Repair time! - Page 3

Scarlet-Jester · 15 July 2011, 11:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dino89

the guy does have a point about the description my boat was sold as having 2 repairs only i did ask him if there was anything else i should know about ,he replied no.
when i got home i blew it up and the floor was leaking the boat had a total of 5 patches
so i contacted him and he said could it of happenend on the way home!!
my final email told him quite cleary that it wasnt as described and that i would return it for a full refund or he could pay a partial refund of £300 to reflect the boats very poor condition this was non negotiable and if i dint receive either with in 14 days i would see him in the small claims court.. he paid the 300 by credit transfer
so iwould get the original add and any claims made then confront him !if its possible do everthing in writing you need to let him no asap as well !
this is boat i am going to attempt to repair in my post

another thing the uk your house insurance usually has a legal cover built in for taking these claims to court i have used it succesfully in the past when buying electric scooter which wasnt as described !so it doesnt cost me a penny!

What time frames were around this Dino? I am curious as mine was not as described either. When I asked if it held its air and had any leaks he said no it was airtight. Just not sure how long I have to make any claims as I have had the boat for a while now.

Nasher · 15 July 2011, 11:15

How about filling the air deck with expanding builders foam.

To stop the bubble forming it could be clamped between two sheets of ply spaced the right thickness apart whilst it cures.

Nasher.

Patrik · 15 July 2011, 11:18

Thanks for the input C-NUMB! Feel a little bit better now. The air floor is £909 so that doesn't really feel like an option... Unless I could get one from someone who has destroyed their tubes. Well of course it's an option, but I'm not sure if it's a better option than just getting a brand new boat from finland, they're like £2300 over there.

I'll have a test go with my short rig engine then, and we'll see if I even like this type of boat before I go nuts with the economics.

Patrik · 15 July 2011, 11:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nasher

How about filling the air deck with expanding builders foam.

To stop the bubble forming it could be clamped between two sheets of ply spaced the right thickness apart whilst it cures.

Nasher.

Fun idea, we'll hear who breaks it down this time

As I'm just bursting out crazy ideas right now I also considered cutting the floor of before the bubble, then replace the end with some foam material.. However I suppose that wouldn't be at all rigid enough if it was even possible.

Patrik · 15 July 2011, 11:58

I havent inspected the tubes yet but they seem fine. What pressure should they have? I also realized 11 psi is just 0,75 bar? Is that even high pressure? I just pumped the floor up until I felt some resistance as I would with any other car tire/balloon/toy.
Perhaps it was me who broke it anyway? I think I saw the calzone before it was full though.

Dino89 · 15 July 2011, 12:01

the floors useless as it is so anythings worth a try i use that expanding foam and it may just work but may be hard to control as it has a mind of its own LOl
could even try clear silocon same principle fill the end with the bubble mould it , clamp it in between ply to flatten ,then let it set may be a bit more controllable than foam and it will stick like shit to a blanket espicially if it mixs to the broken fibres
nothing to lose! just have a think and go for what you think is best

Dino89 · 15 July 2011, 12:13

the 11psi is hard work to acheive even with the zodiac 2 stage pump so a normal inflatable pum would probalby blow itself up before you got any where near it
the boat i think is 3.4 psi from memorybut its written on the fabric by the valve as is floor pressure

Dino89 · 15 July 2011, 12:22

scarlet jester
i notified him within 3 days ,think the law says you need to notify the seller asap when you discover the problem , so as soon as i realised there was an air leak in floor i contacted him , i purchased it on the saturday and didnt get to blow it up until the monday when the kids were at school as we had a bbq on the sunday
if you want any more info i can pm you to make it easier , the courts do seem to favor the buyer so longs as you have all the proof ,i contacted boats and outboards as well to give me the description and ad incase he removed it ,
check your house insurance cause they give you all the info for free if has the built in legal cover and even take it to court for you i have been there and he settled out of court on the day

the reason i actually tried it was because just before we left he said are you going to try it out when you get home , i said no probably next time i get this out will be in devon in summer hols
but while driving home i had alarm bells ringing and a gut feeling somerthing was yet to be revealed the rest is history
,

Max... · 15 July 2011, 12:32

The foam idea is interesting but to distribute it evenly you would need to make dozens of holes in the floor for injecting! Honestly Patrik I think you're flogging a dead horse with this boat/floor but everyone loves a trier!

The Zodiac floors are damn clever - I took mine out the other day, inflated it to exactly 11.5 psi on the garage floor and it turns into a super light surfboard - rigid as a rock and putting all my weight on the toes of one foot the deflection is no more than a few mm's.

But when the cross stitching goes they are fooked.

Surely someone on eBay will ship one to you? There is an endless supply on there and shipping should easily be possible for under £100.

C-NUMB · 15 July 2011, 12:49

Patrik, how about XPS foam(styrofoam). Would be reasonable easy to make it the correct shape, copy the air floor shape, it does not suck water either and is fairly light. About as thik as the air floor.

When You got the shape right, then cover it with litle matt and epoxy resin, there You hav a semi rib.... Dont know how to get it inside the boat though.....

Kind of a DIY project, no idea would it work. But a couple board of xps/dowe styrofoam does not cost that much.

renegade · 15 July 2011, 13:28

I could imagine my idea of stitching may work and a spot of glue over each stitch would make airtight again I would give it a try nothing to lose.

the above idea of getting a inflated keel and makeing a wood floor sounds good also sure theres loads of old -dead-damaged boats out there and the keels come out real easy even on some the inflatable keel is removable and along woth a cut right deck would be great .

renegade · 15 July 2011, 13:38

I have done the builders foam thing in the past lol on a little narwhal that was leaking all round the seam under the rubbing streak thingy lol

it real has a mind of its own and where some parts where hard and looked inflated other sections was floppy . so I had to make holes and fill the gaps . in the end the entire boat was totaly solid and gave some kids on a rive hours of fun . I even left it behind for anyone to use to cross or use lol ..oh it was on the trent by the way newark-farnham

Dino89 · 15 July 2011, 13:50

if you wanted to trailer it, think it could deinfinitely with a bit of patience be possible construct a ply wood deep v and then fix a flat floor across the v shape very similar to air deck profile but in 3/4 marine ply and it would be held in under the tubes and use the original straps for a bit more holding, defo a project i wouldnt mind haveing a go at if all else failed

renegade · 15 July 2011, 14:02

lots of cheap old ribs out there like I said maybe buy steal the keel and decks and save the old as a backup or something ?
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BOMBARD-AEROTE...item2a12283058

avon s4.6m inflatable/rib/fishing boat/dive boat | eBay

inflatable boat very clean | eBay

HUMBER RIB 5.5 COMMERCIAL FOLDS AWAY | eBay

Patrik · 15 July 2011, 14:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max...

Surely someone on eBay will ship one to you? There is an endless supply on there and shipping should easily be possible for under £100.

Well they all say in the ads "Pick up only in Sussex" or something for the aerotecs

Just like that one on ebay which I gladly would have bought if it could have been sent to sweden.

How usual is this problem? Is this where this type of boat ends up? And is it the fibers that goes or just the hold between the fiber fabric and the outer fabric?

Patrik · 15 July 2011, 14:45

Lol, so would you say that it did work or that it was crap? Could it be an option worth trying?

Quote:

Originally Posted by renegade

I have done the builders foam thing in the past lol on a little narwhal that was leaking all round the seam under the rubbing streak thingy lol

it real has a mind of its own and where some parts where hard and looked inflated other sections was floppy . so I had to make holes and fill the gaps . in the end the entire boat was totaly solid and gave some kids on a rive hours of fun . I even left it behind for anyone to use to cross or use lol ..oh it was on the trent by the way newark-farnham

So far I havent understood why it's not possible to cut it up and glue the inners back together. I don't really understand how it's built. I mean I know all those small fibers, millions of them or something, wont be possible to fix, but arent they attached to one material, and then that material is attached to the outer material? And it's that last attachment that now has failed?

renegade · 15 July 2011, 19:55

qoute...

The inside of an air deck is so called a "double-wall" or "drop-stitch" fabric. Two airtight layers of reinforced PVC coated fabric are fixed about 2 inches a part by an innumerable quantity of threads. After the perimeter is closed airtight it becomes a very hard and strong when inflated.

in actual fact they are millions of stitches that hold each side 2" apart I would realy try the stitch option inflate mark out the area or the bubble and try some randome stitchs around the middle of the damaged bit then inflate but not to high pressure see if they hold it down if so go crazy on the area with stitches makeing sure it can inflate to about the 2" thickness.

not sure if this could be done on say a sawing machine in a criss -cross manner maybe if done with some realy thin but strong fishing line

heres one of the best images I could find of the inner side of a air deck construction
http://www.p-wholesale.com/upimg/11/...oblong-368.jpg
http://www.grandboats.com/pic/why/material1.jpg

Patrik · 15 July 2011, 23:33

It sure isn't a bad idea! Thanks for the good description too.

Hasn't anyone attempted to do this? I can also imagine that it would work as long as there's enough stitches and the sewing doesn't rip the fabric. Suppose some kind of strengthening before stitching would be in place.

I still don't really understand where it has delaminated? Would it be between the woven material in the bottom and the blue material on your second link? Why is it not possible to cut through just the weave and glue it back onto the blue material? (in the image I mean, I don't think it's blue). Perhaps just because the weave is a weave?

The seller now says the bubble's been there for years and years without changing shape or size. I think I will take it for a spin and see how it behaves before doing something drastic.

What's a recommended size engine anyways? Want to steer with the stick, not fit a steering wheel. I'm sure there's lots of threads about that, I shall search so that I don't go off topic.

renegade · 16 July 2011, 11:08

you will have to up date us on what you do and how step by step pics lol

Dino89 · 16 July 2011, 11:56

max hp is 30hp on a 420, i had the yam 30 3 cylinder on mine but was to much of a handful on the tiller even dampened down!,
i have a 15 on one of my 380`s and thats a nice weight to carry and manages easy on the tiller and gets up and the plane and is pretty quick over 20mph with 2 adults, i aslo have a 25 but havent tried that on the tiller yet ,you wouldnt want to carry that to far either!