Honwave Problems

dave gregson · 13 August 2019, 21:06

Hi, I have a Honwave T38 which appears to take on water! I have checked the rib all over and can find no damage. I filled the boat with water and again no signs of leaks. I haver changed the non return valve and again it still appears to take on water.
Has anyone else experienced similar issues or can point me in the right direction?

cheers

Dave

bomberman · 13 August 2019, 21:26

Hi Dave, what sort of quantity of water over what period. Ultimately if you have filled the boat up with water and nothing is getting out, i would imagine it can only be water coming over the tubes/transom during use or through the valve (unless it was raining lol)
Is the one way valve fitted the correct way round? Is there any debris in there wedging it open? I guess to check the one way drain valve you could from the outside of the transom pressurise some water around the valve....toilet plunger or similar full of water slowly press on the valve to see if that induces any ingress to the inside perhaps? (Wouldn't need to apply much pressure)

dave gregson · 13 August 2019, 21:50

Hi Bomberman, I think the valve is fitted the correct way? When I replaced the old valve it didn't appear to be broken / worn either. When you take the internal bung out it does appear to let water in which I don't understand? The water is definitely not coming in from over the tubes / transom as it happens on the flattest of days. It takes on quite a bit of water and you can feel it under the aluminium floor and you can feel the boat not handling too well and struggling to get on the plane. The valve has what looks like a screw fitting on the outside of the boat but I can't find any kind of screw in bung to fit it?

Fenlander · 13 August 2019, 22:34

Forgive me for nit picking but the T38 doesn't have an alloy floor... is it a T35 or T40?

Does it have drains like these... which should have a bung you can place in from the outside?

Honda Honwave Inflatable Boat Non Return Drain Bung

With all the SIB makes and models I've owned I've never left the bungs out/off for any time as unless you on the plane at higher speeds all the while water will seep through the one-way flap valves which are quite crude and not intended as a full perfect seal.

I mainly use them to take out and tip the boat to drain for packing away.

Actually here's a better view of the drain components... is your this type?

https://www.tridentuk.com/gb/honda-h...nder-boat.html

bomberman · 13 August 2019, 22:43

Hi Dave, Fenlander beat me to it (damn he is fast!) regarding the effectiveness of the valves.....I think a member on here a few years ago looked into that a little deeper and suggested ways to improve them. You mentioned a screw thread on the outside of the transom drain plug, does the drain plug screw together one half inside one half outside and a seal on each side on installation? And therefore is the outide half missing perhaps? (May be worth a picture if you could to show the threaded region if you could)

Fenlander · 13 August 2019, 22:53

>>> Fenlander beat me to it (damn he is fast!)

Just looking in with my bedtime cocoa!

bomberman · 13 August 2019, 23:17

Makes me want a hot chocolate!!!
I guess the threaded portion you describe is likely just the thread that is used to attach the inner and outer sections together.
You could try nipping the valve up screwing it a little tighter therefore applying more pressure to the seals and/or taking it apart and putting some sealant around the inside of the hole prior to reassembly (preventing water getting in around the valve) also makin sure the bung is pushed in when on the water (to ensure water not getting in through the valve)....then monitor it....maybe get out in the water and have a look to see if you can see anything coming in. Hope this helps and let us know how you get on

Locozodiac · 14 August 2019, 01:57

General causes for water intrusion :

-If having this type of drain valve and the outer plug is firmly inserted into the rear valve body there should be 0 water intrusion going on inside. Check that lower inner and outer lower transom's fabric is well glued to the entire lower transom's length. If not, there's the water intrusion.

-Probably the inner part of the valve needs to be adjusted a bit to seal well against both side of transom. Will need to remove all floors and adjust tight with hand.

-Those valves are usually installed bit higher than lower fabric, so there will always be water left overs on that area that will need to be dried with a rag, towel whatever.

Happy Boating

dave gregson · 14 August 2019, 08:46

Hi Fenlander,
Yes that is the drain plug I have fitted. The bung is on the inside of the boat and there isn't a external bung. It does appear to let water in when the bung isn't in place which a thought was strange given its a non return valve? I'm sure it is in the right way? I never leave the bung out unless I'm on the plane and trying to get rid of some of the water.
Thanks for all the advice I shall have a play next time I'm out on the water. cheers Dave

Fenlander · 14 August 2019, 09:16

Of course you're right... I'd forgotten after so many Zodiac models with the outside bungs and had to look at old pics of my T35 to remind the bung indeed is on the inside.

I think with such a crude flap non-return valve like most SIBs it's asking a lot for them not to seep water the wrong way when the bung is out. About all the purpose they serve is stopping a surge of water coming in if say a wave hits the stern or you reverse.

This is odd though as I've never had any SIB that's taken on an appreciable amount of water unless in poor conditions when I'd seen the spray flying in... yet in filling it with water and observing you ought to have found any leak.

As you say concentrate on it next time out to see any clues.

jeffstevens763@g · 14 August 2019, 20:52

Nothing to do with honwave but might be worth looking into on my Mercury it has mushroom drain with a gate valve to shut it off moves up and down its that good we had a down pour on Jura when I got in the boat no water it had self drained I never close it. The gate has a good strainer on it to stop debris fouling the mushroom just for info

https://shop.inflatableboatparts.com...slide-bailer/#

Locozodiac · 23 August 2019, 00:09

Is the "Bung" other name for a water plug ? if so, the drain valve is badly installed. The plug should face the outer transom as seen in pic 1 and the shorter piece face the inner transom.

Unscrew both sides of the drain valve, pull the middle chinese diaphragm out and install a Zodiac brand diaphragm, are flat, very flexible, with larger diam circumference which seals much better inside valve than the one factory delivered with said Sib. Pics speaks for themselves..

Seen many case in which when trying to remove large water quantities out transom with boat on plane, the diaphragm was expelled along with water sinking into the deep blue. To avoid that awful situation would suggest that once the new Zodiac diaphragm is installed, push the round part fully in with finger, with the other hand insert the Silicon's nozzle fully in on tip, while retiring it fully out press the tube firmly for exiting Silicone to form a much wider tip, once fully cured won't be expelled anymore.

Once done, apply silicone (X) to both rubber sides of the drain valve and screw back both sides firm on transom, let both parts to fully cure for at least 24 hours before Sib use. Can use Mega Grey Gasket Former, White Silicone or any other product available.

That water gate drain plug does not work well, will have unwanted water intrusion if rubber parts becomes shaved with use or sand gets between the sealing system. Better keep the one the Sib was factory delivered with and adapt it well as suggested, will work much better than before.

Happy Boating

Poly · 23 August 2019, 08:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locozodiac

Is the "Bung" other name for a water plug ?

Yes

Quote:

Once done, apply silicone (X) to both rubber sides of the drain valve and screw back both sides firm on transom, let both parts to fully cure for at least 24 hours before Sib use. Can use Mega Grey Gasket Former, White Silicone or any other product available.

The general guidance here is to avoid using actual silicone based sealants near inflatable boats. The contents migrate into monolayer non stick coatings which adhere well to hypalon and PVC and stop anything else ever sticking (like patches).

Locozodiac · 23 August 2019, 19:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poly

Yes

The general guidance here is to avoid using actual silicone based sealants near inflatable boats. The contents migrate into monolayer non stick coatings which adhere well to hypalon and PVC and stop anything else ever sticking (like patches).

Sorry mate just missed the point. It's used for a better water seal between both pieces sides and the transom which happens to be "plywood" made and located far away from those mentioned fabrics. Your useless criticism has nothing to do with the drain valve issue...

Happy Boating

Pikey Dave · 23 August 2019, 19:55

jeffstevens763@g · 23 August 2019, 20:57

Just for info if petrol has been spilt the mushrooms distort and will with age also hence water ingress IME

Poly · 24 August 2019, 09:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locozodiac

Sorry mate just missed the point. It's used for a better water seal between both pieces sides and the transom which happens to be "plywood" made and located far away from those mentioned fabrics.

the way silicones migrate you don’t need it to be particularly near where you intentionally put them - the vapours migrate. I really haven’t missed the point. If you want to use a sealant on your boat a polyurethane, silicone free, one would be better.

Quote:

Your useless criticism has nothing to do with the drain valve issue...

My useless criticism might just save someone who is little less arrogant that they know everything a heap of trouble with future patches.

Fenlander · 24 August 2019, 10:47

Just for the purposes of accuracy the proximity between the drain and fabric on a T38 is errr… the drain is actually fitted through the fabric and immediately above the HP floor tabs.

jeffstevens763@g · 24 August 2019, 12:03

Not useless criticism but spot on information from poly then

Pikey Dave · 24 August 2019, 12:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poly

the way silicones migrate you don’t need it to be particularly near where you intentionally put them - the vapours migrate. I really haven’t missed the point. If you want to use a sealant on your boat a polyurethane, silicone free, one would be better.

My useless criticism might just save someone who is little less arrogant that they know everything a heap of trouble with future patches.

I won’t let silicone sealant anywhere near my boat. It’s overrated & just about good for sealing a shower tray. Even then, it’ll need raking out after a couple of years. The problem with silicone is it’s quite expensive, so these tubes you see in B&Q for £1 quid a tube are mostly fillers & bulking agents. Usually chalk or talc. Proper good quality silicone is closer to £7-8 quid a tube, the same price as quality marine polymer sealant.