Pulley system for sib or winch

daveyirl · Yesterday, 21:07

Hey all

I recently got a honwave t38 ie3 & a 20hp outboard

I posted a separate thread about manageable weights of sibs before . I am glad I got the lightest one !

So a couple of months in , I’d like some advice on a rope / pulley set up,

So basically I live on the sea so any solution can be permanent (albeit I can’t do anything below the high water mark)

At low tide I have about 40 meters. Plenty of large stones that make it awkward at the flat part then a bit of an incline where it is a bit more pebbly and loose.

It is no problem with 2 people
It is barely manageable with 1 - at low tide it is unpleasant and takes some of the joy out of the whole experience.

Some info and things I have to hand

- it’s not accessible by car really. The access to the sea is perpendicular to the driveway for cars. I could do redirect pulleys etc but I would be blind . It’s an option but not my preference
- I will likely get a small tractor or quad in the future for other reasons . Not ready to bite that bullet just yet
- I have a trolley (suprod - it is light weight) - rear wheels are ok . Castor wheel is more like a break ! Would need to replace
- I have a loan of some railblaza kayak wheels that I can buy cheap if they are of use
- I have heavy duty transom wheels on that are decent

So I’m looking for something to help make like a bit easier and am considering the following but would love some input.

- manual winch - are they super slow for a distance of 40m ?
Any particular ones that might be quick?

- electric winch - I’ve gone off this idea . Battery usage , being left at the sea . Just feels like hassle and if it is 40m could burn out ? Most I’ve looked at are not really built for that long a distance

- a pulley system - I have plenty of fixing points at the top of my access. My first thought was just to fix the rope to a point at top of access and have a single pulley on front of boat . If I do that using the transom wheels , how do I keep the bow up? Is there a better system ? I don’t really think I need more mechanical advantage than 2 to 1 and setting up multiple pulleys will take a lot of rope ! I can imagine getting frustrated managing more than 100m of rope.

- I could get balloon wheels which seem to make a big difference

Re the things above , the question the. is whether I can make it work with the transom wheels alone ? Keeping bow up somehow. Or clipping it to be but then where is the pulley ?
or if I need to use the trolley ?

I can use the kayak wheels either on the bow or on the trolley. Not sure if best way to attach to boat - I tried ratchet straps but when the going got tough the boat slipped off them .

Lots of details & questions but I’ve thought about it a lot. One important thing is to keep it as simple as possible . Given I’m at the sea , I want to avoid anything that takes time / fiddling around with.

Fenlander · Yesterday, 22:26

What part of the process is giving you the greatest problem? The stones/boulders being too large for transom wheels to roll over... the steeper pebble part causing the transom wheels to dig in... lifting the bow at the same time as pulling being too hard work (or are you using the suprod trolley)??

An image with greater detail of the whole route at low tide might help (I did look back at the one posted when you asked re this in Aug).

daveyirl · Yesterday, 23:00

Thanks Fenlander

Fair point about photos - I’m attaching a couple here . Can take more tomorrow .

In the photo with the ropes , that is getting to low tide . At low tide there is another 10 meters of similar terrain.

I’m not using the trolley. I’d need to remove the castor wheel and get some better solution for the front . At the moment it feels like the trolley is much harder work that just the transom wheels

The transom wheels need more strength to get over the rocks . I can do it , but it’s a big job . With 2 it is easy. I’d say if I had 20% more strength I’d be sorted . I would say the softer stuff is a similar issue in terms of struggle albeit I’m a bit worn out by the top.

The easiest thing for me to try / test is a pulley system - I’ve plenty of rope and a few pulleys. I’m just not sure the best way to rig it to keep the bow up or how to rig it if I am holding the bow somehow.

I haven’t done myself too many favours yet in terms of approach - e.g. At the moments I’ve been pulling by rope while walking up backwards . E.g. Would a harness or putting the rope around my shoulders help a lot ?

I should mention that I am keeping the outboard on the boat . It’s 45kg and I don’t want to be messing with it every time.

Steve509926 · Yesterday, 23:39

I'm still of the opinion that the easiest option is to separate the outboard from the sib and take them to and from the water separately. The sib won't be a problem on good transom wheels and the outboard will be manageable on a converted sack truck.
Pulleys, winches etc to launch and retrieve every time are, IMO, just going to be cumbersome and you will eventually stop using them.

beamishken · Yesterday, 23:46

I'd have thought a better launching trolley ,wider with larger diameter wheels & a good wheel on the front would be the best option. I've always found transom wheels leave you having to lift a significant amount of the weight as well as pull which makes for an awkward stance. With a good launch trolley with a good size front wheel & using a pulley system means you keep both hands free to pull with. The front wheel doesnt need to swivel as you can balance the boat so theres negligible weight on the front & the rope should keep the rig in roughly the right direction & if it does get out of line it's easily pushed back into line.

smallribber · Today, 06:01

Much larger wider wheels. As this is a permanent set up I would not separate the sib and engine

daveyirl · Today, 07:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by smallribber

Much larger wider wheels. As this is a permanent set up I would not separate the sib and engine

At the moment both the trolley and the transom have 15inch - not sure of thickness . What would you recommend ?

Fenlander · Today, 08:20

I think Steve and Ken have ideas worth trying before a rope and pulley which does seem to be a convoluted idea.

If the outboard and fuel tank were removed the SIB would probably be really easy to move on the transom wheels just pulling by the bow handle without extra moving kit. In the August thread The Gurnard showed his chunky wheeled outboard trolley and something like that would work.

If taking Ken's idea a pair of twin wheels on the front of the launch trolley would likely make a huge difference.

Both ideas are shown in The Gurnard's image on post 10 of the August thread...

https://www.rib.net/forum/f50/advice...sib-91378.html

Also don't forget Chipko's moon buggy as pictured on post 44 of this thread...

https://www.rib.net/forum/f50/elling...lse-87762.html

daveyirl · Today, 08:31

OK - thanks - I didn't really want to be duplicating items from the last thread as I thought this conversation would go the way of the pulley rigging and winch pros/cons.

All good feedback and consistent

I have an outboard trolley as I have a couple of other engines etc so I have the kit to take it off. I'll see if I can figure something out that allows me to keep it combined.

Vevor has 10, 13 and 15.7 inch wheels - woud these 15.7 do? I have a fabricator that coul figure out some way to get them on the troller as they won't fit as standard.

https://eur.vevor.com/beach-wheels-c...p_010994180630

daveyirl · Today, 08:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve509926

I'm still of the opinion that the easiest option is to separate the outboard from the sib and take them to and from the water separately. The sib won't be a problem on good transom wheels and the outboard will be manageable on a converted sack truck.
Pulleys, winches etc to launch and retrieve every time are, IMO, just going to be cumbersome and you will eventually stop using them.

Thanks Steve. I am going out the weekend and will separate them and see how that goes.

Quote:

I'd have thought a better launching trolley ,wider with larger diameter wheels & a good wheel on the front would be the best option. I've always found transom wheels leave you having to lift a significant amount of the weight as well as pull which makes for an awkward stance. With a good launch trolley with a good size front wheel & using a pulley system means you keep both hands free to pull with. The front wheel doesnt need to swivel as you can balance the boat so theres negligible weight on the front & the rope should keep the rig in roughly the right direction & if it does get out of line it's easily pushed back into line.

Thanks Ken - If I get the trolley sorted/ replaced. clipping a pulley to the front and just one line up and back might be manageable (which I might not need most of the time anyway).

Fenlander · Today, 08:40

I see taking the outboard off and seeing if the SIB alone is an easy first step at no cost and will give you a steer as to if it helps at all.

Then if that's still not ideal fitting double wheels on the front of the trolley may work but if not some sort of decent front wheel arrangement would be needed for a rope/pulley arrangement anyway so money not wasted.

Peter_C · Today, 08:47

If it were me I would try to get away with only two transom wheels (I used a front cart, but had a heavy 4.2m Zodiac with a 40hp. It required 2-3 people to recover it). They need to be large to roll over the rocks as shown above.
https://wheeleez.com/wheeleez-boat-launching-wheels/

A capstan, like for an anchor, would easily pull 40m, but it would require a large battery to operate.

User name · Today, 10:36

Would it be an option to just clear up a path to the waterline to make it a lot easier to drag?

A few years ago I did something similar to this using plastic pallets. We got loads of them for free and just tied them together. It worked great.

jonp · Today, 13:01

How about 4 lengths of 90mm plastic drainage pipe with capped ends cut to a length of 1,5m ish each. Simply put it under the boat to make it easier to pull up the beach and keep rotating from from the back to the front as you move.
I have what's called a Cooper anchor which is ideal for ribs as they are plastic but have amazing holding power. I can drop the anchor ahead of the boat and use a triple ended block and tackle rated to 550kg which can allow me to get a small boat up a beach on my own if Im desperate. However my boat has an electric anchor winch with a 1.5 ton pull capacity. I can also double pulley the winch to increase the pulling power or reduce the pressure on the winch.
I also own a set of 300kg loading inflatable boat rollers I bought several years ago and never used. They are for emergencies for remote location if I get caught during a hurricane and need to get my boat from the water.

Steve509926 · Today, 16:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by User name

Would it be an option to just clear up a path to the waterline to make it a lot easier to drag?

A few years ago I did something similar to this using plastic pallets. We got loads of them for free and just tied them together. It worked great.

If you can get the plastic pallets cheap and fasten them down so they don't get swept away with the tide, I think it's a great idea.

Dadeo · Today, 17:08

I've got a similar problem. Our beach is steep and has a soft mixed surface of large gravel, small flat shale stones and deep leaves. In the summer I just leave it at the dock. In winter the dock has to come out of the water (the lake can freeze) and I have to pull it up on shore. I roll it on several PVC pipes and use a light winch tied to something stable on the beach. The winch is cheap and slow, but it works well enough so I don't have to strain the back.