advice on manageable weight / new SIB

[daveyirl]

Hey - struggling to make a final decision on a SIB and think I need some input and advice.

I live on the sea and have direct access to the water. I do not have a concrete slip or jetty or anything like that. But it is accessible.

I have a boathouse that is 5 meters from the sea at high tide and 30 meters at low tide.
the first 5 meters is of gravel /pebbles / stones and below the high tide mark it is all stones (& weed). see photo.

It is a gentle incline (noticeable for the first few meters and then it levels off).

I have a 7.5m RIB that I keep on the water for the summer (and that I spend a lot to run)!. I'm looking for something to use off season that is also portable for the odd trip away. So I have decided on a SIB.

90% of usage will be from home with 2 or 3 people. if going away , I will have 2 or 3 people with me to help with lifting & assembly.

I will leave the SIB assembled most of the time but I want to be able to move and launch myself.

Ideally I would like a 4m alu floor with a 20hp. In most cases, incl fuel and gear, I will be looking at 150kg.

what equipment would i need to move that? will transom wheels work? or will I need a trolley?

I will install a winch at a fixed point at the location so I can retrieve easily enough ( I think). How hard will it be to get a larger / heavier SIB down to the sea?

My fallback is a Honwave T38 with a 20hp (still going to be knocking on 100kg). If I thought it would be manageable I might stretch to an alu floor 4.2 with a 30hp.

I have no experience of handling loads on trolleys. I'm early 40's, 6ft (ish!), reasonably fit & healthy.

I think if I understood what weight should be manageable, I can focus in on the right SIB then.

[Fenlander]

Hello and welcome to the forum.

Weight of SIBs for easy handling has been discussed loads across various threads recently. In your case the surface will determine how you manage. With one helper I've moved a 3.8m SIB with a 20hp, 25l fuel and lots of day out kit using transom wheels on slipways steeper than your foreshore but with much better surfaces such as concrete. Weed, boulders and any other undulations will make it much harder.

If you have no need to take the sib out at your destinations so don't need to have transom wheels left on and given, I assume, you could leave a trolley at the foreshore without concern then a trolley with fat tyres may well work well for you. Something like the moon buggy Chipko on here made might be ideal, I'll search out a link for a thread where it's featured later.

Do not underestimate how every extra bit of weight makes moving over a slippery bouldered surface harder so as you already have a RIB I'd keep the SIB as manageable as possible for its very different use, particularly when you take it away from home.

[Steve509926]

Originally Posted by daveyirl

.....90% of usage will be from home with 2 or 3 people. if going away , I will have 2 or 3 people with me to help with lifting & assembly

.........will transom wheels work? or will I need a trolley?

I will install a winch at a fixed point at the location so I can retrieve easily enough ( I think). How hard will it be to get a larger / heavier SIB down to the sea?

.........My fallback is a Honwave T38 with a 20hp (still going to be knocking on 100kg). If I thought it would be manageable I might stretch to an alu floor 4.2 with a 30hp.

Hi & welcome, big differences between everything you are considering.

If you can guarantee that there will always be 2 or 3 people with you when your using your sib, weight wise you should be able to manage a 4m-4.2m ally floor sib at home on that beach if you use a chipko type launching trolley that Fenlander has mentioned, clear the beach of the bigger pebbles and use a winch. If the other 2 people are partner and teenager offspring, that puts a different perspective on it! I've found willingness to help set up/launch/retrieve has dwindled over the past few years.
Weight wise away from home, depends upon where you will launch and the vehicle you will transport in, and the number of persons guaranteed to help, and the condition of the slip.

Transom wheels will work ok on a slip, but on that beach I'd say they won't be of any use, they will twist, bend or snap.

Huge difference in size between a 4 - 4.2 mtr ally floor sib and a T38, I'd advise seeing them in the flesh just to make sure.
Same with a 30hp ob, extremely heavy and will be practically impossible to handle unless you leave it attached and use a trailer.

IMO most people with a 4 - 4.2 metre ally floor sib, leave them set up on a road trailer as they are too heavy and cumbersome otherwise.

[Fenlander]

Found Chipko's buggy, post 44 on this thread...

https://www.rib.net/forum/f50/elling...lse-87762.html

[User name]

Originally Posted by daveyirl

Hey - struggling to make a final decision on a SIB and think I need some input and advice.

I live on the sea and have direct access to the water. I do not have a concrete slip or jetty or anything like that. But it is accessible.

I have a boathouse that is 5 meters from the sea at high tide and 30 meters at low tide.
the first 5 meters is of gravel /pebbles / stones and below the high tide mark it is all stones (& weed). see photo.

It is a gentle incline (noticeable for the first few meters and then it levels off).

I have a 7.5m RIB that I keep on the water for the summer (and that I spend a lot to run)!. I'm looking for something to use off season that is also portable for the odd trip away. So I have decided on a SIB.

90% of usage will be from home with 2 or 3 people. if going away , I will have 2 or 3 people with me to help with lifting & assembly.

I will leave the SIB assembled most of the time but I want to be able to move and launch myself.

Ideally I would like a 4m alu floor with a 20hp. In most cases, incl fuel and gear, I will be looking at 150kg.

what equipment would i need to move that? will transom wheels work? or will I need a trolley?

I will install a winch at a fixed point at the location so I can retrieve easily enough ( I think). How hard will it be to get a larger / heavier SIB down to the sea?

My fallback is a Honwave T38 with a 20hp (still going to be knocking on 100kg). If I thought it would be manageable I might stretch to an alu floor 4.2 with a 30hp.

I have no experience of handling loads on trolleys. I'm early 40's, 6ft (ish!), reasonably fit & healthy.

I think if I understood what weight should be manageable, I can focus in on the right SIB then.

I've rolled a 4.5m SIB (100+ KG) down similar terrain with a 15HP 4-stroke on the back (another 50ish KG). It wasn't pleasant but it's doable with a single, reasonably fit person, far easier with 2 or 3 people. Mine is a bit chonky. You could get a similar sized setup with a lot less weight.

[smallribber]

Originally Posted by User name

I've rolled a 4.5m SIB (100+ KG) down similar terrain with a 15HP 4-stroke on the back (another 50ish KG). It wasn't pleasant but it's doable with a single, reasonably fit person, far easier with 2 or 3 people. Mine is a bit chonky. You could get a similar sized setup with a lot less weight.

Most people would find that set up way to big and heavy in my opinion and experience

[User name]

Originally Posted by smallribber

Most people would find that set up way to big and heavy in my opinion and experience

No offence intended, but from your videos you appear to be much older and likely not as fit as the OP (or myself).

If you read it again more carefully, you'll notice I described my particular setup as an example of what is possible to drag, but I still recommend something a bit lighter. There are other 4/4.5m boats that are much lighter than my Zodiac, and my outboard could be lighter too.

[smallribber]

Originally Posted by User name

No offence intended, but from your videos you appear to be much older and likely not as fit as the OP (or myself).

If you read it again more carefully, you'll notice I described my particular setup as an example of what is possible to drag, but I still recommend something a bit lighter. There are other 4/4.5m boats that are much lighter than my Zodiac, and my outboard could be lighter too.

I stand by what I said. In my opinion that set up is way too heavy

[Fenlander]

It will be interesting to hear the OPs feedback on the comments. Also I assume the image in post 1 is at high tide, I wonder what the stones/boulders look like for a low tide launch or recovery.

[The Gurnard]

Originally Posted by daveyirl

I have no experience of handling loads on trolleys. I'm early 40's, 6ft (ish!), reasonably fit & healthy.

I think if I understood what weight should be manageable, I can focus in on the right SIB then.

Hi daveyirl .. if it is any use to you .. I have plenty experience of shoving boats across beaches on my own.. so perhaps give you an idea of what is possible

I did it regular it for 10 or so years. My old highlander family fisherman weighed 160kg..the road trailer around another 100KG + ? so well above the weight of a 4.2m SIB on a launching trolley.

I was 50 then and no strongman but it was certainly doable. Two wheels clipped on the drawbar end meant no lifting..just shoving. Going down the beach is easier than you may think ..even on a gentle gradient ...



however to get it back up to the car ..I had a small electric winch that fitted to the car towbar. I couldn't get the car on the shore..and the road was too busy to pull the rope with the car. It was compact shingle in this location. I couldn't do it on soft shore ..but yes.. its possible as I proved many times. Would be easier on a lighter launching trolley too assuming same size wheels.



Sometimes if the shore was too soft..I used inflatable boat rollers ..that's one in the photo behind the boat.. its time consuming feeding the rollers under the boat ..pulling until they pop out the back end ..when launching alone but I was always keen to get out in the boat so wasn't put off. I just looked on it as part of boating.

I also shoved my 4.2m Quicksilver HD SIB with solid wooden floor ..across shores the same way. SIB on its own was 110KG plus ..and the same road trailer with the drawbar wheels and electric winch to recover it. I moved the 52KG 25HP outboard separately.



Of course there are many folks that don't like doing such things as you can see from the replies ... and if you are not keen.. you will be like that too ... but if you are willing there is a way ..


As mentioned Im was no superman and couldn't do it now Im 70.. but I do know it is very possible ..hard work ..but possible if you really want to do it. I did it most weekends in the boating season

[willk]

Originally Posted by Fenlander

Also I assume the image in post 1 is at high tide, I wonder what the stones/boulders look like for a low tide launch or recovery.

Well no, high tide is at the tide line where the plaggy crap is lodged. The weed-line further down is probably Chondrus crispus, so in the upper half of the interlittoral. Depending on the gradient, he mightn't have much further to go.

Peeps I know have cleared paths down similar shores, just lifting the bigger rocks aside which tends to reduce weed coverage as well.

Acknowledging Donny's input, I think I can safely say that Youthful Vigour & Guinness are the missing beach launch factors sought by others...

[The Gurnard]

I should have added ..that once in a blue moon..I would launch from a shore that I found I couldnt shove the trailer down to the sea . In these instances ..I either put the large plough anchor into the shore at the water ..or a large galvanised corkscrew thing for anchoring caravans..then used the electric winch to pull the tailer to the anchor / screw.

Anything is possible if you really want to do it. but only if you want to

Hey funny you mentioned that Willk ..I was going to mention gravy helps..but though it would not go down well with the soft drinkers :-D

[willk]

Originally Posted by The Gurnard

Hey funny you mentioned that Willk ..I was going to mention gravy helps..but though it would not go down well with the soft drinkers :-D

soft drinker?

'Shandy Drinker' is still an approved epithet on RIBnet BTW (but Southern Softie is Verboten)

[The Gurnard]

I guess age is catching up with me quicker than I think Willk..

I consider myself a soft drinker now .. I slurp more watery tasting Brewdog now than the real gravy .. although I still find the Guinness is better as a "Hair of a Dog that bit" after the Brew dug stuff

[The Gurnard]

I guess age is catching up with me quicker than I think Willk..

I consider myself a soft drinker now .. I slurp more watery tasting Brewdog now than the real gravy .. although I still find the Guinness is better as a "Hair of a Dog that bit" after the Brew dug stuff :cool




The problem with soft drinkers willk .. is they have no get up and go

instead ..they just say..nope..cant be done...we know because we have experience of not doing it

Incidentally transom wheels dont work on bigger SIBS..at least thats what I found as they tore off regular.

This is another way we used to launch heavy boats on stone shores ..ok there are a lot of folks at the boat in this photo. . but one ..or two can easily do the launch ..plastic ducting makes it easy as the boat rolls almost frictionless over them .. especially if you lubricate well with the small yellow shots before shoving.

The secret of beach launching is to keep its momentum going when it starts moving as it gets itself over the bumps that way.



Just roll your slipway back up when finished with it ..

[User name]

Originally Posted by smallribber

I stand by what I said. In my opinion that set up is way too heavy

Too heavy for what?

Originally Posted by The Gurnard

Hi daveyirl .. if it is any use to you .. I have plenty experience of shoving boats across beaches on my own.. so perhaps give you an idea of what is possible

I did it regular it for 10 or so years. My old highlander family fisherman weighed 160kg..the road trailer around another 100KG + ? so well above the weight of a 4.2m SIB on a launching trolley.

I was 50 then and no strongman but it was certainly doable. Two wheels clipped on the drawbar end meant no lifting..just shoving. Going down the beach is easier than you may think ..even on a gentle gradient ...

Fair play to ya. Dragging my boat is a walk in the park compared to that. You're a great example of what's possible when ya get your shoulder in.

[willk]

Originally Posted by The Gurnard

instead ..they just say..nope..cant be done...we know because we have experience of not doing it

It's always difficult to argue with the Voice of No Experience...

[User name]

Originally Posted by The Gurnard

instead ..they just say..nope..cant be done...we know because we have experience of not doing it

That's a cracking line. I'm robbing that.

[The Gurnard]

Originally Posted by User name

Too heavy for what?



Fair play to ya. Dragging my boat is a walk in the park compared to that. You're a great example of what's possible when ya get your shoulder in.

Ach ..to be fair User name ..that was in the days before forums..so my excuse is ... I didnt know any better

[daveyirl]

Originally Posted by The Gurnard

however to get it back up to the car ..I had a small electric winch that fitted to the car towbar. I couldn't get the car on the shore..and the road was too busy to pull the rope with the car. It was compact shingle in this location. I couldn't do it on soft shore ..but yes.. its possible as I proved many times. Would be easier on a lighter launching trolley too assuming same size wheels.

Of course there are many folks that don't like doing such things as you can see from the replies ... and if you are not keen.. you will be like that too ... but if you are willing there is a way ..


As mentioned Im was no superman and couldn't do it now Im 70.. but I do know it is very possible ..hard work ..but possible if you really want to do it. I did it most weekends in the boating season

A winch would be great there and there is somewhere I can fix it. I love the idea of using the winch on a pulley to launch too. I had thought about how to do it , but never considered an anchor. I think that will work really well and is a cheap enough solution too (and again, will have plenty of uses for the winch).

Originally Posted by Fenlander

Found Chipko's buggy, post 44 on this thread...

great thanks - really cool and helpful and focuses the mind on the right type of trolley.

Originally Posted by Steve509926

Hi & welcome, big differences between everything you are considering.

Ya I know - that difference is intentional as I know the lighter the easier. I will rule out the 30hp and larger items. Don't need the complexity so I am back to the classic alu vs air floor debate

Originally Posted by Fenlander

If you have no need to take the sib out at your destinations so don't need to have transom wheels left on and given, I assume, you could leave a trolley at the foreshore without concern then a trolley with fat tyres may well work well for you. Something like the moon buggy Chipko on here made might be ideal, I'll search out a link for a thread where it's featured later.

Do not underestimate how every extra bit of weight makes moving over a
.

Yes I can leave trolley there for sure.

Originally Posted by The Gurnard

This is another way we used to launch heavy boats on stone shores ..ok there are a lot of folks at the boat in this photo. . but one ..or two can easily do the launch ..plastic ducting makes it easy as the boat rolls almost frictionless over them .. especially if you lubricate well with the small yellow shots before shoving.

The secret of beach launching is to keep its momentum going when it starts moving as it gets itself over the bumps that way.



Just roll your slipway back up when finished with it ..

This is really cool. Some version of this is certainly worth planning out. I will be living here for a while and I am sure I will have various things that could benefit from such a system. I just need to watch the jagged rocks.

high tide is at the tide line where the plaggy crap is lodged. The weed-line further down is probably Chondrus crispus, so in the upper half of the interlittoral. Depending on the gradient, he mightn't have much further to go.

Correct - that is close to low tide at that time. Maybe another 8 meters out. At high tide I only have 5 meters to go, at low tide could be 30 meters.

-------------------------------------------

So thanks for all the help and the warm welcome.
I really like the solutions and creativity ye helped with.

I think I will go with the 20hp outboard to not overly complicate things and it will give me plenty of future options (and I don't want anything less).

I am thinking to go for the t38 to keep the weight down and when I have it with wheels on, I can see what challenges I have and which of the solutions here could help me.

that will be around a 100kg rig and the most expensive part which is the engine will be bought. I may add an alu floor SIB later (carbon pro 365 or 400) but it will depend on how the weight is and how I feel on the airdeck - maybe I will love it.

I winch is no brainer and the other solutions will def work as I move towards heavier rigs. I expect I will sell my 7.5m and go for something smaller and lighter and maybe some of these solutions combined will give me options for this.

I am still torn between the t38 and a carbon 365/400 but I think i am inching closer to going with the t38.