New to SIB's

[Robmac]

Hello,

I am new to SIB's and have just been researching a suitable boat for single handing on my local river (Great Ouse) as well as the Lakes and the Scottish Lochs.

I was considering this;

https://www.excel-inflatables.co.uk/...oat-xhd485.php

From my intro post it becomes apparent that this may not be practical for me on my own.

I have also considered this which is a bit lighter and smaller;

https://www.fishingmad.co.uk/12135-b...boat-13ft.html

I do like a lot of space and will be carrying quite a lot of camping gear. I'm not really interested in speed - more economical cruising but would like the capacity to get out of trouble if need be on the bigger Scottish lochs.

Does anybody have any experience of the Bison SIB's or would like to make further suggestions?

I would like an aluminium floor but could be swayed to an airdeck.

Thanks in advance.

[Fenlander]

Some random thoughts...

I wondered why you want a lot of room if it sounds like it's just you? If solo a 3.2-3.5m would hold enough gear surely. Unless there is a really good reason for it weight and bulk can be a right nuisance unless on a trailer.

Re brands in truth many are very similar in build quality... despite what you might hear from over loyal owners. If you are considering an alloy floor model with low pressure sausage keel for leisure use by and large they will all perform the same. So it might just come down to price, availability or even colour.

Re speed I assume you are familiar with being on the plane vs displacement speed... the theory even if not the reality. A 6hp with the correct pitch prop would probably move even a 4m plus at displacement speeds OK but once you want to plane it's a different matter. A smaller light SIB is just OK lightly loaded with a 10 hp as we have... but add weight and you soon need 15 then a 20hp. I would say with a load in the 4.85 a 25/30hp might be preferred as others have said on the other thread... and they are really too heavy to be part of a non-trailed outfit.

[909]

The first boat is 116KG ( 255 LBS ) .

The second boat is 86 KG ( 189 LBS ) .

Add a 30 HP outboard and you're looking at anywhere between 140 - 200 KGS (310- 440 LBS ) .

I just don't see how a solo person carry all that weight on their own, without a trailer.

If you're going to trailer it, might as well get a RIB.

I personally wouldn't use a trailer on a SIB I intended on keeping.

[Robmac]

Originally Posted by Fenlander

Some random thoughts...

I wondered why you want a lot of room if it sounds like it's just you? If solo a 3.2-3.5m would hold enough gear surely. Unless there is a really good reason for it weight and bulk can be a right nuisance unless on a trailer.

Re brands in truth many are very similar in build quality... despite what you might hear from over loyal owners. If you are considering an alloy floor model with low pressure sausage keel for leisure use by and large they will all perform the same. So it might just come down to price, availability or even colour.

Re speed I assume you are familiar with being on the plane vs displacement speed... the theory even if not the reality. A 6hp with the correct pitch prop would probably move even a 4m plus at displacement speeds OK but once you want to plane it's a different matter. A smaller light SIB is just OK lightly loaded with a 10 hp as we have... but add weight and you soon need 15 then a 20hp. I would say with a load in the 4.85 a 25/30hp might be preferred as others have said on the other thread... and they are really too heavy to be part of a non-trailed outfit.

The reason I like a lot of room is that I simply don't like moving stuff around to try and find something - I'm not a very organised type of bloke and like things to hand. I would also like to be able to move around the boat at anchor for fishing.

I appreciate your comments regarding brands and have pretty much come to the same conclusions myself, warranties also come into play but at the price of something like the Bison if after a couple of years something goes drastically wrong, it's not the end of the world.

Yes, I am familiar with planing/displacement having owned 20+ motor boats, but I'm not particularly interested in getting on the plane rather just having enough power to get out of trouble on some of the bigger lochs, my interest is more for slow paced touring and on my local river where it will get the majority of use there is a 5mph speed limit. I still haven't decided on engine size, but the sellers of the Bison 3.9 report that it is ideal with a 9.9 and they themselves used it to fish in the great tidal race off of Tromso on their Norwegian trip.

I do intend to fit transom wheels which will help with handling the boat to the water but if I do start to struggle then I will have to reconsider and maybe then go for something smaller.

Once again, thanks for your input, much appreciated.

[Robmac]

Originally Posted by 909

The first boat is 116KG ( 255 LBS ) .

The second boat is 86 KG ( 189 LBS ) .

Add a 30 HP outboard and you're looking at anywhere between 140 - 200 KGS (310- 440 LBS ) .

I just don't see how a solo person carry all that weight on their own, without a trailer.

If you're going to trailer it, might as well get a RIB.

I personally wouldn't use a trailer on a SIB I intended on keeping.

Unfortunately I don't have room for a trailer at home and if I did it probably wouldn't remain my property for very long!

As said above I intend to fit transom wheels so I wouldn't be lifting the weight of the boat and the engine at the same time - I am quite familiar with lifting outboards so I know my limits in that respect, but then again I'm not getting any younger so we will see!

Many thanks for your input.

[Robmac]

I found this Youtube vid a few days ago and love it. It shows the capabilities of the Bison 3.9 in sheltered waters and looks quite impressive in terms of load carrying and performance with a 20hp at half throttle;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvNtK61Y7SA

Does anybody know if he is a member here?

[Fenlander]

I don't think a member but maybe the Bison owner The Gurnard mentioned?

However did you notice in a video a few months later he changed to an Excel Volaire 430? Supposedly to have a lighter SIB as the Volaire is an air floor... the odd thing though the Volaire weighs 2lbs more than the Bison he had.

If you believe you need something large the Volaire might be worth looking at as it will get you well over the 4m size but for 30kg less than the 485 alloy floor model you were considering. Also it is claimed the Volaire will go well for a smaller OB than the large alloy floor models.

[Robmac]

Originally Posted by Fenlander

I don't think a member but maybe the Bison owner The Gurnard mentioned?

However did you notice in a video a few months later he changed to an Excel Volaire 430? Sopposedly to have a lighter SIB as the Volaire is an air floor... the odd thing though the Volaire weighs 2lbs more than the Bison he had.

If you believe you need something large the Volaire might be worth looking at as it will get you well over the 4m size but for 30kg less than the 485 alloy floor model you were considering. Also it is claimed the Volaire will go well for a smaller OB than the large alloy floor models.

Thanks for that I will take a look at the Volaire when I go up to Excel on Tuesday.

I'm a bit nervous about the airdeck floors, probably unnecessarily. My fear is getting gravel on my boots and puncturing the floor. I suppose I could maybe put some rubber matting down?

[Robmac]

Another of Stephen's videos - is that the Gurnard turning up at the start of the video?

He also notices a puncture on launching which is a bit worrying!

[Fenlander]

Re outboards it's always a difficult choice to balance HP, weight and cost. I'm assuming new/nearly new? Some thoughts...

If you really only ever want displacement speed then as I said before a light 6HP would probably do. But as you probably know if you seek that bit faster with a small OB that won't get you to plane you just get bow rise, huge wash and poor fuel consumption. The problem around the coast with limiting to displacement speed is that are tides in some areas that can move at about the same speed... so I always want to have the ability to plane.

On these larger SIBs you are considering a 10HP should plane but maybe not be so keen if you have a heavy load and they don't respond so quickly on/off the plane in a difficult sea like a more powerful motor so working the waves can be more challenging.

15HP in general should start to be of a size that performs OK... and 20HP generally really good unless we are talking about the largest heaviest SIB you've considered if well laden.

Re weights just taking Suzuki as an example the 6HP is an easily manageable 24kg, the 10HP jumps loads to 40kg but then the 15HP is only a small amount more at 44kg.... and the 20HP the same as the 15HP.

And taking cost in to account the 10HP is perhaps the worse choice all round as it hardly saves any weight over the 15HP and is only £150 cheaper.

So assuming cost not an issue if you decided on the need to plane then why have a 40kg 10HP when you can have double the power for just an extra 4kg?

As usual with a first foray into SIBs there are a lot of interacting factors and it's really hard to get it 100% right first time.

[Fenlander]

Yep that is The Gurnard with his small alloy RIB.

[Fenlander]

Air floors are more durable than you'd think. In ten years of owning several I've only had one very slow puncture from a bit of sharp gravel. I don't use a mat but many do. Punctures are usually an easy and secure repair.

[Robmac]

Originally Posted by Fenlander

Air floors are more durable than you'd think. In ten years of owning several I've only had one very slow puncture from a bit of sharp gravel. I don't use a mat but many do. Punctures are usually an easy and secure repair.

Good to hear that. Yes I would use a mat I reckon.

[Robmac]

Originally Posted by Fenlander

Re outboards it's always a difficult choice to balance HP, weight and cost. I'm assuming new/nearly new? Some thoughts...

If you really only ever want displacement speed then as I said before a light 6HP would probably do. But as you probably know if you seek that bit faster with a small OB that won't get you to plane you just get bow rise, huge wash and poor fuel consumption. The problem around the coast with limiting to displacement speed is that are tides in some areas that can move at about the same speed... so I always want to have the ability to plane.

On these larger SIBs you are considering a 10HP should plane but maybe not be so keen if you have a heavy load and they don't respond so quickly on/off the plane in a difficult sea like a more powerful motor so working the waves can be more challenging.

15HP in general should start to be of a size that performs OK... and 20HP generally really good unless we are talking about the largest heaviest SIB you've considered if well laden.

Re weights just taking Suzuki as an example the 6HP is an easily manageable 24kg, the 10HP jumps loads to 40kg but then the 15HP is only a small amount more at 44kg.... and the 20HP the same as the 15HP.

And taking cost in to account the 10HP is perhaps the worse choice all round as it hardly saves any weight over the 15HP and is only £150 cheaper.

So assuming cost not an issue if you decided on the need to plane then why have a 40kg 10HP when you can have double the power for just an extra 4kg?

As usual with a first foray into SIBs there are a lot of interacting factors and it's really hard to get it 100% right first time.

Definitely interacting factors. Previous boating experience helps but still a big learning curve.

I'm not a wealthy man but I should get about £11k for my present boat and although I don't want to spend it all, it does give me quite a lot of scope regarding engines so 20hp isn't out of the question.

Lots going round in my head at the moment so really looking forward to Tuesday and seeing some boats close up.

Thanks for taking the time to advise - that's what I joined for!

PS I thought that was the Gurnard having seen some of his videos so I'm glad you confirmed it.

[Fenlander]

Re Tuesday many folks are totally happy with their Excel dealings... but remember you are meeting a salesman!

[Robmac]

Originally Posted by Fenlander

Re Tuesday many folks are totally happy with their Excel dealings... but remember you are meeting a salesman!

Yes indeed.

That's why the wife is coming with me!

[Fenlander]

Excellent. Really looking forward to hearing what you think to the SIB idea and choices when close up to them.

[Robmac]

Originally Posted by Fenlander

Excellent. Really looking forward to hearing what you think to the SIB idea and choices when close up to them.

[Steve509926]

When I went to Excel and I saw the Volaire 390, that's the SIB I knew I had to have, big, sleek and really looked the part...................... then I attempted to lift the packed away Volaire 390 into the back of my Navara and reality kicked in. It may have been the SIB I wanted but unfortunately, although I'm relatively fit and healthy, I knew age and back issues would eventually play there part, hence the SD360. The 15hp Merc came about because at the time new 20hp OB where as rare as hens teeth, otherwise I would have gone for a 20hp, and in the future I still might.

I wouldn't be concerned about an Airdeck. Use a mat if you are worried about punctures, I do because of the dogs claws, but most people I know don't.

No mater what size of SIB you eventually go for, my advice (for what it's worth) is to lean towards the largest OB you can easily manage. I would much sooner be on a SIB at half throttle doing a reasonable speed, than on a SIB with a smaller OB at full throttle doing the same speed, quiter, less strenuous and probably more economical.

Good luck in your quest for your ideal SIB and OB.

[jeffstevens763@g]

Highfield sell some light weight aluminium hulled sibs worth a look