Buying Scorpion, Sport Rib or Boomeranger???

[Fjordrafting]

Hi! We are going to start with ribcharteing. the boat will be approxemately 8.5m. with 2x250hp or more. there will be 14 seats. We have looked at and mailed Sport Ribs, Scorpion and the finich Boomeranger. Check out www.f1re.com. They say they have a Boomeranger which is 7 m. and makes 70 knots with one 225hp engine?
I need help to pick the right boat, anyone here who could pleace help a guy from Norway? Yours Sincerely Martin

[thewavehumper]

I own a Scorpion and I really am inpressed by Sportrib, but I don't think either of these boats are made for People carrying (in Bulk). I have been most impressed by a Gemini 8,5 metre which has been rigged for 14 people it's being run by a company called blue Ocean and was supplied by www.theribshop.com

Check out the Gemini Website as they may have a picture of it.


Avon Delta and Ribcraft are also worth a look,

[Petrov]

Hej Martin;

Slå mig en signal så kan jag hjälpa dig med råd och info.
Har erfarenhet av både rafting från både Norge och Sverige.

MVH

Janis Petrov

janis.petrov@grandrib.se
Tel: +46705454258

[Brian]

It might be a good idea to say the intended use for your boat.
Are the 14 people (plus crew??) all to be seated?
Why twin outboards?
It SOUNDS like you might want a commercial spec. boat?????
In which case you should also start looking at some other manufacturers as well. Ocean Dynamics/Delta/Rayglass etc. as well as considering alternative power sources and drives (diesel, waterjets for example).

[Fjordrafting]

Hi, and thank you very much to all of you guys for all the different thougts! I can tell that you think that the Scorpion is not a real comercial rib. I have looked at those hevier ribs, but they are heavy and get only 52 knots with twin 250 and 8.2 meters (Osprey).
Take a look at www.actionboat.dk , they hav a Scorpion 8.5 with twin 250, 12 jockey seats pluss crew! They have the world record Oslo - Cobenhagen, and top speed 63 knots.
Concerning my option for twin engines; i think it is more responsible to have two engines for safety when i go out with a boat full of passengers, pluss i have fjord to pass before i can get us out in the open, and there it is nice to go fast.
Have anyone any knowledge about Boomeranger (www.f1re.com)?
Yours Sincerely
Martin

[Keith Hart]

Hi Fjordrafting

Scorpion are superb RIBs but I don't think they produce what you could call a commercial RIB.

Check out this site and take a look at their RIB:

http://www.northcoast-marine-adventures.co.uk/

Mike Garside and Brian Elliott will tell you just what a superb commercial rib it is.

Keith Hart

[Charles]

This is a 14 seater Rapier - you can find them here.

[Petrov]

Twin 250 on a 8,2m Osprey makes 58-60 knots depending on brand of engines and offcourse equipment, not 52 knots.
And a 8,2m Osprey Falcon has a beam that is 2,9m wich makes a lot of space and stability.
After experience of rafting i can say that people can`t notice the difference between 50 and 60 knots, all people that comes into a rib for the first time finds it cool allready in 35 knots when you start to jump in the waves.

Regards

Petrov

[thewavehumper]

What do you presently charter, what experience do you have ?
Are these speeds that you are quoting with 12 people up. I somehow doubt it

Id have to agree with Petrov's last comments about vigins and speed

[Petrov]

No, it`s not with 12 people up, it`s topspeed with around 400 lit fuel and 2 persons.
Big console and seatings for 6 people.
Last Osprey 8,2m with 2 X 200 HPDI made 54,6 knots with 2 people and 200 lit fuel.
With 5 people and around 500 lit fuel and some bags (around 150kg i had 50,1 knots on GPS, only lost 4,5 knots wich i find pretty good.
I think it`s very hard to find a boat that can have a topspeed around 60 with 14 people, we have 2 Tornado here in Stockholm with twin 300 Mercury, but they have a lot of problems with these engines on a boat that gets very heavy with 12 people.
My experience with charter is that we have 4 boats doing charter in Stockholm archipelago.
One Osprey Falcon 9,6m with 2 x 212 Steyr turbo diesels with seatings for 12 people.
3 Osprey Viper 7m with single Mercury 225hp Optimax, these boats do around 49 knots with seatings for 7 people and around 43-44 knots with all people.
Customers often find it more fun to rent 2 ribs with 6 people each instead of one boat with 12 people, they like to film, take pics etc, the boats are playing with each other and 40 knots on 7m boat feels faster than 50 knots on bigger boat.
So a recomendation, there is so much more things to do with 2 small boats than one big.
We have for an example paintball from the boats and than we find a small island in the archipelago, leave some people on one side and the rest on the other side and in the end there is a winner when they been taking the island people loves this!!!!
We have come to a point in Stockholm were a lot of companies has been ribing and it`s not fun anymore to just drive for 2 hours.
So we have taking rafting concept even futher.

Regards

Petrov

[Andre]

And here is another Rapier for 12 people + 2 . However for commercial use like this, diesel is the way to go. This Rapier 900 is fitted with the new Mercruiser 300 linked to a Bravo One drive. Speed 42 knots depending on sea conditions

This particular Rapier 900 was supplied to a Hotel in Norway for the pleasure of its guests.

Charles, in case you did not know both Rapier ribs are Parker 900 Rapier

Andre

[Petrov]

This is a pretty cool concept with bucket seats.
Osprey Lynx 28, you can have twin 225hp and have a topspeed around 63-65 knots with just driver, maybe you loose 5-6 knots with people in it, people sit safe in the seats and than you can push the boat even harder.
Sorry for the bad pic.

Regards

Petrov

[Alan]

Originally posted by Petrov
This is a pretty cool concept with bucket seats.
Osprey Lynx 28, you can have twin 225hp and have a topspeed around 63-65 knots with just driver, maybe you loose 5-6 knots with people in it, people sit safe in the seats and than you can push the boat even harder.
Sorry for the bad pic.

Regards

Petrov

Or to put it another way......your fare paying passengers get their spines compressed by being wedged into a bucket seat and being thrown around at 60kts whilst the driver safe in his enclosed cockpit has no idea whats happening to the passengers sitting behind him

I do like the sound of the paintballing expeditions tho'! (Imagination runs wild......now what you need is a fully automatic paintbal gun on a mount in the bow, two ribs and..................)

[Fjordrafting]

Wow! All theese cerious answers from respectable chartercompanies! Thank you guys.
My friend has a ribharter-company. (www.searafting.no) He drives a Revenger 29 with 2x225 two-stroke engines, it is a ligth boat like the Scorpion, and i makes 60 knots with 14 people. I have tried it! The boat runs great even when full.
It is defenately true that you don´t go faster than 25-30 knots i big waves, but on smooth water it is a whole lot of fun getting to the waves as well. To you guys in Sweeden who have problems when 14 people on board, what kind of problems would that be?
When I bye a rib with twin 250hp, woulden´t it be better if it could do 10 more knots if it still is the same length and the same amount of passengers?
Yours Sincerely
Martin

[thewavehumper]

Yes, if your boat has more speed then that can be cool, but it can also means that any accidents can be more serious.

In my opinion if you want to have a hull that is going to run Charter work then it rally has to be strong.

I agree with Alan with that many people on board you definitely want to see your passengers whilst you are driving.

[Petrov]

Offcourse it`s good to have control over the passengers, the cockpit (there is other consoles) on the Osprey Lynx is not my first choice (think the boat is in UK) but still i prefer the bucket seats, sitting more comfortable and safe in them, no chance of spinning around in the seats.
And if you want to se passenger you have to put the passenger in the front, wich means bigger risk of injuires and passenger flying around in the front when you jumping in the waves, specially in speeds around 60 knots, so were ever you put them and the drivers there is always different opinions of wich is the best placement. Also when it comes to light boats, they are great in your fjords on flat water, but as heavier as better, safe and controled etc when you come out on the real ruff seas.
Must missunderstand me with problems with 14 people, we don`t have any problems with it, it`s the 300hp Mercury that is the problems, these racing machines can`t really handle a 10,5m boat with 14 people, to much weigth, these machines want`s a light boat, they brake all the time. these boats are doing 70 knots.

[Fjordrafting]

Searafting.no went out with their Revenger 29 in 6 m.waves last wednesday.
they perform perfectly, exept getting the passengers all wet when riding with the waves and plowing into the wave in front.
They go so hard that you won´t belive it. I once stood in front when 4m. waves and I was total after 5 minutes. So I can´t see why a heaver boat should perform so differently when it already is filled with people and gas.
When I was standing in the front, I had to flex my feet and use every muchle to take the slam everytime we landed between the high and short waves. If I had been sitting in a bucket- seat.......
Petrow, You say that you have problems with the Mercury, I have heard rumers about a chartercompany in Stockholm which had problems with big Yamahas, and then they changed to Mercury, is this u?
Yours Sincerely
Martin

[Petrov]

No it`s not me, we have 3 225 optimax but changing them to another brand, we been having around 10 brakedowns on our optimaxes, we had one Osprey Seaharrier 6,6m with a Yamaha 200 HPDI (52 knots, 6 seatings) boat runned around 350 hours without any problems, and know there is another guy doing chartering with it and engine just goes and goes, pretty strange how different it can be, ha ha.
I tried go in on the link you have but it does`nt work.
I believe you about the experience you had in 4m waves, offcourse it helps when it`s fully loaded with people and fuel, but still, one day it`s not 14 people onboard, maybee a charter with 5 people and than you will have the advantage by having a heavy boat.
It`s always hard to get a boat that is perfect for all conditions.
One thing that you also should look into, i guess you will drive pretty much in open sea, a hard nose boat is a recomendation, a rib with tubes in bow can be bad sometimes, diving in waves time after time is hard for the tubes, specially big boats with twin engines, the pressure on the tubes in bow is really tuff and after a while the tubes can get loose from hull.
There is more and more companies that start to have a model with hard noses.
I was down in Italy on a competition 2 weeks ago, see www.aquaraid.com or our team homepage www.narcotic.be and there you will see the advantage with hard noses.
They just dive thrue the waves without any damages on the tubes and the boat will not a have quick stop in the same way as a boat with tubes in bow.
Jag körde faktiskt en riktigt härlig resa längs hela norska kusten i början av sommaren, startade i Kirkenes och slutade i Oslo, jag hoppade av i din hemstad Trondheim.
Fantastisk upplevelse, vi körde med 3 st Opsrey Falcon 8,2m.
Du kan gå in under galleri här på Rib net så ser du lite bilder från resan.


MVH

Petrov

[Fjordrafting]

Try to puch: www.searafting.no

[Charles]

Originally posted by Andre


Charles, in case you did not know both Rapier ribs are Parker 900 Rapier

Andre

I'm well aware of this - thanks Andre - I thought I would give the rib a 'plug'