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Old 13 July 2021, 18:22   #21
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Originally Posted by Fenlander View Post
>>>Agreed, a little oil goes a long way. Especially when soaking into cardboard.

Agree with that bit but not that its an easy acceptable thing to spill oil when filling. That Suzuki has such an easy filler posn to take a bit of care/pride and not spill oil that would later worry the buyer.

Just noticed the prop question is a 12" the standard. I've seen these motors come out with anything from 10"-12" and the dealer told me they are random from the factory. Mine came with a 12" which I knew was too much for my outfit so I refused it and all the dealer would do was swap it for an 11" he had access to despite me asking for a 10". Even the 11" was too high a pitch so I had to spend about £100 on a 10" which was perfect.

But that was for our SIB and our load.... I think PD has a 11" or 12" on his so perhaps he'll comment. Could be the Volaire is a skimmy hull that will suit the higher pitch.

In any case you really need a small tach to judge running in and prop suitability... did you get one with the order?
Got a tach thing off ebay after we had a discussion in a thread a few weeks ago....I think it might have been one where you had pics of yours and how it was set up. I couldn't get one the same but I did get an identical looking one to somebody else's link....just under a different brand.....might have been pd.....will check the old posts later.

Not sure what settings it would need...I've read that some of these are a bit hit or miss how good they work.
Have posted pics up and maybe somebody will have experience with this particular one. How much wraps worked for them etc
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Old 13 July 2021, 18:55   #22
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One advantage with the Suzuki is that the idle speed (850 I think) is fixed by the ECU and stable so you know that is the figure you are looking for as you try the tach settings.
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Old 13 July 2021, 19:19   #23
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One advantage with the Suzuki is that the idle speed (850 I think) is fixed by the ECU and stable so you know that is the figure you are looking for as you try the tach settings.
Ok thats good to know. I did plan to idle it in barrel soon and to get the inital few minutes run in over. So will suss it out then, once I get a stand made.
Another to do job on the list
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Old 13 July 2021, 19:41   #24
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My Excel and Volaire Experience so far

We have the same tach/hour meter.
For a 2 cyl 4 stroke it should theoretically be set at 1 spark per revolution (1P1R).

However, as Fenlander says the Suzi ticks over at 850rpm, so just scroll through the settings until it reads 850 ish. If it’s set incorrectly it’ll read either half or double the revs, or worse, so easy to ascertain correct mode. Seem to recall five wraps round HT lead gives a reliable signal.

PS: Reckon you’ll struggle pulling revs with that stock 12” pitch prop. Gut feel 10” pitch would be more in the ball park…..tacho will be the acid test.
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Old 13 July 2021, 19:51   #25
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Excel Launch Wheels

Launch Wheels form Excel

As part of the package, I asked Excel to fit the wheels to the Volaire…. partly because I wasn’t confident drilling into the transom and also because I have limited spare time and no outdoor covered space to work in.

On trying them on quickly at the weekend, it took us a minute to decide on what way the brackets had been fitted to make the wheels fit the best.

I have seen various ways the wheels have ended up having to be fitted differently due to sib design issues.

But we set them up as in the photos, and it looks like they have done well to get the wheels going under the boat without dragging on the underside on the keel/strake protector bits. At least with the boat empty there is quite a bit of clearance.

They also seem to be at the widest possible distance for balance that the splash flap bits allow
(bingo wings as the better half calls them)

I did notice that at least one of the wheels does rub on the upper bingo wing when in the up position, and I imagine the wheels will spin when out on the water, rub against the spray flap and possibly damage the flap over time.

So will need to have a better look at that the next time we set it up.

I am not sure just how easy (or more to the point difficult) these wheels will be to handle once at the water though. So that might be an interesting experience we cannot really practice in advance.

Fenlander you were right that they are ones with bearings, so based on your experiences might not be the best, but will get us in the water for now, and hopefully back out again too.

Will have to come up with a quicker way of removing the legs as well I think, because folding them into the sib with the wheels off will make it even harder to pack away, and couldnt be arsed with the faff of unbolting them everytime.

The OCD eagled eye amongst you might also have noticed that the bolts through the transom might be slightly off, but not a big issue for me if I don’t look at it, and anyway it’s just an optical illusion

For some reason I imagined the wheel brackets would have been fitted with slightly thicker bolts through the transom.

If long enough I had planned to screw on at least 2 eyes (for holding stuff and to put a wire cable through to secure the OB) inside.

Then i thought about fitting 2 tow eyes on the outside and to attach a movable bracket for fitting the transducer on to one of the other...as Ive seen here on the forum

So that might need another re-think, and I might just have to grow a set, and drill through the transom after all

In fact the sib came with a pair of M10 316 Bolt and eyes in a bag, which I guess might have been the original eyes supplied.
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Old 13 July 2021, 20:10   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chipko View Post
We have the same tach/hour meter.
For a 2 cyl 4 stroke it should theoretically be set at 1 spark per revolution (1P1R).

However, as Fenlander says the Suzi ticks over at 850rpm, so just scroll through the settings until it reads 850 ish. If it’s set incorrectly it’ll read either half or double the revs, or worse, so easy to ascertain correct mode. Seem to recall five wraps round HT lead gives a reliable signal.

PS: Reckon you’ll struggle pulling revs with that stock 12” pitch prop. Gut feel 10” pitch would be more in the ball park…..tacho will be the acid test.
Cheers...will set it up soon and give it a go. Have read that because of the special floor design it can make a huge difference to how a prop would behave. But I wouldnt have a clue really and it would be a case of some testing with the tach once we gain a bit of experience. Then report back here to you guys with our findings.
I think top end and take off speeds of a average setup will do for us as newbies unless it is terribly off.
Probably if the setup turns out to be a keeper I would buy a second prop so as to have a spare anyway, so would probably get another one then.
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Old 13 July 2021, 20:23   #27
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>>>because of the special floor design it can make a huge difference to how a prop would behave.

Agreed it is the floor/contact area of a SIB which determines how it will go with any particular prop pitch once on the plane. The more efficient the hull/floor shape... i.e. the more it skims... the more it is able to pull that "high gear" to max OB revs. I honestly don't know where the Volaire sits in the SIB list for this aspect... taking it that the Elling and Fribs (almost a SIB really in usage) are efficient hulls and go well for any given outboard size hence can run larger pitch.... and at the other end of the scale the Aerotecs tend to drag a lot of hull in the water so are less likely to cope with over pitch.

But regardless of maximum speed on the plane at displacement speeds and when in transition to the plane then a modest pitch often works best. Hence Chipko's gut feeling. But as I said was hoping PD would spot this and confirm his prop pitch and how it goes.
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Old 13 July 2021, 20:58   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenlander View Post
>>>because of the special floor design it can make a huge difference to how a prop would behave.

Agreed it is the floor/contact area of a SIB which determines how it will go with any particular prop pitch once on the plane. The more efficient the hull/floor shape... i.e. the more it skims... the more it is able to pull that "high gear" to max OB revs. I honestly don't know where the Volaire sits in the SIB list for this aspect... taking it that the Elling and Fribs (almost a SIB really in usage) are efficient hulls and go well for any given outboard size hence can run larger pitch.... and at the other end of the scale the Aerotecs tend to drag a lot of hull in the water so are less likely to cope with over pitch.

But regardless of maximum speed on the plane at displacement speeds and when in transition to the plane then a modest pitch often works best. Hence Chipko's gut feeling. But as I said was hoping PD would spot this and confirm his prop pitch and how it goes.
He’s done a build thread might be on there David
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Old 13 July 2021, 21:11   #29
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…But as I said was hoping PD would spot this and confirm his prop pitch and how it goes.

Can’t remember off the top of my head, but 11” springs to mind, ooerr matron..
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Old 13 July 2021, 21:18   #30
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Can’t remember off the top of my head, but 11” springs to mind, ooerr matron..


Just checked my build thread, it’s 12”

Excel Volaire 390 build thread
https://www.rib.net/forum/f50/excel-volaire-390-build-thread-82696.html
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Old 13 July 2021, 22:53   #31
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Just checked my build thread, it’s 12”

Excel Volaire 390 build thread
https://www.rib.net/forum/f50/excel-volaire-390-build-thread-82696.html
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Old 13 July 2021, 22:58   #32
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Excel Volaire

The sib itself was far more impressive in real life once inflated than we thought it would be, and with the Suzuki on its back really impressed my son who was busy taking photographs with his phone to show his mates.
At least something woke him up!

The V really is more pronounced than any pictures or video shows, and the overall quality to us with no knowledge of sibs was still reassuring.

The floor was a lot more rubbery and almost sticky to touch (at least when dry), so perhaps our concerns of the dog sliding around everywhere were unfounded.
But since we got him (he was a rescue dog from Spain) he has always had a weird habit of frantically digging nonstop to make a bed if he is stressed, even on the lounge vinyl! So a rug of some sort for him might still be on the cards.

It also seemed to be really level and comfortable to stand on, but will see once in the water how it feels.

The rest of the sib tubes, cones etc seemed to be of equal quality to the floor in our opinion, although a few minor marks and dents form folding as expected (see pics)

On putting on the OB we did expect the balance of weight to be in our favour, but we were amazed at just how much lighter the sib became to handle and move around 1 handed (although only in the garden admittedly)

I am sure the under-bow metal D ring could be made more comfortable to grip or you could rig a better handle to clip on. But if there are 2 moving it using the side grab handles, they were very comfortable to hold for any size hand.

For those having to go a further distance, a bow trolley (like a few shown on the forum) would make it even easier, although always something else to deal with.

If the wheels do hold out better than Steves, I see no issues at all moving the set up a reasonable distance over half decent ground, particularly as there will always be at least two of us, and if the dog is there, at least three. Of courses over sand, rocks, or a greasy slipway underfoot it won’t be so easy, but I was really pleasantly surprised.

So now the perceived negatives, and of course this coming from someone who has no previous knowledge of a sib, and this was our first unboxing/pack away trial.

It really is a big heavy beast to move, especially while still in its box. Even now when it’s in a bag, we still struggled to move it, but is possible, and I had few injuries that were certainly a handicap on the day!

The extra thick material the Volaire is made of (depending what part of the excel website you read) is probably its own worst enemy in some ways. It obviously adds to the weight, and we also found it very hard to fold the cones to keep the package to a minimum length to put in the bag. The Excel Volaire logo is also at the cone/transom folding part which probably doesn’t help.

This was our first time trying to pack it down and we are hopeful it will become easier to pack as the material perhaps softens and we get used to doing it. But it would be interesting to see how the other Excel owners find this?

The bag was adequate, but I think I would upgrade to something more substantial with stronger tie straps later, which I think would help moving it around easier as well. On a lighter sib the bag might be ok.

We did notice a few small bubbles like bits etc under the seams but I guess this would be quite normal with most sibs

One negative particular to ours rib was there were lots of little shards of drilled metal all over the inside of the sib, presumably from drilling the transom and box section for the wheel brackets.

More than likely, these would not have harmed the sib, and some too small to do the any real harm to us. But some of the larger ones could have been quite nasty, and after my recent list of injuries, we took the precaution of vacuuming the inside after picking out all the larger pieces
.
There were small bits here and there that were slightly dented (where the metal brackets pushed against when folded I think which didnt dissapear when blown up) but we have now folded bubble wrap and towels in to protect the tubes. Also the metal brackets werent finished very well with a few sharp bits and also on the bolt ends.

But as said earlier overall we are really impressed, and cant wait to get the big beast wet
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Old 13 July 2021, 23:57   #33
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As a foot note for anyone away to inflate the sib for the first time! DO NOT use the instructions that come with the sib unless you are sure they are correct.

Ours came with instructions for various Excels models but not the Volaire, and if you didnt notice it gave the wrong pressures. It was only because I had read a similar post on here that I double checked.

Also when looking around on their website you might come across some conflicting information, so I would be a bit more careful and double check when ordering or in the store.
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Old 14 July 2021, 09:02   #34
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Just out of interest what is the correct floor pressure.... I seem to remember it's not a full HP??
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Old 14 July 2021, 09:11   #35
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As a foot note for anyone away to inflate the sib for the first time! DO NOT use the instructions that come with the sib unless you are sure they are correct.



Ours came with instructions for various Excels models but not the Volaire, and if you didnt notice it gave the wrong pressures. It was only because I had read a similar post on here that I double checked.



Also when looking around on their website you might come across some conflicting information, so I would be a bit more careful and double check when ordering or in the store.


We have an old bath towel that we put over the transom when we deflate & fold. It’s to stop the wheel brackets/bolts etc from digging into the tubes.
Re. Folding, as previously mentioned, we vac out the tubes & line up the seams as it comes under vacuum. We then open the valves to release the vacuum. It makes an awkward job easier.
The folded boat is a heavy old lump & the supplied bag is pants. Ours gave up after a couple of outings & the new bag that Jeff Stevens gave us didn’t last the season. I’ve had a custom reinforced jobby made at our local bag manufacturer, so far so good.
Re. Pressures. iirc the pressure is marked on the inflation valves. I printed a label & stuck it on the pump with the tube & floor pressures on.
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Old 14 July 2021, 09:22   #36
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Shame some swarf was left inside the boat, it only takes a second to
Hoover out.

There's a lot of man handling with these boats and I've slung a pair of these in my set up bag that I had in the workshop. They're useful for every day moving of awkward objects. (May even work on a teenage son? )

https://www.amazon.co.uk/KYLIN-SPORT...g+hand&sr=8-17
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Old 14 July 2021, 10:47   #37
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(May even work on a teenage son? )

https://www.amazon.co.uk/KYLIN-SPORT...g+hand&sr=8-17

You can hang one over the side to enable him to climb back in
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Old 14 July 2021, 11:18   #38
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Just out of interest what is the correct floor pressure.... I seem to remember it's not a full HP??
Tubes have both 0.25 bar (3.6psi) stamped on them at all the valves which is good. The floor doesn't say but on reading the instructions that came with it you might think it is 0.7 bar(10.15 psi) which is the volante I think.

Don't think I would like to try that pressure to experiment

The floor should be 0 4 bar (5.8psi) going by the website and pd. Although we stopped at 5psi and the pressure relief valve was escaping air.....so not 100% sure to be honest, although it was quite hot at the time.

Will have to check with pd and anyone else if theirs hold the full amount?

But yeah little things like the oil, the correct instructions, the bits of metal, the different info on the actual boat plates concerning max specifications (plates say 30hp compared to websites 25hp max)
all combine to niggle me that what seems a good product isn't well represented in other ways.
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Old 14 July 2021, 11:57   #39
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>>> But yeah little things like...

Yep I didn’t highlight the buildup of these varied issues but in truth they add up to a real lack of care which is concerning for the main outlet for Excel given the boats themselves seem to be ok.
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Old 14 July 2021, 14:25   #40
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They're useful for every day moving of awkward objects. (May even work on a teenage son? )

https://www.amazon.co.uk/KYLIN-SPORT...g+hand&sr=8-17
Does the Handling of Awkward teenage sons come under the Safe System of Work Act.......it not it should!

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You can hang one over the side to enable him to climb back in
Would only need the one hook for sure.......the other hand would still be clutching the phone as we dragged him onboard.......or not as the case may be
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