Excell Vangard 435 - As as Trailered Boat

Jameslong · 04 October 2021, 10:57

Looking at the Excell site I see they have the Vangard 435 at a reasonable price. I know this is a big heavy sib but wondered if anyone on here has one on a Trailer. Use would be trailered and slipway launched and most probably would have a 20 hp tiller 4 stroke on the back. Would this be enough engine. Also does this boat use a standard or long shaft engine.

Thanks

Pikey Dave · 04 October 2021, 11:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jameslong

Looking at the Excell site I see they have the Vangard 435 at a reasonable price. I know this is a big heavy sib but wondered if anyone on here has one on a Trailer. Use would be trailered and slipway launched and most probably would have a 20 hp tiller 4 stroke on the back. Would this be enough engine. Also does this boat use a standard or long shaft engine.

Thanks

Based on my experience with the 390 Volaire, a 20hp wouldn’t be enough.

jeffstevens763@g · 04 October 2021, 16:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jameslong

Looking at the Excell site I see they have the Vangard 435 at a reasonable price. I know this is a big heavy sib but wondered if anyone on here has one on a Trailer. Use would be trailered and slipway launched and most probably would have a 20 hp tiller 4 stroke on the back. Would this be enough engine. Also does this boat use a standard or long shaft engine.

Thanks

I have one with a 25 on look at my excel 435 build from scratch, tell me what your going to carry weight wise transom is short shaft for an honest opinion.

Jameslong · 04 October 2021, 19:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffstevens763@g

I have one with a 25 on look at my excel 435 build from scratch, tell me what your going to carry weight wise transom is short shaft for an honest opinion.

The most it would generally carry would be 2 adults and some camping gear for say 2 nights and some spare petrol. Occasionally there might be a third person. The two adults I would say weigh a total of 27 - 30 stone max.

Thanks in advance

jeffstevens763@g · 04 October 2021, 19:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jameslong

The most it would generally carry would be 2 adults and some camping gear for say 2 nights and some spare petrol. Occasionally there might be a third person. The two adults I would say weigh a total of 27 - 30 stone max.

Thanks in advance

Well I weigh 2/3 that I then carry on long trips 70 Ltrs of fuel camping kit and boat kit I’d say I’m at 35-37 stone all up including engine and boat an the 25 copes very easy on a 10 1/4 x 10 prop 140 miles 35 Ltrs of fuel. a 20 propped correct and the boat set as it should be will manage you’ll get about 18 knots WOT perfect conditions if it’s rough you’ll be at displacement speed anyway the key is weight distribution. Read my thread before you buy engine position especially

Pikey Dave · 04 October 2021, 19:58

Bear in mind that the 25hp is a 3pot 490cc engine compared to the 327cc twin of the 20hp. This difference on paper is only 5hp, but the difference in torque & smoothness will be very noticeable. The 20hp is the same block as the 9.9 & 15hp, so is operating at the top end of its capabilities. The 25hp is the same block as the 30hp, so it’s safe to assume it’s delivering its power in its stride.
Given that the boat is rated to 30hp & that the 25 & 30 are the same engine, I’d be putting a 30hp on the back.

dhaglund · 04 October 2021, 20:00

When I hear trailer and SIB together my first reaction is, why? If you have a trailer, why not a RIB, or any other boat? They're all better at being boats than a SIB they just don't fold as nicely.

But then again, I like the SIB I just got.

Pikey Dave · 04 October 2021, 20:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by dhaglund

When I hear trailer and SIB together my first reaction is, why? If you have a trailer, why not a RIB, or any other boat? They're all better at being boats than a SIB they just don't fold as nicely.

But then again, I like the SIB I just got.

Yup, I’m inclined to agree.

nocando · 04 October 2021, 20:07

If any use I'm going to sell 8 hour old excel 395 vanguard package bought all new 2019 right in time for covid.

Brand new boat, suzuki 20 and trailer all bought Jan 2019 and been stored indoors since.

Let me know if maybe of interest.

jeffstevens763@g · 04 October 2021, 20:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

Bear in mind that the 25hp is a 3pot 490cc engine compared to the 327cc twin of the 20hp. This difference on paper is only 5hp, but the difference in torque & smoothness will be very noticeable. The 20hp is the same block as the 9.9 & 15hp, so is operating at the top end of its capabilities. The 25hp is the same block as the 30hp, so it’s safe to assume it’s delivering its power in its stride.
Given that the boat is rated to 30hp & that the 25 & 30 are the same engine, I’d be putting a 30hp on the back.

Basing a lot on what I’ve seen with a Voltair 435 20 hp tohatsu big lad dog full camping kit etc and what I know I have in reserve Dave my vanguard is 20 kg lighter than the Mercury 365 I had for the extra size I loose 2 knots at WOT with the bigger boat. I plain at 9-10 knots about 3000 rpm no Rev counter just a guess cruse 15 knots around 4000 rpm 18 knots WOT 5600-5800 with the 10 inch pitch prop. You right though if buying a new engine I always say max hp.

Dydigital · 05 October 2021, 00:38

I ran a Vanguard 435 for 4 years with just a 9.9hp Suzuki, managed about 13knots. It lasted a few trips before it went on a trailer.

This year I upgraded to a Vanguard 485 and Volante 390. We have kept the 9.9hp for the Volante but aquired a 25hp Mariner Marathon for the 485.

Dydigital · 05 October 2021, 00:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by dhaglund

When I hear trailer and SIB together my first reaction is, why? If you have a trailer, why not a RIB, or any other boat? They're all better at being boats than a SIB they just don't fold as nicely.

But then again, I like the SIB I just got.

This subject comes up alot when I mention I have a sib on a trailer, and I us the same example.....
If you watch a few episodes of 'Saving lives at sea' you will quickly notice that the Ribs never go up close and personal with the shore due to the risk of damage, but the sib get right in there. Part is due to the size difference. But while a sib can be soft, its also a forgiving craft.

Jameslong · 05 October 2021, 09:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by dhaglund

When I hear trailer and SIB together my first reaction is, why? If you have a trailer, why not a RIB, or any other boat? They're all better at being boats than a SIB they just don't fold as nicely.

But then again, I like the SIB I just got.

There is a huge price difference between the Vangard and a 4.2 m Rib and also the sib does allow it to folded and stored if you have to even though it is a very large beast.

Looking at some of The Gurnards videos it is also debatable which is the best should you come close to rocks. I think the Sib has the edge in this regard

dhaglund · 05 October 2021, 10:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jameslong

There is a huge price difference between the Vangard and a 4.2 m Rib and also the sib does allow it to folded and stored if you have to even though it is a very large beast.

Looking at some of The Gurnards videos it is also debatable which is the best should you come close to rocks. I think the Sib has the edge in this regard

It is true that SIBs have a few strong points, and if those match you needs, well then there is a match. Regarding price it is a little deceptive I think. SIBs are cheap by comparison but have a rather short lifespan. Even a used hypalon RIB and most other boats have a longer or much longer lifespan even if they are 10 years old already. And used boats hold their value really well (at least where I am at).

But for anyone that values the ability to fold and store the boat, you just can't beat a SIB! But if you value boating in choppy conditions, anything beats a SIB. It just depends...

Highland Haggis · 05 October 2021, 10:43

I’ve had both the sib and small rib both have there good and bad points yes the sib gets you into small areas and is quite forgiving with beaching round hard rocks but has a speed disadvantage over a small rib that can get over 25 knots but is acceptable to damage by beaching I think Donny had an issue this year when his hull took a slight bit of damage due to rocks at his landing site when the weather changed over night and scratched his hull

Limecc · 05 October 2021, 12:49

I wonder if Donny's fitted keelguard or if this would have helped?

My hard hull's been saved from a nasty gouge several times because of the aforementioned. Elsewhere I just went around with some Flowcoat, scraped off the excess before it fully hardened then used Wet and Dry and buffed it with T-cut for an invisible repair. Fixing a soft hull damaged on sharp rocks or barnacles wouldn't have been half as easy.

Steve509926 · 05 October 2021, 19:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by dhaglund

When I hear trailer and SIB together my first reaction is, why? If you have a trailer, why not a RIB, or any other boat? They're all better at being boats than a SIB they just don't fold as nicely.

But then again, I like the SIB I just got.

I have a SIB and transport it both ways. If I'm using it for day trips, I will inflate/deflate from the back of the truck. If I'm on holiday somewhere in the caravan for a week or more, I'll transport the SIB around on a trailer, saves so much hassle inflating /deflating every day.

jeffstevens763@g · 05 October 2021, 20:15

I have a sib for various reasons to suit me one thing I wouldn’t do is set the thing up on a slipway I want to be away enjoying the sea. I’ve had ribs and all manner of boats I get more satisfaction from the challenge in a sib than any other boat I’ve owned.

Limecc · 06 October 2021, 09:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffstevens763@g

I’ve had ribs and all manner of boats I get more satisfaction from the challenge in a sib than any other boat I’ve owned.

And that's great, yourself and a number of others on here have years of experience, some earning a living on and around boats in addition to using them for pleasure.

Others with less experience have stress and recognise the risk in the same challenging situations so there's no satisfaction involved at all.

When starting out I've had a few memorable occasions (for the wrong reasons) encountering overfalls and large boat wakes in a SIB that my present hard hulled boat handles with ease. Can really relax now and enjoy being out without the former challenges/worries. And I'm out in comfort staying dry not bouncing around on a sponson!

jeffstevens763@g · 06 October 2021, 12:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Limecc

And that's great, yourself and a number of others on here have years of experience, some earning a living on and around boats in addition to using them for pleasure.

Others with less experience have stress and recognise the risk in the same challenging situations so there's no satisfaction involved at all.

When starting out I've had a few memorable occasions (for the wrong reasons) encountering overfalls and large boat wakes in a SIB that my present hard hulled boat handles with ease. Can really relax now and enjoy being out without the former challenges/worries. And I'm out in comfort staying dry not bouncing around on a sponson!

Fair enough you found a craft that suits your abilities and needs