New SIB owners, need pointers and help with choosing an engine and

[Katie.harker]

Hello all,

My partner and I bought a SIB/folding RIB today (what is the difference?); a bit of an impulse buy.
We have talked about buying something for years, on and off, but we didn't have a car.
He mentioned it again a few days ago when we saw some canoes in Costco.

We went out to have a browse at what was available - we are both on the heavy side so the weight limit and being able to squeeze our butts in was an issue with standard canoes. We found a place and when we got there, they were moving site so offered us a Europa Sport A300 for £600. (3m, aluminium deck).
Is that a reasonable price? Is it a decent enough brand? Too late anyway!
We are only looking for something to use on lakes and rivers.

So now we are looking at a motor for it. It can take up to 10HP - OH wants one that he will be able to be fun with, based on 250kg load but we're on a budget.
What power motor should we get? We will need to be able to lay it down for transport.

Can anyone point us in the direction off, or explain, the rules for taking an inflatable boat out? We want to go out on the River Dee and occasionally Bala Lake initially. Do we need insurance, a licence, specific permission to go out on the water?

[Fenlander]

SIB... soft inflatable boat that may or may not have a removable hard floor and the boat will dismantle/fold up to go in the car.

RIB... a hard hull with an inflatable "collar"... can't be folded up to go in the car... well there is the Frib that has a hard hull that hinges in 2 places and folds but they are less common then a straight SIB or RIB.

Given that you were impulse buying new then that Europa Sport is a decent buy for £600... they are often around £800 or more new. They are what we would call a generic Chinese brand and that's not a negative at this price point and for your stated use.

For the river anything above 4hp will push you along fine and probably exceed the allowable speed limit (6mph on the Dee). If the lakes you go on have no speed limit then a 10hp will plane you at 3x river speeds.

You say you are on a budget so I guess a new 10hp around £1700 will not be on the list?? The ideal outboard for your use is the lightweight Tohatsu 9.8 2-stroke but these are in great demand so are often £850-£1200 even when 10+yrs old. Like this one... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/tohatsu-9-...MAAOSw4CFY1-ew

If you were happy with a 4hp then an old 2-stroke or 4-stroke in decent order could be found around £400.... something like this... Mercury 4hp four stroke outboard boat engine | eBay

To go on the Dee look here... https://www.cheshirewestandchester.g...nsing-2017.pdf £72 for first registration then £20 per day or £122 per year for the licence. They require you to have insurance which will be about £45/yr from Craftinsure online... http://www.craftinsure.com/ I use them and you can get insured in minutes via the online application then you download and print your own documents.

From what I can see Bala Lake does not allow any powered boats unless electric.

Going on the sea has no licence or insurance requirements as such... but different harbours and slipways may have their own local rules that ask for insurance or a launch fee.

Hope the above is of use and gets the thought processes going!

[Fenlander]

BTW forgot to say welcome to the forum Katie and OH.

David

[Katie.harker]

Thanks!
We initially were looking at a boat/canoe for paddling - justifying it saying we'll get exercise. Would we need to register, insure and get a licence if we don't have a motor on it?

We are probably looking for one even less than £400 - this is very much in proof of concept stage for us, we have no idea how much time we will be going out or if we would enjoy it enough!
We are even considering an electric motor for it.

My OH would like to know if anyone has any experience of cheap, "chinesium" motors, e.g BRAND NEW 5,8 HP LIGHT OUTBOARD 2 STROKE MOTOR LIGHT INFLATABLE FISHING ENGINE | eBay.

We understand this would not last for very long but as a first stage introduction to this hobby, would this get us going (pun intended)?
For the record, I have told him not to go too cheap - you buy cheap, you buy twice.

According to Europa, this is a CAT C - "inshore waters, up to and including 2m wave height, beaufort scale up to and including gale force 6."
In layman terms, what does that mean? To me, offshore means away from the shore but OH thinks inshore means inland - like lakes and rivers.
Is it suitable for pootling around Llandudno and other beaches? I tend to get seasick in small boats so I don't see us going coastal much anyway.

[Katie.harker]

We're off to view a British Seagull Kingfisher 6HP motor!

[Poly]

You are right and your OH is wrong on the difference between inshore and inland! Don't read too much into the RCD categories though, as there only four categories to cover everything from duck pond to ocean going! Certainly at the bottom end they aren't tightly policed either - so whilst the boat may be fine in 2m waves there is no way you'll be rowing in that or that a small electric outboard is going to cope well.

A good rule of thumb for small sibs in the hands of beginners is probably never out of sight of land. As you aren't looking to spend loads an electric motor may be a mistake, first you need some massive batteries, second at the budget end of the scale you'll be getting the equivalent of a few HP at best. If your main intent is to row it, I would suggest an inflatable is a bad choice - it's doable for short distances but pretty inefficient.

At your budget training is going to seem expensive. The good news is you don't legally need any. The bad news is that when things go wrong it can be really messy and training makes a big difference. If you decide to avoid it, then work out (and maybe test) plans for different things going wrong? E.g. Breaking down; running low on fuel/battery; losing an oar overboard; someone falling in; the boat taking on water; the weather turning bad; surf making it too dodgy to land; one of you being injured/unwell; getting tide wrong so you are fighting the current or have boat can't get back to the slipway; coming across someone else in trouble; capsizing; puncture; fog etc...

I've experienced pretty much all of those at some point in messing around in small boats. Training and experience (and a dose of luck) means I've never had to call on the RNLI.

[Fenlander]

I will refrain from saying more until we hear if you bought the Seagull.... but very much hope you have avoided the Chinese strimmer with a boat prop!!

[Katie.harker]

We have bought the Seagull!

British Seagull Kingfisher outboard engine 6 HP | eBay

Paid £270, cash. Not yet tested it though.

OH said that was all that cheap one was, so I suggested getting some sort of adapter for our petrol strimmer. He didnt go for it though.

[jeffstevens763@g]

Nice little Johnson £220 on here would do you fine.

[willk]

Originally Posted by Katie.harker

We have bought the Seagull!

That's a great Trolling motor...

[Katie.harker]

Dare I ask?

[kerny]

Originally Posted by Katie.harker

Dare I ask?

Trolling!! going slow for when fishing of the back of a boat [emoji106] [emoji12]

[thestig1973]

River Dee is a good place to start, easy launch and free parking, I've never registered my sib but just paid £20 for day license

Windermere is also excellent, easy launch and parking at ferry nabb, although you will need to register boat and pay launch fees if your using an outboard...... forget rowing as sibs are susceptible to wind, currents etc so won't navigate anything like a canoe and you'll be bored within minutes

Europa are basically copies of the honwave brand, fantastic value for a well made boat in my opinion.... presume you purchased from MES marine

[kerny]

Ullswater is great and it's free :thumbup:

[thestig1973]

Originally Posted by kerny

Ullswater is great and it's free :thumbup:

Coniston is free too, although I think all the jetties are privately owned so not sure you can stop for lunch etc..... never tried ullswater except for on a kayak....

[kerny]

Originally Posted by thestig1973

Coniston is free too, although I think all the jetties are privately owned so not sure you can stop for lunch etc..... never tried ullswater except for on a kayak....

It's a great place for sibbing Stig also there are a couple of camsites that give you access onto Ullswater or the other alternative is a pay and display car park at the ferry terminus .

[thestig1973]

Originally Posted by kerny

It's a great place for sibbing Stig also there are a couple of camsites that give you access onto Ullswater or the other alternative is a pay and display car park at the ferry terminus .

Cheers Kerny.... might try ullswater soon, sounds perfect for my needs with camping, no boat fees etc [emoji106]

[Katie.harker]

Originally Posted by kerny

Trolling!! going slow for when fishing of the back of a boat [emoji106] [emoji12]

Oh! With the popcorn eating emoji, I thought he meant troll as in Internet trolling!

Are you saying the motor is slow?

[Yabadabadoo]

Motor will push you along at displacement speed, trolling in boat terms is very slow speed so you can tow a fish bait or lure out the back of the boat usually by hand or by rod. Welcome to the forum! Michael

[Fenlander]

>>>Oh! With the popcorn eating emoji, I thought he meant troll as in Internet trolling!

Willk is a bit wicked and I suspect he was happy with both interpretations!

Probably many of us sitting on our hands over the purchase of a Seagull for use on a SIB so just to offer up some information...

Seagulls are an ancient design and the model you have bought is designed to push a heavy old boat very slowly. They are the least suited outboard to something light like a SIB. They take a fuel mixture that is heavy on oil and so smoke loads.... they are very noisy too.

We started off with one on our first SIB... it lasted about two trips.

Having said that every smallcraft boater should experience a Seagull at least once... so it will be interesting as novices to see how you get on with it.