Getting started

Scarlet-Jester · 26 April 2011, 20:42

Hi guys.

I have been looking over the threads here for sometime ahead of buying my first SIB. I am mainly looking at staying in a budget rather than am specific boat but am looking at a Yamaha 380s, Xpro Commando 380 or a Seapro 380 – what are your thoughts on these?

I have a family of 5 (3 kids under 7) and would like to use it for day trips as well as towing a biscuit or such like. Pretty keen to be able to get her up on a plane with all the family and gear onboard. For an outboard I was thinking of getting a Yamaha 25hp 2 stroke, or a 15-20hp 2 stroke but am finding it pretty hard to find any 20hp units - thinking that a 15hp would not be quite big enough? The 25 comes in at 50kg which is within the limits for the transom. From looking on here this may to too big (weight wise) to be manageable?

Appreciate your thoughts on my combinations.

thornbackflound · 26 April 2011, 22:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scarlet-Jester

Hi guys.

I have been looking over the threads here for sometime ahead of buying my first SIB. I am mainly looking at staying in a budget rather than am specific boat but am looking at a Yamaha 380s, Xpro Commando 380 or a Seapro 380 – what are your thoughts on these?

I have a family of 5 (3 kids under 7) and would like to use it for day trips as well as towing a biscuit or such like. Pretty keen to be able to get her up on a plane with all the family and gear onboard. For an outboard I was thinking of getting a Yamaha 25hp 2 stroke, or a 15-20hp 2 stroke but am finding it pretty hard to find any 20hp units - thinking that a 15hp would not be quite big enough? The 25 comes in at 50kg which is within the limits for the transom. From looking on here this may to too big (weight wise) to be manageable?

Appreciate your thoughts on my combinations.

Crickey 5 of you on a 380 and on the plane,think you gonna need a bigger Sib?kids under 7 will wanna move about,and its all about getting the weight ratio right,weight at the front,balanced at the back with the engine,i have an old 20hp mariner and that weighs 53kg so i would say a 25hp could be heavier?,of course each make of engine may vary with weight,no expert,but seems a lot to ask of what you are asking for that type of set up? and 5 of you ,even with kids all weighs up,good advice will come along,great place to seek advice.

rik_elliott · 26 April 2011, 23:00

what is your budget? If your requirements are to carry five would be best we know how much you have to spend. also, to plane with that many on board is likely to require somewhat more grunt than a 20 will have to offer. will you be trailering or inflating the boat every time?

Bighag7 · 27 April 2011, 00:13

Hi Mate,
Get the Seapro but bigger is better. Seapro make bomb proof boats if you go for the red working models. Check this site out as they do amazing packages and are super helpful if you call them for advice and don't do the hard sell. I'd go bigger personally, these kids are going to grow quickly.
http://www.billhigham.co.uk/inflatables.php

azzurro · 27 April 2011, 09:04

rik_eliott is right: the main question is trailering or mounting-dismounting the boat.
Me, I mount/dismount once a year. A 4 meters alu floor+20HP 4-stroke light engine (46kg) fits perfect.
But if I had to mount/dismount 4 times a year, no way.

Regarding kids, I agree you do need space: maybe a smaller second hand and upgrade later, or a brand new smaller one smaller and sell it later.

When purchasing a boat the point is ALWAYS the engine. A 5 years old engine family used is almost brand new if well serviced. You can choose to change the boat and stay with the engine, or also upgrade the engine when kids grow.

Regarding ringos, maybe they are too young now. Later, better a 20hp engine.

So ... think about wife. Get something to make her happy right now, she has 3 kids! I do not think she will help you with the boat, so you need something you can manage on your own. The outboard weight is critical.

Get a trailer! Otherwise, a high pressure hull 3.60 meters and a 15hp 2stroke, or a 10hp 4stroke and upgrade when kids grow.

Poly · 27 April 2011, 09:06

My boat is 3.9m, probably a bit heavier than a typical SIB and gets on the plane easily with a 20HP 2stroke. Manages this even with 4 adults and 2 small kids on board - I wouldn't want less power though.

My main concern with 2 adults and 3 small kids is safe seating. Your eldest is (depending on the child) maybe just about old enough to sit on a tube holding on tight if the weather is good and driver reasonably skilful.

I've got lots of good seating. But unless it was very good weather, perfectly behaved children etc i wouldn't want young ones on tube tops for any length of time.

Scarlet-Jester · 27 April 2011, 09:22

So looks like I may be a little over optimistic then!

The motor I am looking at is the 2003 model 25hp Yamaha 2 stroke that comes in at 50kg. Budget is (ideally) £2k but I am willing to go over that if the right package presents itself – look more likely to be £2.5k. Motors is around £1400 to £1600 and boats between £700 and £1200. I am looking to go second hand with all the gear as I cannot afford to buy new. Plan is to have it on a trailer in season and deflated over winter.

I do not have any secure off road parking so am pretty limited on how I can store the boat – engine would have to come off after each use and boat into the back yard. I would not be a heavy user with the main focus being on the yearly 2 week holiday in Europe with the odd weekend in the UK. I have 3 girls as they will not get too heavy and this set up is to last about 3-4 years as then we will be back in NZ thereafter.

Poly · 27 April 2011, 09:32

I'm not saying don't get a SIB - but you might want to see if you can find someone with a similar size setup locally and give them a hand launching / recovering / putting the engine on. It can all be a major faff/pita and mean you don't use it - especially if the other "adult help" is busy with the kids for that hour you really could do with an extra pair of hands for.

NEIL

9D280 · 27 April 2011, 10:18

I'll second the engine thing - I have a prehistoric 25Hp, nice & light as it's 2 cyl, no oil injection etc and "only" weighs in at 38KG.

Thing is engines are a bog awkward shape to lift. so that 38 Kg suddenly seems more like 78....... I would certainly reccommend if you ar efolding etc every time launch wheels & use the baot to carry the engine or a folsding launch trolley would be a good way to go.

If it's your storage is the main problem, could you tow it home, then mount / dismout the engine there at relative leisure? (Bored kids & partners at a beach is not a good way to get back out again in a hurry!) If you towed home, that would just leave the problem of the road trailer, although for a Sib one of them could likely be lifted. (or build a wheeled contraption to allow you to tip it on it's side & wheel it round the back?) Could maybe also use a modified (to suit the hull shape) dinghy combi trailer? As it breaks down into Road bit & launch trolley, it could also be moved round the back as two lighter weight halves?

By towing that may also allow you to get a bigger hull?

Scarlet-Jester · 27 April 2011, 10:46

I have off road parking but it is not secure. Not sure if that is similar to many here? Secure storage for the trailer is not a problem as I can get it off the road and chain it to the house. My concern is leaving the SIB on the trailer in the drive whilst I am at work during the week, and most definitely leaving the motor in the same place!!

I totally agree and was planning to do what you suggest – getting it all set at home and towing it ready to use and vice versa at the end of the day. I appreciate that there is a lot of logistics with all this but I feel it is worth it to get the kids on the water.

I am an ocean sailor and race, I love the water and feel this is an excellent way to introduce the kids to boats. We had the girls on the boat we did the Fastnet on in 2009 and did the delivery trip from Burnham down to Cowes – they loved it! We had a 12’ aluminium Parkercraft when I was a kid and I managed to drag this thing up and down the beach in NZ and carry the 5hp seagull motor by myself as a 10-12 year old. I am hoping a SIB is a little more manageable!

Slaphead · 27 April 2011, 11:25

Is this set-up any use to you?

It's the Avon W400 commercial grade inflatable which is about as heavy duty as you will get. Ex Royal Marines Youth Training Corps.

It comes with a 25hp Mariner two stroke that was serviced last April and other than running up on mufflers hasn't been used since.

Sits in it's own trailer and comes with new LVM 12volt inflator which blows it up in about 5 minutes, foot bellows, wooden floor, spare prop, paddles, 25 litre Barrus fuel tank and storage bag.

I'm looking £2500 which also includes delivery to NW England as I'm across on the mainland reasonably regularly.

Nick Hearne · 27 April 2011, 13:46

Hi my brother-in-law has a Tohatsu 3.8 with a 25hp on a trailer he has for sale as he not has a SR4 if it sounds any good let me know!

mark_j · 27 April 2011, 14:41

buy right, buy once Aerotec 380

email sent

Andy C · 27 April 2011, 17:32

The Aerotec 380 is a great boat and works very well with two children sat on the bench seat and two adults on the tubes, still leaving plenty of room for all the kit you inevitably end up needing for family trips. I don’t think I’d fancy trying to seat another young child safely in a position they are going to remain happy for any length of time though.

mark_j · 27 April 2011, 18:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy C

. I don’t think I’d fancy trying to seat another young child safely in a position they are going to remain happy for any length of time though.

My youngest used to kneel up the fron and hold the bag strap either side, i never had any fears for her saftey.

Poly · 27 April 2011, 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by mark_j

My youngest used to kneel up the fron and hold the bag strap either side, i never had any fears for her saftey.

At what age - the OP has three children under 7.

azzurro · 28 April 2011, 08:56

Polwart is true, but you will have than problem even in a yatch.

I may be spotted as a bastard, but they are girls. Boys are worst to handle for sure. I have two. Boys I mean, not bastards. Well, sometimes I'm not sure.

Get safety personal devices special fit for each children.

Poly · 28 April 2011, 09:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by azzurro

Polwart is true, but you will have than problem even in a yatch.

Yachts have a number of benefits for small kids. (1) Cockpit to keep them contained and usually away from the sea (usually with deeper sides); (2) lifelines you can use to clip them in so they can't escape; (3) rails/guard wires (I am sure they have a proper name but I've forgotten) so less likely to slip over; (4) a cabin to put them in if the weather kicks up and you start bouncing about or taking spray over the kids; (5) depending on the helmsman - no dramatic turns! Of course not all yachts have all these features but all small SIBs put the occupants close to the water, with little or no secure seating (for small people) and in anything but flat calm will bounce the occupants around to some extent. Not saying don't take kids but it needs some thought.

Quote:

I may be spotted as a bastard, but they are girls. Boys are worst to handle for sure. I have two. Boys I mean, not bastards. Well, sometimes I'm not sure.

nah, that's just pot luck - my Son has always done as he's told. My daughter has not!

Get safety personal devices special fit for each children. [/QUOTE]

mark_j · 28 April 2011, 11:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by polwart

at what age - the op has three children under 7.

5

John Kennett · 29 April 2011, 08:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scarlet-Jester

I have a family of 5 (3 kids under 7) and would like to use it for day trips as well as towing a biscuit or such like. Pretty keen to be able to get her up on a plane with all the family and gear onboard. For an outboard I was thinking of getting a Yamaha 25hp 2 stroke, or a 15-20hp 2 stroke but am finding it pretty hard to find any 20hp units - thinking that a 15hp would not be quite big enough? The 25 comes in at 50kg which is within the limits for the transom. From looking on here this may to too big (weight wise) to be manageable?

I've tried various combinations over the years in pursuit of the perfect compromise (because it will always be a compromise between space, performance, ease of use, and storage).

I've had inflatables up to 4 metres, with wooden floor, ali floor, flat airdeck, and Aertotec airdeck. I've also had a Tinker Foldaway RIB and a little folding transom RIB.

If you're going to be packing it away each time then I would get an Aerotec 380 with a 15hp 2-stroke. If you can leave it inflated on a road trailer, then I'd get something like that 4 metre Avon with a 25.

You should find that in good conditions you'll all be OK in either, but you're unlikely to want to go on any extended trips. If the conditions are not so perfect then you won't all want to be going out in an inflatable anyway. Performance fully laden isn't going to be great, but you can always take the kids out for a spin one or two at a time.

Don't be over ambitious with the children though - leave them wanting more and they'll grow into it. Try to do too much too soon and you'll end up being the only person in the family who wants anything to do with boats at all.

Have fun!