pump to inflate foldable quicksilver?

[Clipper]

hi guys,

new to the forum, and new to inflatables,

recently purchased a 3.4m hypalon mercury quicksilver (foldable) with an 18hp on the back.

took it out for its maiden run and quickly noticed that the chambers seemed to be softer (approx 20min after) i first put it in the water.

the pump that i used was just some electric cheapy that i picked up at a supermarket.

Q- what is the best pump to used for a foldable boat that will be inflated and deflated numerous times during the year? i assume something with a gauge? is there a pump that is better than others? as the instructions point out NOT to used high pressure pumps. the recommended pressure is only 3.5psi....

[Apherel]

Hi and welcome to the forum. Lots of SIB advice if you search, especially about folding wheels. You are probably finding that the tubes were under inflated at the beginning, cooled down in the water and lost pressure.

The cheapie pump most likely won't be upto the job. Manually, a foot pump is best, I've got a Bravo 2 with a pressure gauge and it works fine on a bigger boat. They (or an equivalent) should be readily available in chandlers or kite surfing suppliers - just check they have the right value fittings.

Some have recommended the Bravo 12 electic pump, this has a pressure limiter, I'm planning on getting one when I'm tired of the foot pump.

I've had trouble finding a supplier in Aus - the only reference I can find is to:

http://www.samallen.com.au/

look in their section on accessories for inflatable boats. I've not used them, so don't know if they retail, but it should be a start to find a local supplier. They also have a pressure gauge if you want to be accurate about your operating pressures.

Enjoy

[codprawn]

Footpumps are hard work. The best bet is to use the cheap electric pump to get most of the air in - then use a double action stirrup/hand pump for the rest. They are available in most camping type shops in the UK - should be the same in OZ. They are double action so very quick. Don't pay much for one - they are pretty cheap if you shop around.

I never bother with a guage - my Quicksilver has pressure relief valves and they just blow off when there is enough air in there. You can judge it pretty well just by feel. Remember the harder the tubes the harder the ride so it's a compromise.

[Locozodiac]

Originally Posted by Clipper

hi guys,

Q- what is the best pump to used for a foldable boat that will be inflated and deflated numerous times during the year? i assume something with a gauge? is there a pump that is better than others? as the instructions point out NOT to used high pressure pumps. the recommended pressure is only 3.5psi....

Electric with adjustable pressure limiter or vertical double action Bravo Pump type will be just fine. If you go for a manual pump inflator that has a manometer attacheded, the infating reading won't be accurate because the reading needle will be kind of jumping while inflating, when stopping inflating you won't have any pressure reading at the manometer base, because the sib air valve will be shut. Took the included manometer off my Bavo 6 pump and made an valve adapter that has the manometer attached/screwed to it, works perfect to inflate/read to 3.5 or 0.25 Bar which is the recommended working pressure.

If you ride on bumpy waters, the boat will bump as well, in that case don't wot, reduce speed, would not recommend to deflate the boat to match water conditions, the sib must work with it's recommended boat pressure so all floors are tight and so the transom. A client has just ruinned the last aluminum section fllor which is next to the transom for underi inflating his 380 sib in only 3 months use.

If you have a 18 HP engine, surely must be a Tohatsu, nice purchase, congrats.

Happy Boating

[jyasaki]

Originally Posted by codprawn

Remember the harder the tubes the harder the ride so it's a compromise.

Sort of. In choppy water, a SIB is going to ride hard no matter what. Softening the tubes *may* soften the ride, but it will be due to the boat flexing more to absorb the energy which will greatly accellerate wear.

Best to use recommended inflation pressure and just slow down.

BTW, water temp will drop the tube pressure significantly, especially if you inflate the boat on land/trailer on a warm day and drop it into cold water. If there's a large temp differential between air and water, it's best to inflate to slightly below recommended pressure before splashing, then top up once the tubes equalize with the water temp.

jky

[codprawn]

If you watch the RNLI D class boats in action you will se why they are so good in the rough - they just bend as they go over the waves!!!

Dag Pike advocates adjusting tube pressures for conditions and he should know what he's on about!!!

Agreed though that on some types of boats it could increase the wear.

[matt h]

have bought one of these, pumps my 3mtr sib up in 3-4 mins, also de flates it as well, really very good and no need to finish off manually,

[Locozodiac]

Originally Posted by codprawn

If you watch the RNLI D class boats in action you will se why they are so good in the rough - they just bend as they go over the waves!!!

Dag Pike advocates adjusting tube pressures for conditions and he should know what he's on about!!!

Agreed though that on some types of boats it could increase the wear.

Yes, you are right, if incorrectly inflated some sibs will wear on the tube fabric located at the left/righ rubber ends side joinner have specially if the flloor fabric has less height than the rubber side joinners ends height, in the long run your transom will unglue/dislocate prematurely at the tubes extremes where they were factory welded.

[Locozodiac]

Originally Posted by matt h

have bought one of these, pumps my 3mtr sib up in 3-4 mins, also de flates it as well, really very good and no need to finish off manually,

This type of electric inflators will only inflate your sib to look as if it has reached full air pressure, still will need a final inflation device to have the inflation work completed to it's correct working pressure. Leaving in doubt use a pressure gauge and see for yourself. Is the same type of inflator used to inflate huge plastic toys, just air, not pressure. Use them sometimes specially when inflating new sibs out of their boxes and complete the job with a Bravo 6 Double Action Pump + hand manometer.

Happy Boating

[Clipper]

i used the electric pump which really gave the impression that the boat was fully inflated, additionally, i pumped it up in the sun (27 degrees) on land, then dropped it in to 18 degree water. i now realize that this would have contributed to the deflation, when i took it back out of the water the sib re-inflated itself to become reasonably hard again.

i have a foot pump that came with the sib that looks like the pic in codprawns post, it is one that will inflate and deflate the boat, the electric pump i used looks similar to matt h post, but just a flimsier version.

another question to add; should i suck all the air out of the sib when putting it away, or will this cause damage? should i leave a tiny bit of air in it?

i hope i havent damaged the boat by not having enough pressure in it? i came back straight to shore when i realized. unfortunately there was some small chop that day.

yes, locozodiac, you are right it is a tohatsu 18hp, not sure? but it doesnt seem to plain well, too much power do you think?
here is a pic

[Trickdog]

Clipper

You are worrying too much! You will not have damaged your SIB running it under-inflated for a short trip. Get a pressure guage if you like (your Quicksilver dealer should be able to supply one, or search on the Internet), but you will not be able to hold the boat at a constant pressure ...The sun comes out, it get's harder ...The sun goes in, it get's softer ...Bring it up the beach, it get's harder ...Put it back in the water, it get's softer. That's the nature of inflatables!

Inflate the boat so that the tubes are firm to the touch when in water (but not so firm that they feel like a drum skin!), and you will be fine. You may have to let a bit of air out on the beach to keep the pressure down and avoid stressing the seams. Just put a bit back in before going back on the water. The supplied foot pump is ideal for this.

Regarding storage; keep a bit of air in or take it all out. It will not make any difference to the boat. But it will be more compact for storage if you take it all out!

Have fun. That's a nice boat.

[Locozodiac]

[QUOTE=Clipper;240343] yes, locozodiac, you are right it is a tohatsu 18hp, not sure? but it doesnt seem to plain well, too much power do you think?
here is a pic.

Personally been having to much water splash inside a 360 sib because of the tramsom height with respect of the engine, will need to rise my transom a complete 1" to be inside the engine factory specification limits, that is 3 to 5 cm from the boat's bottom to the anticavitation plate. Yes I too own and sale Tohatsu's 18 HP 2 stroke engines. Have tried the same sib with a Toh 25 and doesn't give me this splashing problem, is a tail design issue that will be corrected once the transom is raised. If your Toh is brand new, don't forget double oil mix for the first 10 hours.

That "dosen't seems to plane well is a very vague answer", how many buddies were on the sib, how well was the sib balanced, was your trim angle ok, was the sib correctly inflated ? All of us have passed through novice so if you have time to be more precise to understand the problems you have been having. Send an email to my personal email : locozodiac@hotmail.com and will threat this theme out of the post so not bother ribnetters with repetitive issues.

Happy Boating

[Chris]

Originally Posted by Locozodiac

This type of electric inflators will only inflate your sib to look as if it has reached full air pressure, still will need a final inflation device to have the inflation work completed to it's correct working pressure. Leaving in doubt use a pressure gauge and see for yourself. Is the same type of inflator used to inflate huge plastic toys, just air, not pressure. Use them sometimes specially when inflating new sibs out of their boxes and complete the job with a Bravo 6 Double Action Pump + hand manometer.

Happy Boating

WRONG... the Rule pumps are designed to pump the inflatable up to the corret pressure.

[Locozodiac]

Originally Posted by Chris

WRONG... the Rule pumps are designed to pump the inflatable up to the corret pressure.

Sorry to say but you are partially correct...

"The high speed Rule pump inflator will give 2.6 to max 3.0 PSI, which is suitable in most instanses. If extra pressure is required top up with a manual pump to desire pressure" (Excerpted from Rule Pumps Operating Instructions)

The correct working pressure is 3.5 PSI once on water...

Happy Boating

[Chris]

Originally Posted by Locozodiac

Sorry to say but you are partially correct...

"The high speed Rule pump inflator will give 2.6 to max 3.0 PSI, which is suitable in most instanses. If extra pressure is required top up with a manual pump to desire pressure" (Excerpted from Rule Pumps Operating Instructions)

The correct working pressure is 3.5 PSI once on water...

Happy Boating

I can't speak for the Zodiac but for my SIB and the RIB the Rule does the job without any assistance.

[matt h]

same here!! chris is right, ive never needed to assist the electric pump with a manual,!!

Happy pumping!!

[Clipper]

thank you for the info guys,

i did a search initially in regards to sibs and was swamped with information, thats why impatience got the better of me and i started this thread.

i am sure for all the experienced guys out there my question would be kind of silly.

but, i was always told 'if you dont ask, you wont find out'

i appreciate all the input i have received thus far, and hope to get some more.

"That "dosen't seems to plane well is a very vague answer", how many buddies were on the sib, how well was the sib balanced, was your trim angle ok, was the sib correctly inflated ? "

2 people, 85kg+55kg
i believe the sib was balanced, fuel and 55kg on one side, myself on the other.
not sure about the trim, it was fully down, thats all i know.
the sib was not correctly inflated.


another question, i have searched it, but cant get a clear answer.
-can a sib handle rough seas? ribs definitely can, australian lifeguards use sibs in the surf, would a 'normal' sib be able to 'wave jump'?

[Locozodiac]

[QUOTE=Clipper;
another question, i have searched it, but cant get a clear answer.
-can a sib handle rough seas? ribs definitely can, australian lifeguards use sibs in the surf, would a 'normal' sib be able to 'wave jump'?

A sib can handle rough seas but will definitely jump a lot if at wot, better is to cruise at lesser speeds and take it easy, be patient if you have to travel far...

Any sib/rib can wave jump, will depend on your engine HP, skill and practice, though a bit dangerous if done not properly...not recommended for novices untill you have gained complete control of your boating skills and know your boat behaviour well !

Happy Jumping...

[Andy JC]

Originally Posted by Trickdog

You are worrying too much! You will not have damaged your SIB running it under-inflated for a short trip. Get a pressure guage if you like (your Quicksilver dealer should be able to supply one, or search on the Internet), but you will not be able to hold the boat at a constant pressure ...The sun comes out, it get's harder ...The sun goes in, it get's softer ...Bring it up the beach, it get's harder ...Put it back in the water, it get's softer. That's the nature of inflatables!

Inflate the boat so that the tubes are firm to the touch when in water (but not so firm that they feel like a drum skin!), and you will be fine. You may have to let a bit of air out on the beach to keep the pressure down and avoid stressing the seams. Just put a bit back in before going back on the water. The supplied foot pump is ideal for this.

Regarding storage; keep a bit of air in or take it all out. It will not make any difference to the boat. But it will be more compact for storage if you take it all out!

^What he said ^

[Andy JC]

If you don't have a decent supplier in Oz then you could use these guys: Force 4

I've just checked and they'll send items world-wide, postage would be "charged at cost"

Bought the Bravo HP pump featured in the link yesterday, thats the cheapest I could find it in the UK - inflates air floors up to 12psi. Luckily they have a branch 2 mins drive from where I work in Bristol