My Suzumar 320 sib - Page 3

Amukinado · 15 June 2014, 12:28

Ahah good to know!

Judging by the name and style I guess these Mercurys were American made?

The Mercury is being sold for 250€. Half the price of this Tohatsu:

Motor Tohatsu 9.9 HP - à venda Outros veículos, Lisboa - CustoJusto.pt

Landlockedpirate · 15 June 2014, 12:42

Buy the Tohatsu, uprate it to18hp, job done

Amukinado · 15 June 2014, 12:52

15 hp is the maximum for my Suzumar. Is it easy to upgrade?

Locozodiac · 15 June 2014, 16:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Landlockedpirate

Buy the Tohatsu, uprate it to18hp, job done

U can't upgrade a 9.9 to a 18 HP direct, will need to install 18 HP bigger pistons, work done at a machine shop and assuming it could be done. 9.9/15 are 250 CC, 18 is 300 CC.

Much faster and cheaper is a 9.9 to 15 HP.

Happy Boating

Locozodiac · 15 June 2014, 16:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amukinado

If that's the case, how does one change this piston rings?

In terms of service and maintenance, I intend to do everything on my own since I don't really trust big shops.

On those models you had to tear the whole powerhead appart to change pistons, don't know what they were thinking when the engine was market released. You can tell if it's a removable or non removable cyl head by checking if it has bolts or not that secures cylinder head to crankcase.

Better go for a 9.9 and upgrade to a 15 HP if that can be done fast and cheap like the Tohatsu. Cheap and old is not always best and if complicated to work with worst.

Happy Boating

Amukinado · 15 June 2014, 16:41

Ok, thanks! So to upgrade de 9.9 to 15 hp is just the carbswap or also needs exhaust porting?

Locozodiac · 15 June 2014, 17:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amukinado

Ok, thanks! So to upgrade de 9.9 to 15 hp is just the carbswap or also needs exhaust porting?

It's as simple as eating an ice cream cone, just a carb cam swap + probably slight + timming, will need to check that out. Would be perfect if you could provide end letter atached to 9.9 ? to check if that's the current model or the previous one.

Why is it that few trusts big shops, when they should be the ones to go after as opposed to small ones who haven't grown.

Happy Boating

Amukinado · 15 June 2014, 17:40

That's cool. If I end up going for that engine I'll provide the end letter (if there is still one

).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locozodiac

Why is it that few trusts big shops, when they should be the ones to go after as opposed to small ones who haven't grown.

From my experience big shops are big because they know how to sell. If they notice that you don't know much about the matter, they will try to make you buy stuff you don't want/need, plus charge you tons of money for simple tasks.
I once paid 50€ in a big bike shop for them to tell me that my bike sucks and couldn't be repaired for less than 1000€, so that I would buy a new one from them. Moral of the story, I repaired it myself with brand new parts and spent less than half of that. Now it's running as smooth as a baby's ass.

Amukinado · 17 June 2014, 04:09

Today I went and saw the Tohatsu 9.9. It started second pull and then stopped after some seconds. Turns out the last guy that used it didn't clean it with fresh water. After some cleaning it started working again and everything seemed ok to me. The thing is, I'm no expert and I don't whats normal or not.

The engine is being sold by a outboard motor repair shop and they said they serviced it and checked everything. This gives me more confidence than buying it from a private seller.

Here are some pics:

http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/n...o/CAM00219.jpg
http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/n...o/CAM00218.jpg
http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/n...o/CAM00217.jpg

I think it looks ok. I don't know what happened to the stickers (too much sun?) but the paint looks fine and the inside looked like new. No rust at all.

The price is 500€ with fuel tank. Do you think it's a go go?

Amukinado · 30 June 2014, 01:25

Can anyone of you guys with knowledge on the matter give me some input on this engine?

How much should it weight? Why does it look so massive?

Locozodiac · 30 June 2014, 19:02

Which letter is shown after 9.9 on that side sticker, there should be a manufacturing date too, probably 2006 ? The current models to go for is the 9.9 D2, easy to upgrade to 15 D2.m Overall paint seems good. Sun can eat and discolor anything. That engine weights 42 Kg.

The only difference with newer versions is just color, are dark blue, near black. Before buying check side letter for your peace of mind and wallet. 500 Euro is a good price, much better if happens to comes attached with a minimum time selling warranty. Post internal pics of both sides if possible to check its condition.

Happy Boating

Amukinado · 30 June 2014, 20:50

I think the engine is from 2000. I don't know the letter you are asking for.
The interior looks newish. No rust whatsoever.

My problem is the weight and the size of the thing... My beach house in Algarve doesn't have a garage, so I'll have to carry the boat inside during the night and I don't see myself being able to do that with an engine this size. Maybe it's possible but I recon that the risk of eventually damaging it is very high. Unfortunately I think I'll have to go smaller and lighter.

I also found out that 2 strokes are banned from dams in Portugal and this really tips the balance for me.
What do you think about the Suzuki DF6 and the Yamaha 2.5 hp (both 4 strokes)?

Locozodiac · 01 July 2014, 03:13

All Tohatsu 9.9-15-18 being same size brothers weights exactly same. Can't imagine myself passing from a 15 to a 2.5 or 6 HP, that only will happen if my whips get crossed. The least engine you should consider is a 4 strokes Tohatsu 9.8 HP, being the top of same 6-8 HP engines.

You could buy a 2.5 and use it as a nice anchor, that size will take you to nowhere land. If like pottering around at just fast displacement non planing speeds go fot the HP you like mot. But a 9.8 will be my vote in terms of power and portability.

Happy Boating

Amukinado · 01 July 2014, 04:39

Sorry Locozodiac for being such a pain in the ass. I guess choosing the boat was the easiest part!

Unfortunately there is no way I can afford a 9.8 hp 4 stroke right now. Let me explain the current scenario:

-My budget can stretch to about 800€ (give or take).
-Without the license I am limited to 6 hp (license costs about 300€).
-2 strokes are banned from dams and lakes in here.
-Engine should weight less than 30 kg and be portable.

So unfortunately given the situation I have to discard 2 strokes, which was going to be my choice in first place. I like to camp with my friends near dams and fish some bass. What's the point of having a boat if I can't use it?

Right now I can get a Yamaha F2.5 for about 450€ or a Suzuki DF6 for 950€. Those were the best matches I could find so far.

My idea atm is to get the F2.5, maybe get the license and next year I could swap this outboard for a portable 9.9 hp. I recon I could sell the Yamaha easily with little loss.

Locozodiac · 01 July 2014, 21:26

Don't worry if being a PITA, just suggesting best options to consider and which don't. You already have the sib. If going for a 4 strokes 2.5 what will happen if boating with your mates, is that you'll be thrown overboard for such a bad combo performance. Better would be a 3.5 or inquire if that 2.5 HP could be upgraded to a 3.5, will push better, but with power limitations too.

Personally have had 3.5, are just good to potter around, will push nicely even larger sibs/ribs but won't plane a 320, probably not even with you alone.

Make the effort and go for a 6 which could sell latter much better and faster than a 2.5 turtle. But you should future aim for a 15 HP engine, which is the HP that 320 sib requieres to have fun.

Happy Boating

Amukinado · 01 July 2014, 22:06

I've set a test drive with the seller of the Yamaha and then I'll decide if I can live with it or not.

By the way, these are the kind of adverse conditions my sib will be facing:

The idea is to scout that coastline you see on the last 2 pictures and to get to beaches that are only accessible by sea (the first picture).

Landlockedpirate · 01 July 2014, 22:18

That looks terrible, how do you manage to live somewhere as awful as that

Got to say the 2.5 is a tiny engine, and because its single cylinder and you will have to run it flat out, its going to be a noisy little bugger.

I dont think our advice is going to help you much, you live in another country with your own personal circumstances, you have to find the engine thats right for you. Unfortunately that usually means taking the odd wrong turn along the way before you get it right.

Get an engine bought, any engine. With places like your pictures, you need to be on the water, not on the computer. Good Luck

Amukinado · 02 July 2014, 00:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Landlockedpirate

I dont think our advice is going to help you much, you live in another country with your own personal circumstances, you have to find the engine thats right for you. Unfortunately that usually means taking the odd wrong turn along the way before you get it right.

Get an engine bought, any engine. With places like your pictures, you need to be on the water, not on the computer. Good Luck

I think you're right in every point.

The most important part for me right know is getting an engine before Summer.

From what I have been reading, 4 stroke Tohatsu are not so good. What are the brands to go for? Yamaha and Suzuki? Are Mariner and Parsun any good?

From what I got (only small 4 strokes):

Suzuki: good
Yamaha: good
Honda: ok
Tohatsu: meh
Mercury: nope
Parsun: ?
Mariner: ?

Is my list correct?

Locozodiac · 02 July 2014, 14:45

What a dangerous and horrible deserted coastline you have in Portugal. Any engine badly or not serviced at all will be a real ecocomic disater to anyone who has any given brand engine.. Where did you get that list data ? Some issues about Tohatsu that probably don't know :

1-It's the oldest Japanese outboard manufacturer, 7 yeras older than Yam. Starter 1953, 60 years on the market.

2-Produces 300K engines for anual worldwide sales between Tohatsu, Nissan, Mercury, Mariner and now Evinrude, up to 30 HP in 4 strokes, and same range up to 50 HP 2 strokes engines for countries that have not banned its use. It's by far the largest brand by sold engines worldwide compared to Yam.

3-Preferred 50 HP engine for Zap Cats Racers along Somalie Pirates.

Been selling 3.5-5-18-30-40-50 Tohatsus for the last 7 years, with only 1 down issue, a 18 HP Ignition Coil failure due to idiotic owner breaking original spark plug cap and replacing it by a non compatible scooter plug, which shortened the IC. And down here boaters are very reluctant to send heir engines to service once out of the box.

Any one cylinder engine opposed to a 2 cylinder one, will vibrate more and be bit noisier. If going for the 2.5 Yam, check if cheap and possible to pass to next 3.5 HP. Test that small 2.5 throughout the throttle range to experience its thrust limitations at each setting. 3/4 to wot won't make much a difference, so don't demand much that portable engine if loaded.

If boating area are same as nice posted pics, would go straight>>>to >>>6 HP, you decide- BTW, been to Caiscais during my youth, nice beach.

Happy Boating

Amukinado · 02 July 2014, 15:14

I got this list form user reviews I have been reading. Read nothing but good things about 2 stroke Tohatsu but the 4 stroke nissan, mercury and Tohatsu had some bad reviews, specially Mercury. The ones with least bad reviews were Suzuki and Yamaha (only talking about 4 strokes).

I'll see if I can go for the DF6 but right now it's just to much money. The option I'm considering right now is going for the Yamaha 2.5 and taking the license. Next year I can sell it with little loss (those engines are very easy to sell in Portugal) and get a 9.8.