Advice please

[Spitman]

Hi, I am looking at the Europa 380 as a parent herding/coach boat for 2optimist sailors. We already have a double oppi stacker so I am looking at a boat with aluminium floor that we can take in boot of car. Is it super heavy to lift?What engine is best? Also I am keen to buy, new seems the easiest and most reliable method but££££££££ I would buy second hand but don't want any problems!!! Looking to act on this quite soon so all advice welcome, also alternatives? Dealers? Deals!!! Thank you

[Fenlander]

So I guess your use will be to arrive at venue setting up the Optis and inflatable then in the inflatable dash about after and between the sailors within a fairly small area and not carrying too much kit in the inflatable??

[Fenlander]

Assuming I've got your use right....

The Europa is just below the Honwave range in terms of reputation and resale values but even so I'm sure the brand would be fine for your use.... is there any reason you picked out that brand?

I would question the choice of model/type though. Yes that 380 is heavy at around 170lbs... heavy when manhandling into the car and also once assembled for moving about. The biggest problem though will be assembly time and faff. The alloy floors are a chore to assemble into the boat... particularly at that size. Lots of "It'll never go... straining and potential for cut fingers. Fine if trailed and not so bad if set up for a week or two at a time... but a pain for daily inflate particularly as it's a secondary focus to the sailing.

I've owned an alloy floor Honwave 3.5 which is a very similar boat and eventually gave it up due to setup hassle.... but if you have a strong pull to the alloy floor type I'd go for that slightly shorter Honwave at around £860 ( https://www.elyboatchandlers.com/hon...packages/test2 ) over the £1050 3.8 Europa (over priced unless they give massive discounts over their online price).

For your use though I'd go for a high pressure air floor model and for best all round performance a V type not a flat air floor. To me the ideal would be the Honwave T3.8 air floor at £1050... https://www.elyboatchandlers.com/hon...ie2-inflatable. Very easy to set up and only weighs 106lbs. Should you decide when thinking this through that a 3.8 is more than you need there is always the Honwave 3.2 at £880... https://www.elyboatchandlers.com/hon...honda-outboard.

If you did think the 3.2 large enough there is a trusted member on here with a used one at £400... http://www.rib.net/forum/f21/honwave-3-2-a-76884.html

If you bought that you could at least see if it suited and sell on at the same price next season if you wanted to go larger.

Re outboard and assuming you will be one or two up in the inflatable I'd not go below a 9.9hp and no need to go above 15hp. If you did go for a 3.2m then it might be worth looking at a used Tohatsu 9.8 2-stroke which at 26kg is by far the lightest motor in the 10hp class.

Hope there is something of interest in that lot.

[Fenlander]

BTW not my place to say but the mods may wish to move this into the Inflatables section??

[John Kennett]

Done

[ShinyShoe]

I'm not convinced this is the right boat.

Firstly towing your RIB to a venue, having two Oppies to rig / supervise the kids rigging, children to make sure get changed, registered, briefed etc do you really want to be assembling a SIB and putting an engine on etc. If it was a RIB on a trailer - you may find another club member / volunteer will offer to launch you while you do the necessary with the kids. They aren't likely to do so with a boat that needs built!

You will need 2 MEN lift for boat etc.

Secondly, on the water is it the right craft. You will spend a lot of time stationary. Perhaps others can comment but does it drift more than a RIB? More importantly though, is it the craft for righting a capsized dinghy from or for towing from? Yes you will be OK towing one it, thats quite easy in pretty much anything. But at an Oppie event you will usually be on a 1:8 ratio. If you want to be in the RIB numbers you need to be able to tow 8 oppies daisy chained in anything up to F6. Thats a big ask for a 25HP engine on a fully inflatable base. Perhaps others will tell me I'm wrong. If you aren't planning to be in the 1:8 numbers, expect even less help rigging and a good chance some venues wont let you launch.

Thirdly, you will want to carry some kit. Anchor, chain etc so that if you have a problem you can stop. You'll need 2 crew. Plus possibly snacks for kids, first aid kit etc. None of which has a home on a SIB. You need to be able to take a mast off an Oppy and put it in the RIB on the floor. (Towing oppies with sails flogging for long distances upsets darling oppy parents who just spent £550 on a new sail to add 0.01knots to their cherub's speed) - thats about 2.5m Will you have space to actually put that in a 3.8m boat?


Forthly - launching - No trolley - so launch wheels? I like launch wheels. I hate things sticking u on my RIBs when there are tow ropes, mainsheets etc involved. They just get tangled.

Fifth - If your Oppies end up on dodgy bits of beach - is a soft bottom the best thing? Certainly my club won a 4m+ Honwave in the Honda RIBs a few years back and paid to upgrade to a Highfield because they couldn't see the Honwave lasting.

So your problem is how to get a RIB there and back plus two oppies. You can put one on the car roof. leaving just one to worry about if need be. But you can fairly easily get a trailer modified to add a carrier. Heavier example than you need here: https://cache.apolloduck.com/image_b...jpg?1493144660

[Fenlander]

I must say my boat advice was on the basis the OP wanted to do this privately just for his own two children.

[ShinyShoe]

Originally Posted by Fenlander

I must say my boat advice was on the basis the OP wanted to do this privately just for his own two children.

He is an Oppy Parent. He might not know it yet... ...but he is!

[willk]

Originally Posted by ShinyShoe

You will need 2 MEN lift for boat etc.

Originally Posted by ShinyShoe

He is an Oppy Parent. He might not know it yet... ...but he is!

And his wife may not realise he's gonna be a sexist

[Poly]

Originally Posted by ShinyShoe

He is an Oppy Parent. He might not know it yet... ...but he is!

Have you accepted your own inevitable fate yet?


Spitman - ignoring SS’s gender imbalance, that probably comes from hanging around too many sailing clubs - he does seem to spend his weekends herding dinghies so there is some substance to what he says. I wonder if anyone here has even towed two oppies with a SIB in anything other than calm conditions?

If money allowed a FRIB might be both quicker to assemble and have better steerage for towing.

Would a boat fit inside an oppie when folded? A big sib will take up your entire boot (and possibly more depending on the car and there are presumably at least 3 of you). You’ve got all the other kit and clothes etc too. Sometimes sleeping bags, tents etc as well.

Depending how old/tall the kids are you might also want to think about future proofing.

[Deno]

In order to transport a rib and two or more oppi's this arrangement is what the oppi parent use in my club (the trailer, not the transporter)

[ShinyShoe]

Originally Posted by Poly

Have you accepted your own inevitable fate yet?

Nah... the little shoe is more interested in the RIB!

Originally Posted by Poly

I wonder if anyone here has even towed two oppies with a SIB in anything other than calm conditions?

I suspect as a daisy chain it will be OK (probably slow - but fine). Which is fine when you need to tow back a mile. When all you want to do is move them boat 200m and quickly because there is other shipping coming 2 alongside may be an issue.

Would a boat fit inside an oppie when folded?

I doubt it. It would end up on top of the dagger board case and its heavy. If it moved on towing that will be a big impact. But a lot of double oppie trailers have a box trailer as the base. That would do. Make sure spars etc can't be lent on by the boat in a bag if that's what you are doing.

[rossymtb]

I have owned a Europa sport a380
It was to big and heavy to man handle without a trailer.

I now own a honwave t38. Much better lighter and better handling boat.