Aluminium hulls vs Fibre glass

Manos · 06 August 2004, 17:56

After APs disaster I was wondering whether this accident could have been avoided if the RIB was made out of aluminium instead of fibre glass?

So the question is are aluminium RIBs better for long passages rather than the fibre glass ones?

Any views on the matter from the experienced people here?

codprawn · 06 August 2004, 18:04

It does suprise me why there aren't more alloy hulls.

Talking of which has anyone seen the allyduck? Ugly as hell but with a certain charm - tough as old boots and built to look like a rib - the alloy tubes are filled with pop bottles - great idea.

The boat also has a built in trailer!

Went on one at the Southampton show last year - it was great fun and handled just like a RIB

codprawn · 06 August 2004, 18:05

http://www.allyduck.co.uk/index.html

whoops meant to post this

Simon B · 06 August 2004, 19:26

Codders,

Simon B · 06 August 2004, 19:28

Codders,

Meant to post this too, I'm truly impressed by its utter lack of any aesthetic refinement at all. I bet its built by an "engineer"! Good concept etc but by jingo as far as totty magnets it's about as successful as that baked spud I put in my swimming trunks once.

Jono · 06 August 2004, 19:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simon B

Codders,

.....about as successful as that baked spud I put in my swimming trunks once.

Try putting it down the FRONT next time.....

By the way... and in a "non argumentative" way... isn't Bear's new boat alloy...?

Manos · 06 August 2004, 19:53

Bears boat was alloy. And from what I remember at LBS it looked very durable and fit for the ice job.

I am looking at the ANYTEC 1230

but will always keep the FALCON 700RSR.

Different boats for different purposes.

IMHO I think aly RIBs are safer in many respcts than fibre glass ones.

ashbypower · 06 August 2004, 20:45

SB,
"but by jingo as far as totty magnets it's about as successful as that baked spud "
But it's Ali therefore NOT magnetic

Brian

Jari Hjerppe · 06 August 2004, 21:51

Aluminum is tough and long lasting hull material. It must be the cost of the manufacturing that makes al hulls so rare in ribs.

In Finland Al hard boats are very popular, for example Buster and Silver.

www.busterboat.com

www.silverboats.fi

By the way, Boomeranger has just started to built Al hull ribs.

Jari

Manos · 07 August 2004, 11:48

Agree Jari, but when you pay for an 8mtr RIB with a 250 outboard on it the price of 80K (see SCORPION) when the aly equiv of excellent construction and fabrication does not cost near that amount, I think that aly hulls are not that expensive. Also the fact that you are not in danger of sinking if you hit anything at sea is an added bonus.

May aly hulls need more maintenance than fibre glass and this may be expensive in the long run. So far I am investigating the prons and cons before I bite the built but aly hulls seem to come top.

Searider · 07 August 2004, 12:56

Aluminium hulls much more expensive to produce - only really worth it for a one off custom job.

GRP much cheaper if in series production.

codprawn · 07 August 2004, 14:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Searider

Aluminium hulls much more expensive to produce - only really worth it for a one off custom job.

GRP much cheaper if in series production.

Yes and give a much smoother more hydrodynamic profile - alloy doesn't like complex curves!

Manos · 07 August 2004, 17:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by searider

GRP much cheaper if in series production

hmmmmmmmmmm I need to be convinced on that one and I'm not talking about RIB Eyes, Falcons, RIB-Xs, XS RIBs, Valiants, Humbers and the like, but the more upmarket boats i.e SCORPIONS, SPORT RIBs, OSPREYs etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

Yes and give a much smoother more hydrodynamic profile - alloy doesn't like complex curves!

That I don't know since never been on an aly boat (will be in November though

). I would think that aly made boats will be slower in some cases than fibre glass ones due to weight and engine type (diesel vs petrol). Which I don't think that it matters that much since it makes no difference if your top speed is 45 or 35 knots, if you only cruise between 20-25 knots.
However, looking at prices and comparing the so called 'good' fibre glass production RIBs with aly RIBs it seems that aly RIBs do not cost (relatively in some cases) as much as the 'good' fibre glass boats

Idea,

I will see if I can dig some prices out so that we can compare both types of boats.

Searider · 08 August 2004, 01:46

Manos,

We all know that the premium brands cost. - I want a Scorpion and will have one when I have saved the pennies.

However, once you have produced the plug and mould for a GRP hull it will be way way cheaper to churn out GRP hulls than aluminium ones. Have you ever tried welding?

This cheaper production cost can either be seen as cheaper prices for the customer or more profit for the builders.

Anyway, if alumnium hulls were cheaper to produce than GRP then we'd all have aluminium hulls.

QED

Duncan

PS

Have just got back from Cowes where a very good Abba tribute band was playing. This message may contain traces of irony and scarcasm. Please disregard if easily offended.

Manos · 08 August 2004, 06:49

I like the SCORPION too. But I am considering an aly hull also. Prices between the two types are very close if the SCORPION is new. Secnd hand is a lot cheaper.
I have welded a few bits in my life time. And yes is hard.
I think cheaper means less profit for the producers (instead of 200% to 50%) and better prices for the customer

Alan · 09 August 2004, 10:37

If you do a search for "crazyhorse" or "eurocommuter" then you will find lots of stuff about Ali RIBS. Mr Horse who has not been seen anywhere of late alledgedly ordered a sooper dooper Ali RIB from a Canadian builder. However nagging doubts are beggining to surface that it was a "virtual RIB"

Ali seems popular in Canada and NZ and I think its a damn good idea for RIB construction although I would prefer soft tubes rather than hard ones. However there is a well known homebuilt (and that term does not do it justice as its a very smart boat) rib called "Awesome" owned by Andy Micklewright, which has done some serious cruising and is a very capable boat.

TIM · 09 August 2004, 11:13

Is Awesome, not an 11m redbay ????

Louise · 09 August 2004, 11:16

Hi Tim,

Hope you got the goggles OK?

Awesome Explorer is indeed a Redbay but Andy also hand-built an aluminium RIB which he still has - can't remember the name of it though! Richard reckons it's a great boat!

HTH

P.S. Replying in case Alan's gone away from his computer for a while!

Edit: Ooops! Sorry Alan! Didn't see you there!

Alan · 09 August 2004, 11:16

Nahh, "Awesome Explorer" is Andy's 11m Redbay whilst plain old "Awesome" is his Ali RIB. Yes I know, Two monster RIBS. Lucky bugger!

Tim, from what Gavin tells us and from seeing your experiences during RIBEX and Ali hull would be the thing for you as its easy(ier) to knock the dents out!!!

Manos · 09 August 2004, 11:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan

If you do a search for "crazyhorse" or "eurocommuter" then you will find lots of stuff about Ali RIBS. Mr Horse who has not been seen anywhere of late alledgedly ordered a sooper dooper Ali RIB from a Canadian builder. However nagging doubts are beggining to surface that it was a "virtual RIB"

I think you may be correct Alan as far as the 'virtual RIB' idea is concerned.
I have looked and have participated on those threads you mention but I think that the Horse was trying hard to push his idea of the aly RIB and therefore his opinion (IMHO) was biased in many respects.
I also like aly RIBs with soft tubes rather than hard. The ones that they make in Sweden and have had photos and lots of literature about (their marketing manager STIG is a very nice and friendly chap) are made out of PVC and are filled with polyurethane. However, I am investigating the idea of hypalon/PVC.
Will have to see.