Car Folding Ribs (large car)

[nailseaNewbie]

Hi All,

New to sailing, but I'm thinking of getting a car folding rib for to try a little coastal exploring, possibly some water sports.

Since i live close to Weston, I was wondering if the limits on folding ribs were much different to normal.. for example could i take day trips across to Cardiff?

[Fenlander]

Do you mean one of these F-ribs which actually have GRP hulls that fold...

F-RIB 330 | F-RIB

... or did you just mean a normal inflatable (soft bottomed) boat that could be folded up?

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...e_Boat_-_2.jpg

New to boating... Bristol channel!!! There are strong tides and it has a huge tidal range. It would not be my choice for day trips in a small craft. See this video for an example of a crossing...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPXWc2EWoQc

Problem is without extensive experience you can perhaps get away with a crossing one way if it starts fairly calm but find unexpected difficult conditions that might prevent a comfortable/safe return trip as the tide and/or weather changes.

[nailseaNewbie]

Mostly i'm just trying to work out the limitation of something i could fit into my car, Rib /Sib/ F-rib. Reading up the the spec's and through the forums etc, some of the inflatables mentioned v shaped hulls and things on some of the smaller boats. The specs for most hull also give the category it can used. (i havent found a map that gives the category for the waters though)

I'm not expecting trips across bristol channel to cardiff (/ south wales) would be my first trip, but on a sunny summers day with porper planning, something like that would be possible? i'm just thinking it might be a way to extend the range of coastline i could explorer

I've been on bigger ribs before when i did scuba, but didnt have anything to do with the planning. it was a few years ago, and i mostly just sat on the side going weeeee

[hymerbeliever]

Any SIBs or Soft Inflatable Boat up to a 4.2m can easily be transported in your car and blown up on site, preferably using a Bravo electric pump. You cant transport a RIB in your car. SIBs with hard wooden or alu floors are better but are more difficult to transport (they collapse in to 4/5 pieces) and will take longer to assemble than an inflatable floor. Bombard and Honwave do V shaped inflatable floors but I don't think they offer any advantage over the rest of the 3m+ boats that will all have keel tubes.


If you are going to do watersports, a 15hp engine is needed to pull a ringo and 25hp+ to waterski/wakeboard.

As mentioned above, the Bristol Channel has very fast flowing tidal water and it can get rough out there...and there are hidden sandbanks and rocks. You are going to need a decent sized engine (20hp+) to be safe and that will limit your min size of boat. The engine will be heavy. I have a Zodiac Futura S 4.2m with a 40hp engine (80 kilos) and I'd feel quite safe crossing in that. I also have Yam 360s and a 15hp engine (35 kilos) and I would not cross in that. The Futura takes about 90 mins to assemble (because it has helm and remote steering) and the Yam takes 20 mins. Both go in the car easily but not the 40hp outboard, which is a 2 person lift.

I'd probably get something around 3.8 - 4.2 meters which will take a tiller 20 - 25 hp engine and an inflatable floor. Also a 2 stroke engine will be better because it's much lighter than a 4 stroke and it doesn't matter which way up it lies in your car.

Also, once you get to Cardiff, what will you do? There are no tidal jetties. Really you need a VHF (licence needed) to enter Cardiff bay via the lock, though you can use a mobile I think. if you are going to land on the beach, say at Penarth or Barry, remember the tides change by 18 meters every 6 hours and so you'll need an anchor and swimming gear if the tide is coming in and wheels if the tide is going out. I also wouldn't do the crossing without 2 full tanks of fuel, oars, flares, pump, a marine chart / gps, mobile and preferably a VHF...and a clean pair of underpants.

[nailseaNewbie]

Originally Posted by hymerbeliever

Any SIBs or Soft Inflatable Boat up to a 4.2m can easily be transported in your car and blown up on site, preferably using a Bravo electric pump. You cant transport a RIB in your car. SIBs with hard wooden or alu floors are better but are more difficult to transport (they collapse in to 4/5 pieces) and will take longer to assemble than an inflatable floor.

As mentioned above, the Bristol Channel has very fast flowing tidal water and it can get rough out there...and there are hidden sandbanks and rocks. You are going to need a decent sized engine (20hp+) to be safe and that will limit your min size of boat. The engine will be heavy. I have a Zodiac Futura S 4.2m with a 40hp engine (80 kilos) and I'd feel quite safe crossing in that. I also have Yam 360s and a 15hp engine (35 kilos) and I would not cross in that. The Futura takes about 90 mins to assemble (because it has helm and remote steering) and the Yam takes 20 mins. Both go in the car easily but not the 40hp outboard, which is a 2 person lift.

I'd probably get something around 3.8 - 4.2 meters which will take a tiller 20 - 25 hp engine and an inflatable floor. Also a 2 stroke engine will be better because it's much lighter than a 4 stroke and it doesn't matter which way up it lies in your car.

Also, once you get to Cardiff, what will you do? There are no tidal jetties. Really you need a VHF (licence needed) to enter Cardiff bay via the lock, though you can use a mobile I think. if you are going to land on the beach, say at Penarth or Barry, remember the tides change by 18 meters every 6 hours and so you'll need an anchor and swimming gear if the tide is coming in and wheels if the tide is going out. I also wouldn't do the crossing without 2 full tanks of fuel, oars, flares, pump, a marine chart / gps, mobile and preferably a VHF...and a clean pair of underpants.

Ah, that's great information, thanks. I was using Cardiff mostly as a example, since it's semi-local to me. I'm on the south coast and in devon regularly too. I guess where to leave a boat, will bethe next part of my investigation

[Poly]

Originally Posted by nailseaNewbie

The specs for most hull also give the category it can used. (i havent found a map that gives the category for the waters though)

The categories on CE marks don't relate to a "map" (although confusingly there are maps of categorised waters that unhelpfully use the same letters with a different meaning for commercially coded boats!).

The CE marks relate to the size of waves the boat is "designed" to cope with when loaded. The system is far from ideal though. Firstly at cat C & D (which is what SIBs are likely to be) they are self certified and different manufacturers interpret the guidance differently. Secondly a new buyer probably has no way to relate "significant wave height*" to the weather on a given day. Thirdly because cat B involves external bodies many very capable larger boats are put through the cat C process and so a 7m leisure rib might be rated the same category as a 3m inflatable.

The only guide they can really give is that if it doesn't have at least Cat C on it (ie. it is only Cat D or you can't find a cat at all) then it is really a beach toy or perhaps a tender but not suitable for your intended use. I would say the opposite is NOT necessarily true - ie. just because it is Cat C doesn't mean its suitable for your use, and certainly doesn't mean it will be a pleasant experience in "conditions up to, and including, wind force 6 and significant wave heights up to, and including, 2 m may be experienced."

* Significant wave height is a statistical description of the size of the waves - there is a reasonable chance of encountering some individual waves twice this height, and about 1:10 waves WILL be bigger than the significant wave height, however most waves are actually smaller than this.

[nailseaNewbie]

Originally Posted by Poly

The categories on CE marks don't relate to a "map" (although confusingly there are maps of categorised waters that unhelpfully use the same letters with a different meaning for commercially coded boats!).

The CE marks relate to the size of waves the boat is "designed" to cope with when loaded. The system is far from ideal though. Firstly at cat C & D (which is what SIBs are likely to be) they are self certified and different manufacturers interpret the guidance differently. Secondly a new buyer probably has no way to relate "significant wave height*" to the weather on a given day. Thirdly because cat B involves external bodies many very capable larger boats are put through the cat C process and so a 7m leisure rib might be rated the same category as a 3m inflatable.

The only guide they can really give is that if it doesn't have at least Cat C on it (ie. it is only Cat D or you can't find a cat at all) then it is really a beach toy or perhaps a tender but not suitable for your intended use. I would say the opposite is NOT necessarily true - ie. just because it is Cat C doesn't mean its suitable for your use, and certainly doesn't mean it will be a pleasant experience in "conditions up to, and including, wind force 6 and significant wave heights up to, and including, 2 m may be experienced."

* Significant wave height is a statistical description of the size of the waves - there is a reasonable chance of encountering some individual waves twice this height, and about 1:10 waves WILL be bigger than the significant wave height, however most waves are actually smaller than this.

Yip, These are reasons i asked here, as manufacturers are not known to undersell their products.

Currently, I doubt i would ever consider going out in anything other than perfect conditions, but i don't want to get something that is limited too much.

thanks for the input!

[HDAV]

Originally Posted by hymerbeliever

If you are going to do watersports, a 15hp engine is needed to pull a ringo and 25hp+ to waterski/wakeboard.

Very very slowly i wouldn't try pulling a ringo with 15hp I struggle with 25hp and skier with 25hp???

Originally Posted by hymerbeliever

Also, once you get to Cardiff, what will you do? There are no tidal jetties. Really you need a VHF (licence needed) to enter Cardiff bay via the lock, though you can use a mobile I think. if you are going to land on the beach, say at Penarth or Barry, remember the tides change by 18 meters every 6 hours and so you'll need an anchor and swimming gear if the tide is coming in and wheels if the tide is going out. I also wouldn't do the crossing without 2 full tanks of fuel, oars, flares, pump, a marine chart / gps, mobile and preferably a VHF...and a clean pair of underpants.

The Jet skiers do the trip pier to pier (penarth to weston) in under 20min (9.8 miles as crowflies)... but they have between 120 and 250 bhp on a craft no longer..............................

You can enter the bay with a mobile phone (number is on the entrance both ways) but a VHF for £100 or less and knowing how to use (licence) is recommended... Just remember cash for the pay and display machine on the pontoon....

There is a nice concrete slip at the side of the pier in penarth and one at sully (check is its been closed for maintenance) right by the pub (captains wife good food) If your doing the crossing then expect to get wet,wetsuit/dry suit and i wouldn't take small kids or even large ones that aren't happy starring at the grey water (or wives)

Above in bold minimum

much better is do some coast cruising to some where like ilfracombe Launching - Watermouth Cove Holiday Park Beach Resort- North Devon

Why not fit a tow bar and get a rib? 3-4m rib will launch in 10min far less faffing more stable and not engine carrying to worry about.

[nailseaNewbie]

Originally Posted by HDAV

Very very slowly i wouldn't try pulling a ringo with 15hp I struggle with 25hp and skier with 25hp???

The Jet skiers do the trip pier to pier (penarth to weston) in under 20min (9.8 miles as crowflies)... You can enter the bay with a mobile phone (number is on the entrance both ways) but a VHF for £100 or less and knowing how to use is recommended... Just remember cash for the pay and display machine on the pontoon.


There is a nice concrete slip at the side of the pier in penarth and one at sully (check is its been closed for maintenance) right by the pub (captains wife good food) If your doing the crossing then expect to get wet,wetsuit/dry suit and i wouldn't take small kids or even large ones that aren't happy starring at the grey water (or wives)

Above in bold minimum

much better is do some coast crusing to some where like ilfracombe Launching - Watermouth Cove Holiday Park Beach Resort- North Devon

Why not fit a tow bar and get a rib? 3-4m rib will launch in 10min far less faffing more stable and not engine carrying to worry about.

I've never jet skied before, so i might look for somewhere to hire one to try it

From googling this, advice seemed to be to avoid WSM for jet skiing, as the mud caused much more cleaning. I would find that a little frustrating if it was also one of my closest options.

Mostly the reason for a folding boat is that I've no where to keep a towing rib/trailer. I can put a folding one in my garage.

[HDAV]

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WSM (Weston super Mud) is crap for any water based activity as half the time there is no water.......................Burnham on is much better, they jet ski from Porthcawl to Illfracombe (25 miles) something i am hoping to do next year..

[hymerbeliever]

Originally Posted by HDAV

Very very slowly i wouldn't try pulling a ringo with 15hp I struggle with 25hp and skier with 25hp???

My 15hp and 3.6m Yam pulls a ringo perfectly with 2 adults on board and 1 in the ringo.

Originally Posted by HDAV

There is a nice concrete slip at ..... sully (check is its been closed for maintenance) right by the pub (captains wife good food)

The sully slip is at least 1/2 mile west of the Captains Wife and I wouldn't go anywhere near the pub in any boat as it is very treacherous around Sully Island. Also, imo, the pub has been completely spoilt since Brewers Fayre turned it into a restaurant that sells beer.

[HDAV]

Originally Posted by hymerbeliever

My 15hp and 3.6m Yam pulls a ringo perfectly with 2 adults on board and 1 in the ringo.

You must be lighter than me

[Mikefule]

I have a 2014 Honda Civic (car, not estate) and can easily get a 3.1 metre Zodiac Cadet, a 9.9 4 stroke, fuel tank, anchor box, bow bag, oars and other stuff for the day in the back with a driver and two adult passengers.

[paintman]

Originally Posted by HDAV

WSM (Weston super Mud) is crap for any water based activity as half the time there is no water.......................Burnham on is much better, they jet ski from Porthcawl to Illfracombe (25 miles) something i am hoping to do next year..

I was at Trecco Bay last week on the Parkdean site. Not with the boat though. There is a marina in Porthcawl itself, but it's gated & a long way away from the water at low tide.
There is Porthcawl Power boat & Ski Club (Trecco Bay) but no-one was about. Found this on a previous ribnet post so unless it's changed looks like they wouldn't be any use if you were only there for a short holiday.
Seems it's not a public slip & no vehicles other than their tractors are allowed.
http://www.rib.net/forum/f8/launchin...les-15932.html
"If you are not a members of Porthcawl Powerboat and Ski Club and you wish to launch your boat from the slipway when on holiday or whilst awaiting membership then you can launch on a temporary membership which costs £25 pound per week and can be purchased from Soapys laundrette Station Hill Porthcawl. Contact details can be found at the slipway. Your craft will have to be inspected before entering the water and you will have to conform to the following requirements.

To launch a boat from Porthcawl Powerboat and Ski Club you require the following:

Boat insurance with a minimum of £1 million Third Party Cover.
A flare pack (with flares in date)
Paddles (These will be of no use for moving the boat but will help to attract attention in case of an emergency)
A Whistle or air horn again to attract attention in an emergency
An anchor and rope of sufficient size to hold the boat safely
Each person in the boat must wear a recognised buoyancy aid.
Advise that you carry a bucket to bail water if the worst should happen.

Please note that as a weekly member you will not be able to use the club tractors. this means you will be relying on the goodwill and availability of club members to assist you in launching your craft."
Their website is http://www.pps-club.com/

[HDAV]

The club rules are a bit silly (not sure how strictly they are followed TBH).... and I'm hoping not to have to join..... but for the OP launching from watermouth (far more accommodating and going the other way you just pitch up at the beach).

[paintman]

Launch/Recovery off the Trecco slip at high water would be easy, but it's a long way out at low. I can't remember whether the bar at the top of the slip was locked.
Lovely beach, seemed to be hard clean sand when I looked & could be considered with a 4x4 (I have a RRC) after proper assessment but I'd want an extension on the tow bar to keep the car out of the water.
There were a couple of chaps inflating a SIB on the road on one occasion but unfortunately I wasn't able to stop & chat.