .. and using my other hand to hold and operated the hand held VHF. The crotch strap cured that issue for me.

Pockets are great too.. and for me if I was getting another one..I would also look for one that has straps high up.. so I can clip the VHF to the PFD..with the aerial as high and vertical as reasonably possible. That way I can hear it as I go and know exactly where it is should I end up in the sea.

That’s only my requirement and they may not suit everyone..Im just highlighting some of the negatives I found with mine ..with the view it gives Fenlander some things to consider.

If I was renewing mine today.. I like the look of the O Neill one that HDAV posted the link to..but that’s only my thots...I wouldn’t recommend my own YAC one for the above reasons.

Poly · 18 March 2017, 10:27

Gurnard - yes I've used ones like that - and they do rise up...

Quote:

... clip the VHF to the PFD.....That way I can hear it as I go...

Fenlander I am not sure if that is your plan. It makes a lot of sense, beware however that at 15+ knots the wind and engine noise means all you will hear is that someone transmitted something.

Fenlander · 18 March 2017, 12:43

Yep the pocket and attachment thing is a good part of it Gurnard hence my attraction to that sort of "tatical waistcoat" style. I'd like to have the radio, backup handheld GPS, knife and torch etc on my person rather than currently where I have to delve into a dri-bag.

This is still my choice but struggling with the cost above others nearly as good.

Palm Hydro Red | Buoyancy Aid / PFD - Canoe and Kayak Store

Fully realise re radio Poly. In the situations we will want to use it we'll be at displacement speed... or becalmed. Re listening out for others in distress if we did hear something and could help that's great... but we're too small to be roaming the waters hoping to find someone we can tow.

Yabadabadoo · 18 March 2017, 14:24

Thanks for the post Fenlander I'd been considering options last year to replace mine and with no progress I'm in the market still. The Palm Hydro is very smart - get yourself one of those and the Decathlon versions to define who is Captain and who is crew?

I'd been wondering about the Chinese versions http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121910306465 so much bang for buck, but would I go to sea in it? Doubtful

Fenlander · 18 March 2017, 14:47

Hi M... hope all is well with you and yours. Yep I'd be worried about those direct from China PFDs just over a tenner. Nothing wrong with Chinese made gear when they are contracting to a supplier of repute (like Honda/Honwave) but the generic stuff can be risky. If they are filled with car wash sponge foam its going to get tricky in the sea.

Ha ha and if you want to elevate above captain there's always the Palm Rescue 850d...

https://www.wetsuitoutlet.co.uk/2017...92-p-6684.html

But wearing that you might be expected at the front of the queue to actually rescue folks.

Yabadabadoo · 18 March 2017, 15:36

Afternoon D, all good here hope same in return. Chinese versions could be a replacement for.. https://www.decathlon.co.uk/weighted...d_8313278.html that Laser sailors/racers are fond of/banned from wearing

Noticed the 850, even smarter and yes people would be falling over (literally?) to have you rescue them in that

Looking forward to your outcome, if I get a chance there's a large decathlon not far I might go and get a hands on look will report back.

Also looking forward to the South Devon/Teignmouth thread - think the area you've mentioned does dry out have a look at satellite/Google west of the bridge for the darker colour in the river, channel dries roughly to this point at LW, ground is walkable, mixture of sand/shell

Poly · 18 March 2017, 18:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fenlander

Ha ha and if you want to elevate above captain there's always the Palm Rescue 850d...

https://www.wetsuitoutlet.co.uk/2017...92-p-6684.html

But wearing that you might be expected at the front of the queue to actually rescue folks.

If you like that then this might be up your street: https://www.ndiver-rescue.com/arctic-survivor-pfd (I have an earlier version). However unless you actually need the rescue harness its quite an expensive part of it, that just gets in the way!

Fenlander · 18 March 2017, 18:29

Interesting link Poly. Their kit looks the part, sure it will be well made and prices quite fair compared with some.

They also manage 100-110N from the PFD you linked and their similar model the Evo Pro 5 at the same price....

https://www.ndiver-rescue.com/arctic...-evo-pro-5-pfd

Also their Rescue 900 at "only" £67-50 looks a bit more casual (less bondage inspired) but still is a 75N.

https://www.ndiver-rescue.com/rescue-900-pfd

jeffstevens763@g · 18 March 2017, 18:40

I have the NRS kayak ones too great with the pockets 50 N mine but I wear a dry suit as well, got auto and manual for when I don't wear the dry suit

HDAV · 18 March 2017, 21:52

I'm just used to wearing the impact 4 buckle type they are 50N but I wear a wetsuit/drysuit so waterlogged clothing isn't an issue I can swim in them and they are good if your getting wet perfect for zap cat racing, wake boarding etc but not perhaps so good if touring a lake or harbour? I don't know it's what I have and I'm happy with it, downside is it won't float you face up.

It's not a life jacket but isn't designed to be, it's for wet water sports, I have used the kayak types And they rode up when in the water and can sit too high on chest, but better for storage etc perhaps incorrectly I don't keep vhf on my person more through fear of loosing it when I go for a swim......

mikew4 · 19 March 2017, 20:58

You cannot make a decision on 70KN or 100KN without considering your weight and also how confident you are in the water.

The Gurnard · 20 March 2017, 11:49

Yup..I agree Mikew4 and its always a worthy exercise jumping in the sea with it while its pockets are full of the normal things you intend carrying.. torches .. spare batteries .. loose change etc..all add up.. and if you are not careful you may find a 50N one turns out to be 20N or less once you subtract the weight you may put in those big pockets.

Of course..it could also mean a 50N one is actually better ..if its full of floating gear.

Poly · 20 March 2017, 14:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Gurnard

Yup..I agree Mikew4 and its always a worthy exercise jumping in the sea with it while its pockets are full of the normal things you intend carrying.. torches .. spare batteries .. loose change etc..all add up.. and if you are not careful you may find a 50N one turns out to be 20N or less once you subtract the weight you may put in those big pockets.

Of course..it could also mean a 50N one is actually better ..if its full of floating gear.

And useful to try climbing back in with all that gubbins... You might find it impedes you (or you rip the pockets off - oops!)