Hi from Warrington area

ArdusFlyer · 15 August 2016, 12:11

Hi all,

Great forum. Just thought I'd say hi.
I've been hankering for a boat for years in an ideal world would probably go for a Warrior but have never taken the plunge. Maybe later in life but for now I just don't think the hassle and cost of storage / ownership is worth it. Mainly interested in fishing and coastal exploring.

Only recently learned about the existence of SIBs whilst lurking on the North Wales Kayak Fishing website and their obvious advantages so have been doing some research with a view to getting one. Finally feel like I might get out on the water in my own boat without taking out a mortgage or sacrificing my entire garage for storage.

So any advice very welcome. I am used to being quite weather / safety conscious as I am also a paraglider pilot and understand that these boats are only really comfortable in pretty flat seas.

I was reading a post about how far offshore you can go in these. I guess the answer to some degree is "as far as you are able and willing to row when the engine dies" but Im not sure how far you could row one with wind strength and direction being an obvious factor and I guess an auxilliany motor isnt really an option.

Anyway research so far has led me to three possibilities in current order of preference:
1. Honwave T38 IE2 - Air V Hull
2. Bombard Aerotec 380 - Air V Hull
3. Honwave T40 EA2 - Aluminium floor (flat I think)

With Honda BF10 engine. Can't see why I would need more than 10HP and want to keep as lightweight as poss but happy to be advised.

1. Seems like a good allrounder.
2. Seems to always get good reviews.
3. I like the bigger size and the hard floor but put off by the package being much heavier and I think there is no V in the hull so more slappy in waves?

I think there would normally be 2 people fishing in it.

I think I'd probably buy brand new but not decided yet.

Any corrections / advice appreciated.

Many thanks.

jeffstevens763@g · 15 August 2016, 12:26

hi mate

good choice so far mercury/quicksilver do a good boat too have a look at tacakat 340 catamaran all blow up light weight planes with low hp very stable flat deck 48 cm tubes.
loads of choice on the secondhand market.
SIB'S great for pottering around weather is the key some do really long trips with them but great to get on the water at a reasonable cost.
OMO but buy what you want first time if you like a 4 m go for it same with engine have a bit of extra power in hand no good thrashing it all the time.
the rest of the SIB boys will be along soon for more food for thought.

cheers

Fenlander · 15 August 2016, 22:03

Hello Ardus and welcome to the forum.

Wonder if you are thinking of buying new... the relative price of your alternatives would be important if so.

Forgetting price though...

The air floor Honwave 3.8 is great value and a fantastic all rounder.

The Aerotec is my personal choice after experiencing many other SIB types... but they are expensive new/used and if new have had a few quality control issues lately. Also not a first choice for fishing due to the sloping air floor.

The alloy floor Honwave 4m is a large rugged boat but heavy to move about and fiddly to assemble compared with an air floor. It also really needs a larger outboard than a 10hp... which leads me onto..

Why you think 10hp is enough?

Are you aware of the displacement/on the plane speed differences?

A 6hp or 8hp will move any of your shortlist to their max displacement speed but struggle to plane. A 10hp will sometimes plane these SIBs but only with a light load and in the right conditions. Ideally a 15hp or even a 20hp is needed to give reliable ability to plane with these SIB sizes.

The difference in plane/non-plane speeds makes a big difference to comfortable operating range and to a degree being able to run home safely when conditions threaten.

Non plane might be 6kts and plane speed nearer 12-20kts.

ArdusFlyer · 16 August 2016, 06:55

Thanks for the advice Fenlander. You're right RE horsepower and planing etc. and having done some further research and reading your post Im looking at T38 IE2 with Honda BF20.

According to hondas figures the BF20 is only 5kg heavier than the BF9.9 (47kg rather than 42kg) so hopefully just about manageable to set up the boat on my own at a push with the 20?

The shop in Aldershot is doing the above package new for £3565 at the moment.

I do like what Ive read about the Bombard Aerotec 380 but is the difference really worth £1300+ extra? I dont know.

Sounds like the main difference is a floor which performs better, especially in chop.

Cheers.

Mickhitchuk · 16 August 2016, 07:09

Hi and welcome
I'm a bit of a newbie myself so am speaking with limited experience but I would say
I would be reluctant to buy a new outfit on my first purchase as until you get out on the water you are not really sure what set up you like- need, I usually go out alone so these tips don't apply if going out 2 or more up
Honwave air floor- great sib, very well built but to heavy for me and the transom wheels were just too small
Quicksilver- also great but for me also heavy and wood floor for me was a pita to put in, needs a trailer really
I currently have a yam 310 sti, which I find very light and easy to set up, but again this would soon end up on eBay if I was going out 2 up
Outboards I have had
Suzuki 4s 5 hp- way to heavy
Mariner 4s 6 hp better but heavy and seemed slow
Currently have a Tohatsu 9.8 2s nice and light and great with one person, but 2 up against the tide it struggles.
Going out with 2 people I think I would go for
A 3.8-4.0 mtr sib
With a least a 15hp 2 s
Have a look on the sibs for sale section on here as they are usually well put together outfits.
And if you do want a hard floor have a look at a frib, although I haven't been out on one yet

Brian · 16 August 2016, 11:17

Have you thought about an F-rib?
Would seem to meet all your requirements.

ArdusFlyer · 16 August 2016, 12:00

Thankyou Brian and MickHitch.

I hadn't seen the f-ribs until you guys mentioned them.
Just shows how valuable these forums are.
Wow the f-ribs look great don't they?
I think my budget may be about to take a beating

seeing as they are even more expensive than the Bombard. But I'd rather spend more up front and try to get the right set up first time if poss, although I agree it can be difficult when you are new to it.

I might try to see if anyone up north is going out, maybe north wales, so I can chat face to face and maybe see some kit first hand.

Thanks.

thestig1973 · 16 August 2016, 14:10

ArdusFlyer I'm also in Warrington and have a honwave T32 and 15hp mercury 2 stroke

I appreciate that you need a bigger sib, but if you want to see a honwave in the flesh without traveling far then give me a shout

Fenlander · 16 August 2016, 14:56

>>>Wow the f-ribs look great don't they? I think my budget may be about to take a beating seeing as they are even more expensive than the Bombard. But I'd rather spend more up front and try to get the right set up first time if poss...

If you are totally new to boats and/or SIBS it would be amazingly lucky to get the right outfit first time. In many ways that's why I often advise Honwave as they are very keen prices new and popular second hand so if you do need to swap you might only loose £200 or so. Buy a new Aerotec/FRib and want to move it on and there could be a £800 loss.

If you are buying new getting the right outboard to suit a variety of SIBs/boats is a good decision as you can easily swop the SIB but avoid the loss of swapping the outboard too.

Something we haven't touched on... how will you transport it to the water? For example we use a large estate car and want to keep the back seats for passengers so all the kit *has* to fit in the loadspace. By the time we have the 20hp, fuel tank, launch wheels and all the other kit loaded the tightly packed Aerotec only just wedges in on top of that lot pushing hard up into the roof. So for us the more boxy and inflexible folded dimensions of the FRib would make it impossible for us to carry... so regardless of whether it would suit it's off the list.

69cmw · 16 August 2016, 16:03

What's wrong with a roof rack or bars for transporting?

HUMBER P4VWL · 16 August 2016, 17:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by 69cmw

What's wrong with a roof rack or bars for transporting?

Security if left, I guess. Noise on the road if travelling far, racks do my head in. Cost of a rack etc (assuming a budget to consider here if sibbing)

ArdusFlyer · 16 August 2016, 17:49

Thanks for all the advice.
Good point RE transport. I am looking at getting a ford galaxy shortly so hopefully should be OK although I still may opt for a roof rack or small trailer even with the bigger car..

69cmw · 16 August 2016, 18:08

I would put it on the roof rack. If it's too noisy, turn up the iTunes, for security a long security cable through the locking bars will stop the opportunists, if the fu@@ers really want it though it's just as quick to break into an estate car as it is roof-bars ....

Fenlander · 16 August 2016, 21:34

>>>What's wrong with a roof rack or bars for transporting?

Nothing and some folks who use a small camping trailer get round this issue.

But... and I accept it's a personal thing... if it doesn't fit in the car it's not for us.. no trailers and no struggling to get something on the roof.

ArdusFlyer · 16 August 2016, 22:34

Im with you fenlander. Its my intention to buy a boat that i can fit in the boot. After years of wishlist shopping my boat of choice would be a warrior 165 but the reason i never got one was because of the storage and faffing with trailers. So im hoping with the upgrade to a ford galaxy i wont need trailer or roofrack for a sib but im not discounting them just in case. I have the recent addition of 2 young sprogs but the galaxy boot is enormous even with the (front set of) back seats up.

As i just mentioned to thestig1973 in a pm. I havent owned a boat before but ive hired a fair few in the lakes, france, ireland and australia. So definitely still a newbie but also definitely had enough of hiring cr@ppy boats with old underpowered outboards to get my boat fishing fix

Thanks to research and you guys' advice currently looking at f-rib 360 and suzuki df20.

ArdusFlyer · 16 August 2016, 23:14

This is the other hobby Im afflicted with.

For anyone interested perhaps I could swap flying lessons for boating lessons 😀

Paragliding
https://vimeo.com/111200928
https://vimeo.com/11325720

Paramotoring
https://vimeo.com/6072264

Stevem · 16 August 2016, 23:22

How often do you plan to use it? If you want to fish do you plan fitting a finder and transducer etc..
I have recently got into sibbing and fairly quickly got tired of set up and take down at the point of launch then to get it all out again when i got home to clean it all down. Mine now lives on a trailer and its so much easier and quicker for me to launch & recover. I find i am using it more. I dont live too far from the sea so slower travel time is not an issue. I know you dont want the hassle but if you have somewhere to store it then i would at least give a trailer some thought. Though if you do go for a trailer a small rib may be a better option?

ArdusFlyer · 17 August 2016, 00:01

Hi stevem.

I understand what you say about rigging de-rigging. I think i like the idea of having the option of boot or trailer at the moment. So frib suits that but as mentioned i may go to a trailered boat down the line in which case i like the warrior 165.

RE fish finder transducer etc. Ive tended to hire where possible in the past. One of the pains of that and reasons to get a sib (other than cr@p boat and engine) is lack of echo sounder.

So some time ago I bought a small but decent garmin fish finder and made my own bracket to fit the transducer to a very high quality stainless sucker cup bracket it is amazing and has universal lockable joints to position the transducer any which way after vacuum suckering it to the transom of whatevet piece of sh1t boat you are hiring at the time.

I bought a small hard bodied rucksack from decathlon and screwed in the display and a small sealed lead acid battery that gives me 2 days constant fishing without recharging. I have a safety line also attached to the transucer to stop it gettong sucked into the prop if the sucker failed but it never has even after days of use and never will imho. Then it all packs up in 2mins into a tiny rucksack for next time. Quite chuffed with it.

Stevem · 17 August 2016, 06:52

Hi ArdusFlyer

If you have time and patience then inflating, deflating may not be a problem. Unfortunately, i have neither!
Do you have a preferred launch spot picked out, beach, slipway or other?

Best of luck with your decision.

Fenlander · 17 August 2016, 08:36

>>>hoping with the upgrade to a ford galaxy... galaxy boot is enormous even with the (front set of) back seats up... currently looking at f-rib 360 and suzuki df20.

With something like a Galaxy and only using 5 seats you should be OK with pretty well any of your choices. I had the chance to see an FRib and how it packs in a car the other day... they do really need a tall people carrier or SUV style boot. The loadspace in my estate is huge in area but lacks height.

Not sure if you have picked up on this but with the hard hull of the FRib they are very nippy for any given engine size. Ultimate speed isn't important to me but if it interests you then the FRib 360/Suzuki 20 will be a very quick combination.

You will see I have the Suzuki 20 bought new earlier this year. An excellent motor all round and I'm still pleased with my choice... worth saying they vibrate through the tiller more than some... and they are strictly dealer only servicing to keep up the 5yr warranty... some other makes allow any competent place/person to service theirs as long as genuine parts are used.