Bent transom wheel brackets

[Tonus]

I bought a set of 180kg rated Osculati transom wheels (350mm) and fitted them to my Zodiac Cadet Alu Rib 360 last year. It's a pretty light boat (50kg) and the 20hp Merc on the back weighs about 46kg... not a super heavy setup.

I noticed last week that the brackets have bent/twisted making the legs flare outwards and now the axels aren't parallel to the ground. It's harder to push now and doesn't feel very sturdy.



I don't recall doing anything heavy duty with the boat - not dropped it down a big curb or anything. Has anyone had anything like this happen? I would never have thought the brackets would bend...


I've asked for a replacement or refund and the company I bought from has yet to reply...

I was never 100% happy with these wheels - the axel stem seems about an inch too long and I've puts some spacers in there to make them tighter. Perhaps the wheel sitting on the end of this long axel has caused the bend in the bracket by putting all weight over to the side?


Would you recommend that I take them off? Or maybe look at bending the bracket back in place? I worry that if they bent any more the bracket might snap and that could be dangerous or expensive or both!


Would shorter/smaller wheels like these do a better job? They're rated for 100kg - they seem a simpler bracket - two srcews and less to go wrong!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/174708510...AAAOSw8-1gXxs4

[Tonus]

Here's a couple of the pictures up the right way... also the drop-nose pins which have bent too

[Steve509926]

Hi Tonus, in the forth picture the bracket looks as though its been fitted at an angle, it doesn't look vertical.
If that's the case, I would suggest that's where your problem is.
I also don't think the wheels look right, they look far too narrow for that axle. Can you drill a hole through the axle and fit a split pin to stop the wheels from sliding along the axle.

[Tonus]

Thanks Steve - yes that port side wheel is slightly off and the twist in the bracket is making the leg skewed at even more of an angle. I've since fitted a plastic tube as a spacer (pictured) - you can see just how much play there was in that axel... not right as you say.

I think maybe when the wheel was sitting out at the very end on of the axel it was too much for the brackets and they've twisted. You can see in the pic below where the bracket has bent and come away from the wood - it's pulled away from the sealant...


Perhaps I need some of the Trem wheels that have the studs for extra support! https://www.trem.net/ruote-alaggio-p...abile-348.html

[Steve509926]

I'd take it off and I think with a bit of heat it would straighten up ok.
I'd refit so it's vertical though. It means extra holes but I don't think you have a choice. Fill the old holes with hardwood dowels and Sika or Gel coat (as per PDs choice)

[chipko]

Originally Posted by Steve509926

It means extra holes but I don't think you have a choice. Fill the old holes with hardwood dowels and Sika or Gel coat (as per PDs choice)

It’s an aluminium hull/transom.

Whatever wheels you decide on perhaps, to save any extra holes in transom, use the existing to bolt on a thick oversize packer, and reverse bolt new brackets to said packer.

A 50kg boat and 50kg motor ain’t no lightweight setup (Merc 20’s are a good few kilos heavier than manufacturers claimed weight) and will be well over 150 kilos including fuel and a bit of kit so go for heavy duty transom wheels....min. 180kg plus.

[Steve509926]

Originally Posted by chipko

It’s an aluminium hull/transom

Opps

[TmMorris]

In those first pictures the wheels look to have not been fitted correctly. By sitting so far away from the upright they will have been allowing a huge increase in force/twist against the bracket.

The wheels need to be as close as possible to the upright so as to lesson that force as much as possible.

The bracket not being completely vertical will have added to the issue but I suspect that if you'd fitted the spacers at the outset that you've now fitted then there may not have been any issue at all.

To get the bracket perfectly straight I think I would try and loosen the wood block, if possible, from the transom, leave the top, inner bolt in place and then use a circular file to slightly elongate the other three transom holes to line up with the new position of the block.

To keep my life simple I might see if just setting the wheels correctly would be enough to stop the issue reoccurring.

I have a similar set up and it's not obvious which side of the wheel the nylon bush in the kit fits and while the set up looks like it should be on the inside, pushing the wheel out away from the upright the increase in force would be not inconsiderable.

For the time being I've fitted the steel washer between the post and wheel but plan to fabricate a slim nylon washer by cutting one from the one inch thick spacer so that the steel washer can go back to being on the outside.

[Tonus]

Thanks all for your thoughts on this - TmMorris I agree with all you’ve said… even though the brackets are a little off I agree that they might have not caused an issue if these wheel had no room to move to the end of the rod.
I did question this before I fitted them but the supplier said all the other kits were the same.
There was no nylon bush in my kit - just the pin at the end - the black spacer you see in the photo is a length of plastic tube that I fitted all too late.

I think I’m going to buy some new Trem wheels rather than bodge a repair with a bent bracket. Might go for the heavy duty ones that slot into a low stud when deployed so that there’s no lateral movement…

Anyone know how to plug a hole in an Aluminium transom?!

[Oldman2]

A nut & bolt with a rubber washer each side should do it.

[TmMorris]

I've not been able to fathom why they make these systems with such long axle studs. The weld point of the thin hollow tubes to the uprights is a real weak point in the first instance and considering the potential load on them and that this load will get amplified in use by drops etc it's just asking for trouble.

I'm pretty sure they designed mine to have the one inch nylon bush on the inside as it's the only material in the pack that is suitable to be between the metal upright and the wheel. To me it's just wrong to have the wheel sitting so far out and applying such unnecessary additional force to what is clearly a weak point.

I wondered if in other markets a fatter wheel was used, hence the need for the longer stub axle and the bodge of a one inch packer?

As for filling holes, welding them up is the only true solution but obviously it's going to make a mess and also is a bit of an overkill.

I'd consider an epoxy putty. There will be one that works like Milliput but aimed at aluminium. Plug the holes and before it sets hard, shave the excess flush with a razor blade.

Alternatively, can you leave the bolts there to hold that packing block and for any new system via new holes through the block and transom?

[Tonus]

TmMorris that’s all really great advice - thanks for the epoxy putty tip. Still new to all this but been great getting stuck in.
I agree re the design - all I had in my kit was the long axle and a pin for the end… no bush or washer/spacer. The whole thing was a bit loose and shaken. Going to push hard for my money back on that one.

Looking forward, I wonder if anyone on here has installed a pair of these…

https://shop.chastheboat.co.uk/produ...pair-aq6-22014

[TmMorris]

I'm new to the world of SIBs also but have been on boats all my life. Have been enjoying setting up all the new kit. Some of it is really well engineered and other bits seem a bit borderline.

Those wheels look better as the stub axle looks to be integrated into the arm and the bend in the arm brings the wheel much more inline with the bracket. But unless you're launching over some rough ground you should be fine with what you currently have having added that spacer to bring the wheels in and if you bend back the bracket.

Something else that may not be relevant is have you set the wheels to be under the transom or have you got them sticking out the back of the uprights have a curve/bend on them?

Setting them so that they stick rearwards of the transom puts the most amount of weight on them. If they are the other way around so that the wheels are under the hull then you reduce the leverage quote a bit and also make it easier to manoeuvre which may mean fewer high load shocks on rough ground?

ETA I see you have got them under the transom.

[Tonus]

Thanks, well I’ll give it a go bending the bracket back into place. The actual legs look fine and straight when I took them off… there always seemed to be a couple of mm of unnecessary play in how the legs sat in the brackets so I might try to bring those in a little too.

[Tonus]

So I took off the bent brackets and they are worse than I thought - twisted and bent out of shape in a few different places, including the parts of the bracket that stick out to retain the arms. I've decided to get some new wheels that are undamaged and start again.

Excel have similar transom wheels which I have now ordered. Steve509926 kindly measured the brackets on his and they are the same...


The problem I now have is that the holes in my wooden blocks are not square and level as mentioned before, but are in pretty much the perfect position for the wheel's maximum width and space to fold up/down etc.

I think getting a circular file and elongating three of the holes isn't going to work as in order to get them square the some of them would need to be filed a good 10mm away... not pretty.
The wood blocks are stuck to the transom with sealant and are solid.. they won't budge at all without me hacking them off. Would it work for me to block the existing holes with dowel/putty and then drill new holes off a little to the side? I'd obviously leave a decent bit of space between the holes (10mm?)... how does that sound? if there were a little bit of the edge of the bracket hanging over the edge of the block I could cut a new bit of marine ply and slide it under to support...

What do you think?! Any advice would be great - thanks.

[TmMorris]

The Excel wheels that I have use brackets that have the same wheel fittings but not the same fitting bolt holes. Instead, the bracket has two fixing holes in the centre of the plates.

If the ones you have ordered are the same then you'll be drilling completely new holes nowhere near the existing ones.

Even if that's not the case then your thoughts on how to plug the 4 holes seem spot in to me. Lengths of quality birch dowel cut to be about an inch longer then the full depth of the block and transom would be my starting point.

I'd sand a very gentle taper to the end that is going in first and probably put it in from the side of the block so as to achieve the best possible finish on the inside where I'd see it the most.

I'd probably want a sufficient taper so that the dowel went at least half way through before snagging, then start tapping with a relatively light hammer via a wooden chock. My thought would be to tap the dowel through until it is 1mm shy of the transom face and then aim to cover that with some white sealant. On the exterior, the block, trim the dowel flush with a view to sanding the block and a quick lick of paint to seal and hide everything.

Even if your new brackets are the same as the old then this would still be the way that I'd plug the unwanted holes prior to drilling the new ones.

The density of the birch dowel will match the ply in the transom but it may be harder than the block, or the grain may be running a different way so I'd be extra vigilant when drilling the successive pilot holes as some of the early ones may be inclined to walk if they overlap the two woods.

The arms on my Excel wheels are possibly shorter than your current set up which meant I had to mount them quite a bit lower than where your block is. If you find yours are the same then obviously the existing block is redundant and it becomes more of a case of gently chiselling off the old blocks and bonding on longer ones to both take the new bracket and hide the old holes which I'd still plug as above.

[Tonus]

TmMorris thanks indeed - glad you approve of the plan!

The new brackets I've ordered are identical to the ones I have by all accounts so it wouldn't surprise me if the holes were the same width too. It looks as if you have the spring loaded 250mm's and I've ordered the 350's which have the capital 'I' shaped four hole bracket.

Good advice re the birch dowels - I just bought some - I have an Aluminium transom if you remember so will cut the dowel short of the metal on one side and use the epoxy putty on the interior... lick of paint on the exterior will definitely help to finally seal. My dowels are 6mm and so is the hole so they are not super tight... would you recommend I use 7mm dowel if I can get it? If not I might use a drop of Sika in the hole and tap it in...

What do you think about attaching a new strip of (painted) marine ply with some sealant for the overhang of the bracket? Might help a little to support, and should look a bit better too! I think relocating the holes should be ok strength-wise... 8/10mm of wood and metal between the edges of the old and new holes should be pretty solid...

[Limecc]

The best stuff for plugging transom holes is G/flex 655 but it's not cheap.

Lots of uses. If you ever happen to have larger holes like I had after removing some fixings, it's possible to add chopped strand fibre cuttings which will prevent sagging until it's cured.

[Tonus]

Thanks - I just saw it here. Not cheap as you say!
How about this stuff https://www.amazon.co.uk/JB-Weld-JB8...00KKPFFA&psc=1
.. it says good for aluminium.

[Limecc]

Originally Posted by Tonus

Thanks - I just saw it here. Not cheap as you say!
How about this stuff https://www.amazon.co.uk/JB-Weld-JB8...00KKPFFA&psc=1
.. it says good for aluminium.

One's flexible and the other's rock hard. Depends on the use case I suppose. I might get some. Probably more expensive by volume, the Gflex tubes are huge.

The theory goes that the problem using dowel is the grain is running in the wrong direction and won't compress like the surrounding transom when tightening the engine clamps/bolts, leading to eventual leakage. This where the flexibility of G flex comes into it's own. It even sticks to wet wood.