Zodiac MK2 GR

AndrewMK2GR · 27 January 2015, 17:17

I just picked up a Zodiac MK2 Grand Raid last night that I purchased through ebay. The hypalon skin material seems to be in decent shape, and the boat was inflated and holding air when I inspected it before deflating it to fit it into my car. I plan to use this boat for lobster diving and spearfishing with some friends along the California coast.

The boat is missing the floorboards, but it was cheap so I decided to take a chance on being able to make or find some replacement floorboards for it. Does anyone on here have a set they would be interested in selling me or know of somewhere I should start my search? Maybe a boat salvage yard that has a large collection of Zodiacs (not sure if that's even a thing)?

The transom plate says "Model 2355" and the serial number is XDC 42*** M80C. I believe this means the boat is a MK2 Grand Raid manufactured in 1980; can anyone confirm this?

I only have this one picture of it right now that I snapped before work this morning. I plan to inflate it and get it cleaned up a bit tonight to get a better idea of what I'm working with. Once it's cleaned up I will try to post some better pictures.

EDIT: the picture won't upload here, not sure why.

Peter_C · 27 January 2015, 18:17

Welcome to RIB.net

Sorry can't help on the floor boards, other than keep an eye on craigslist and ebay. I would recommend setting up an auto search for both.

office888 · 27 January 2015, 18:52

There is one thread active already in regards to a similar question on an F470.
http://www.rib.net/forum/f50/f470nav...tml#post664931

I believe your interpretation of the HIN is correct, your boat is 35 years old.

Have you inspected the transom condition?
Do the IC valves work?

To my knowledge, there are no boat junkyards that handle inflatables, although I do know of one in the midwest that has a lot of parts from junked 260/285/310 size inflatables.

AndrewMK2GR · 27 January 2015, 19:06

I have only given the boat a quick 5 minute look-over when I picked it up last night (it was dark, so hard to do much inspecting). I did not see any rot or soft spots on the transom and I picked at the glue seams where it meets the fabric; they all seemed solid.

I haven't messed with the valves much yet, and the people that I got it from didn't seem to understand how they worked. They just put the caps on after inflating it to keep the air in the tubes. I did twist one them and it seemed to turn ok, but I didn't have time to test them for functionality before work this morning. Is there a good thread showing how they are supposed to work?

Peter_C · 27 January 2015, 19:21

I am not wholly familiar with the valves on your boat, but most all valves will leak a little air until the caps are put on them. The only part that should turn the cap. The inner valve is replaceable and does screw out. They make a special tool, but if you are very careful a pair of needle nose pliers works.

office888 · 27 January 2015, 19:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndrewMK2GR

I have only given the boat a quick 5 minute look-over when I picked it up last night (it was dark, so hard to do much inspecting). I did not see any rot or soft spots on the transom and I picked at the glue seams where it meets the fabric; they all seemed solid.

I haven't messed with the valves much yet, and the people that I got it from didn't seem to understand how they worked. They just put the caps on after inflating it to keep the air in the tubes. I did twist one them and it seemed to turn ok, but I didn't have time to test them for functionality before work this morning. Is there a good thread showing how they are supposed to work?

IC valves work like two Styrofoam cups put together. There are two holes towards the bottom of the bottom cup. The inner cup also has two holes. When you twist the flywheel, you twist the inner cup.

You can line up both holes, only hole A, only hole B, or no holes (NAV position). : Westport Marina on Lake Champlain ZODIAC Inflatable IC Valve Parts

The valves should be serviced annually. The flywheels should turn smoothly. However, if a valve is stuck, do not try to unseat it without the IC valve extractor or you may damage the valve assembly (it is a VERY expensive part, around $600 or so). If you are able to remove the valve inner cup without the tool, simply wipe the brass off with a rag of toluene or acetone, apply triple-guard grease to the cup's rotating surface, then reassemble. Be sure to reset the valve's retaining nut to the same height (Easiest way is to count the rotations).

Be sure to clean your valves annually, or sea water may cause corrosion.

Fun fact : The Grand Raid was made famous by Jacque Cousteau.

AndrewMK2GR · 27 January 2015, 19:48

That is a really helpful diagram. Is the special tool only needed if the inner conical part of the valve is stuck and does not turn?

It looks to me like the triple-guard grease would be applied only to the conical metal mating surfaces. Should I also apply some rubber safe grease to the diaphragm and rubber seal inside the cap? I will have to stop by a boat shop on my way home to pick up a tube of that triple-guard grease.

That's a fun piece of trivia about Jacques Cousteau. I have a picture of his diving saucer set as the background for my computer's login screen.

Peter_C · 27 January 2015, 19:52

I think I now know what valves you have?
http://www.rib.net/forum/f50/zodiac-...mk3-35097.html
http://www.rib.net/forum/f50/zodiac-...ect-58710.html

I think most every diver today and in the past from the Jacques Cousteau era has good memories of him in one form or another

Our family rarely missed an episode, along with Wild Kingdom.

AndrewMK2GR · 27 January 2015, 19:56

Those are definitely them. The FC470 thread has some great info on valve maintenance that's going to be really helpful for me!

office888 · 27 January 2015, 20:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndrewMK2GR

That is a really helpful diagram. Is the special tool only needed if the inner conical part of the valve is stuck and does not turn?

It looks to me like the triple-guard grease would be applied only to the conical metal mating surfaces. Should I also apply some rubber safe grease to the diaphragm and rubber seal inside the cap? I will have to stop by a boat shop on my way home to pick up a tube of that triple-guard grease.

That's a fun piece of trivia about Jacques Cousteau. I have a picture of his diving saucer set as the background for my computer's login screen.

Grease should only be applied to the metal mating surfaces.

The rubber components should be washed with a light detergent (Dawn, Simple Green, 409) and reinstalled with nothing added. Silicone type greases may prematurely age the rubber and cause excess softening.

The puller is required if the flywheel does not move or if the flywheel is quite stiff. The old grease tends to vacuum the inner cup in place.

If you cannot remove the cup, DO NOT TRY TO PRY IT OUT. You WILL damage the cup. It is very soft metal. Find a Zodiac service center near you with the tool and pay them to yank it for you. Once it is pulled, simply maintain a regular service interval and you will never require the tool again. (The tool is about $180 or so, so it is not worthwhile for someone to purchase).

If you do not reset the nut to the same height, you will not damage the valve, but you will disable a hidden feature. The IC valves also act as an overpressure valve for that chamber. That's why there's a spring underneath the nut. If the pressure in the tube is enough, it pushes the inner cup up, and air seeps out around the base of the flywheel. If you pull out on the flywheel, it reproduces the same effect.

AndrewMK2GR · 27 January 2015, 20:17

Thanks for all the pointers, I will follow them carefully. The one valve I looked at this morning before work seemed to turn ok; hopefully I will be as lucky with the others. I might be in trouble if I end up needing that special tool as I don't think there are any Zodiac dealers in Idaho and I was hoping to get this thing all serviced and ready for action before I transport it to my dad's place in California.

office888 · 27 January 2015, 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndrewMK2GR

Thanks for all the pointers, I will follow them carefully. The one valve I looked at this morning before work seemed to turn ok; hopefully I will be as lucky with the others. I might be in trouble if I end up needing that special tool as I don't think there are any Zodiac dealers in Idaho and I was hoping to get this thing all serviced and ready for action before I transport it to my dad's place in California.

There's plenty of dealers in California. Do what you can until then, such as any gluing that is required, or fabrication.

My advice is to use a shopvac or vacuum on the blow setting for the initial blow up. If the boat has transitioned from a cold area to a warm area, before inflating, allow 12 hours for the material to acclimate before inflating.

The thrustboard in the bow does not look original. Please take many pictures along the transom, focusing on where the material overlaps, as well as of the thrustboard by the bow, and where the floor glues in place (on the inside and outside).

We'll help you as best as we can!

AndrewMK2GR · 27 January 2015, 20:50

I will take pictures of those areas tonight after I have serviced the valves and inflated the boat. The boat did not come with a hand pump, is there a specific model that you would recommend?

office888 · 27 January 2015, 21:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndrewMK2GR

I will take pictures of those areas tonight after I have serviced the valves and inflated the boat. The boat did not come with a hand pump, is there a specific model that you would recommend?

The Bravo 7 is the go-to pump for Zodiac brand inflatables that do not utilize a high pressure floor. It is a bellows-type foot pump.

For standard type boats, I use a shopvac for the bulk fill (high volume, very low pressure), then I top the boat off with a foot pump until firm (recommended is 3.4 psi).

AndrewMK2GR · 28 January 2015, 04:23

I cleaned and re-greased the valves this evening; they now turn smoothly and seem to be working properly. After working on the valves I inflated the boat and gave it a once over. It held air fine and I could find no immediately apparent leaks. I found no seams that felt loose or that had edges peeling (other than those listed below).

I inspected the glue joints on the thrust board and found them to be in poor shape. I could probably peel the flaps off of it by hand. I think I will need to remove the thrust board, refinish it, clean the flaps, and then glue it all back together. Are there any tips or tricks for this job that I should be aware of? What glue is recommended for this repair? Is any marine varnish acceptable for refinishing the thrust board?

I also inspected the glue joints at the transom. I think that they are in overall good shape, with 2 exceptions. The pieces of material with velcro on them on either side are loose and will need to be reglued. The inside seam on the starboard side has some loose edges, but they are not nearly as loose as the flaps on the thrust board are. Can I just reglue these edges down? The transom could also use a new coat of varnish, is any marine varnish acceptable?

AndrewMK2GR · 28 January 2015, 04:24

(more pictures)

office888 · 28 January 2015, 15:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndrewMK2GR

I cleaned and re-greased the valves this evening; they now turn smoothly and seem to be working properly. After working on the valves I inflated the boat and gave it a once over. It held air fine and I could find no immediately apparent leaks. I found no seams that felt loose or that had edges peeling (other than those listed below).

I inspected the glue joints on the thrust board and found them to be in poor shape. I could probably peel the flaps off of it by hand. I think I will need to remove the thrust board, refinish it, clean the flaps, and then glue it all back together. Are there any tips or tricks for this job that I should be aware of? What glue is recommended for this repair? Is any marine varnish acceptable for refinishing the thrust board?

I also inspected the glue joints at the transom. I think that they are in overall good shape, with 2 exceptions. The pieces of material with velcro on them on either side are loose and will need to be reglued. The inside seam on the starboard side has some loose edges, but they are not nearly as loose as the flaps on the thrust board are. Can I just reglue these edges down? The transom could also use a new coat of varnish, is any marine varnish acceptable?

I would not recommend ungluing the thrustboard. It is a very labor intensive procedure to glue it back in properly. Not to mention that due to the age of the boat, when you go to unglue things, rather than ungluing, the hypalon may separate between the layers leaving cord structure and neoprene backer behind.

Any marine grade polyurethane type varnish is acceptable. I tend to gravitate towards Interlux products. Service manuals typically recommend 3 coats.

I would recommend washing the vessel. It would also give you time to check for leaks. Dawn Dishsoap or Simple Green are okay.

For reglue, Weaver Industries is in Rathdrum, ID. They sell adhesive. :
Weaver Industries, Inc.: HYPALON GLUE KIT

It is recanned Bostik 2402 if I remember properly.

It would be wise to water test the boat.

Add the drain plug and fill it up with water like a bathtub. It helps to block up the bow, most of the water leaks occur at the transom. About 4 inches of water is enough. The water weight will cause water to squirt out wherever a leak is. If there are no leaks, then simply empty the water. If there are leaks, they can be sealed by regluing loose material or in the case of small leaks, with 3M 4200, Sikaflex, or similar PU type caulks.

Keep in mind that water and glue/caulk are not compatible. Allow the boat to dry before starting repairs.

AndrewMK2GR · 28 January 2015, 16:29

I will order some of that glue.

Would you recommend I just leave the flaps that are glued to the thrust board alone? Should I try to re-glue the edges that are coming up? The glue joints on the thrust board feel much weaker than all of the other joints on the boat that I inspected.

I forgot to note last night that the part of the keel forward of the thrust board is unlgued from the floor. From the thrust board back to the transom it is still glued down. I am assuming it should be fine to just glue it back down where it has come up?

I plan to wash the boat and try that water test as soon as it is warm enough outside for me to do so. By the time I am home from work and have time to work on the boat it is usually below freezing, so I can't just drag it out onto the lawn and hose it off. Hopefully I will be able to do that this weekend.

Will a 15hp outboard move this boat acceptably? I will be beach launching so I want an outboard that is easy for me to carry from my car out onto the beach, but still able to move the boat with 4 guys in it. There are a couple of 80's vintage Evinrude/Johnson 2 stroke outboards for sale in my area that are reasonably cheap and look pretty compact and lightweight.

AndrewMK2GR · 28 January 2015, 17:36

I like the look of the custom plywood floor shown in this post:
http://www.rib.net/forum/f50/zodiac-...tml#post394556

i'm not sure from those pictures if the joint between the main floor section and the bow section is supposed to be right at the point where the boat begins to taper or if it is on top of the thrust board. Does anyone know where it should be? Based on some pictures (attached to this post) from a Zodiac manual found on this forum it looks like only the main rectangular portion of the floor needs to be rigid. I am also not sure of the exact dimensions needed for the floor; I thought I read somewhere that the floor should be slightly larger than the measured dimension in the boat to provide a very tight fit. Does this sound right? Does anyone have a Zodiac mk2 floor they could provide me with some overall dimensions from?

cgoing · 28 January 2015, 18:37

The keels in those boats are not glued down the entire length. They are only usually glued in two or three spots about four inches long. The front two feet is usually not attached at all.