Compulsory licensing and mandatory kill cords? What do you think?

[twtrk1]

Legislation WILL NOT save another injury or life. Dumb people will always find away to show their "dumbness". Drunk driving is illegal & it still happens. Oregon has a mandatory boaters license (wish I would have done it when it was free) & basically, if a boat has a gas powered motor-it needs to be registered-that's how the state gets their money to "protect" us.

I will say that if rules are going to be made, YOU WANT A VOICE IN THE PROCESS. If the magazines are acting in the sports best interest based upon what the "representatives" in government are thinking the sport needs, then maybe attention should given. Government is out for ONE THING & that's collecting our money, nothing else. Just like all the gun debate hear in the US, no legislation, or new rule about guns will save another life, anything proposed by government WILL only bring in more money...& do nothing for the people.

[thomas]

When numpties drive boats dangerously they put innocent lives at risk so legislation is not alway a bad thing.

We need a licence for a car, a plane, a helicopter and even a VHF so why not a powerful boat? and while they're at it make cyclists get one too.

[Dirk Diggler]

Interestingly, so far out of 390 voters, 76% would like things to stay as they are. Would be good to know how many of those have a qualification?

[Pikey Dave]

The only people to benefit from any legislation or compulsory training would be those on the receiving end of the cash that would be generated. People who currently wear killcords through choice would continue to do so, & those who don't would just ignore any rules due to the fact that they would be unenforceable. The only result would be another tax on those of us who decide to stay legal. All the talk of enforcement & legislation is cobblers unless we adopt the Continental system where you have more agencies afloat checking documents than boaters. The French have about 5 at the last count, we've been stopped & boarded twice & had our "Papiers" checked, & who do you think pays for it all??????????? 45% base rate income tax anyone + an annual "Leesonse"

[chris.moody]

The RYA PB2 course concentrates mainly on low speed manoeuvring and boat handling. A very small part of the 2 days is on handling a boat at planning speeds. So a PB2 course will help stop you denting and scratching your boat and other boats when manoeuvring, and make your boating less stressful, it will not teach you how to handle a boat in waves at speed. That's for you to learn later by experimenting on your own and building up your experience.

What a PB2 course will do is stress the importance of:

Using lifejackets or buoyancy aids all the time
Using the kill cord on leg or buoyancy aid all the time
One hand on the throttle, one on the wheel all the time

So the way to save lives is to take notice of the above three points and act on them, regardless of if you decide you want formal training or not.

[mitchc]

Originally Posted by Nos4r2

I would like to point out that this is a personal opinion and not in any way Ribnet policy.

HMS.

The stickers are a FABULOUS idea. I don't have any issue with your magazine name being on them.

However.

You are NOT an elected industry spokesperson and your campaign for regulation is unwelcome. I repeat my earlier statements about government involvement being a negative force.
The RNLI refuse government funding for a very good reason-they'll be messed around with. If you think we'd be otherwise I'm afraid you're deluded.

If the campaign for legislation does not end, I will be cancelling my subscription to your magazine. I urge others who feel the same way to vote with their feet as well.

If you're going to put your head over the parapet,deal the enemy a crippling blow otherwise all you do is to shout 'look at me, I'm here' and give them somewhere to aim.

Hopefully they haven't seen you yet.

Excellent, exactly what I was about write!

[chris.moody]

Originally Posted by Dirk Diggler

Interestingly, so far out of 390 voters, 76% would like things to stay as they are. Would be good to know how many of those have a qualification?

I voted to keep things as they are. I have:
Advanced Powerboat Commercially endorsed
Powerboat Instructor
Coastal Skipper (sail)

[mick]

I am not into legislation s--t happens everyday very sad situation we will all learn from others mistakes best thing is to move on and deal with it
One example is Colin McRea and his helicopter

[Gaz]

Licence for driving a boat (with test which includes rules of the road and importance of safety features, such as wearing a kill cord): definitely.

Legislation to make wearing kill cord compulsory: probably too difficult to enforce.

Most of the serious accidents that I am aware of have been the result of not wearing a kill cord.

.

[paddlers]

Any qualification means nothing without common sense !!! If people choose to ignore the advantages of safety equipment all the pieces of paper in the world won't make any difference. Kill cords, lifejackets, flares, vhf etc etc are there for a reason.
Pure bad luck can play a part. This particular tragic accident has possibly highlighted the benefit of wearing a kill cord or device to stop the engine. Most rational people will make up their own minds if they wear one or not. Fining people will not stop those who choose not to.

[kerny]

Originally Posted by Dirk Diggler

Interestingly, so far out of 390 voters, 76% would like things to stay as they are. Would be good to know how many of those have a qualification?

I think that out of the 76% that do have some basic qualifications ie. P2 it would be the majority of us.

I for 1 have... without being forced to do.

[cdilljr]

Kill cords are mandatory in many other places in the world. I always wear mine and take special notice if I'm out by myself. Falling out of a boat shouldn't be a life or death situation. The water here right now is too cold to survive for a long swim back to shore, but with a kill cord, swimming to an unmoving boat would be a legitimate chance.

This doesn't even get into the danger posed to the rest of the public by an uncontrolled boat under power. This is a really simple thing to follow. And, there are even options out there for cordless kill switches.

I also live in a state where a boater safety course is mandatory. It's a pain and I was an experienced boater already. But I did learn a couple things that are helpful and for that it was worth the minor inconvenience.

[weekendwarrior]

The Utopian Nanny State is the World over. We constantly have people getting into trouble, I call them City Sissies. I have had the pleasure of sailing the Sea for over 50 years of my life and there is no substitute for experience and the lessons that my Father taught.

I live in the Santa Barbara Mountains of Southern California Coast and weekly someone has to be airlifted because they ventured into the wilderness without water, proper clothing, safety equipment etc.

You cannot legislate STUPID. Way more money than brains, in whatever recreation venue that floats your boat.

I have a kill switch on my CAT, I put it on myself, but have never had to use it, PWC Waverunners is another matter.

Shit happens and Regulations just burden the responsible.

[Anchorhandler]

Originally Posted by simonnud

So if it terns out the guy had a PB2 will you change your mind?

What kind of narrow minded statement is that?

Do you think the Padstow incident was an isolated one???

I can give you 20 examples of dangerous behaviour on the water just in the last few months alone.

Luckily they were all "near-miss' incidents but its only a matter of time....

One of our vessels very nerly collided with a motor cruiser only last week as the window-licker at the helm shot out of the Itchen heading over to Hythe marina and never saw our vessel's nav lights (it was night time).

So quite frankly i could'nt give two sh*t's if the helmsman of the Padstow rib had a ticket or not!

May he RIP...

Simon

[Barcobird]

I live in Portugal and as a resident I have to have a license to drive a motorised boat. There are various grades dependant on the size of vehicle and how far it is aloud to travel. We also pay light dues. We also pay a tax which varies dependant on size of engine. We also pay insurance. You also have your boat inspected every five years which includes safety equipment. If you are stopped by the marine police out on the water and you have defaulted on any of the above then you will be fined.
So what's the problem with this system, we very rarely get stranded boaters, running out of petrol or breaking down due to lack of maintenance. We do not cost the government millions in lifeboat call outs, most of which in England could be avoided.
Face the facts, you are driving a dangerous vehicle which should be given respect as you do with a car. Young kids should not be bombing about in tenders from "Daddy's large boat".
The licensing laws in England are non existent which is a joke. Unless something is done to rectify this unfortunately this latest very sad incident will not be the last.

[kerny]

Just a thought!! I have a P 2 ticket and also ICC license which allows to drive any motor yacht / boat up to 30 ft. I have only ever driven a rib no larger than 6.4 metre. I personally would not attempt to hire something up to the max without someone with experience to show me how. But I could if I wanted to.

So having qualifications does not mean that you are competent, if you know what I mean.

[Barcobird]

Originally Posted by kerny

Just a thought!! I have a P 2 ticket and also ICC license which allows to drive any motor yacht / boat up to 30 ft. I have only ever driven a rib no larger than 6.4 metre. I personally would not attempt to hire something up to the max without someone with experience to show me how. But I could if I wanted to.

So having qualifications does not mean that you are competent, if you know what I mean.

Exactly what I am saying, the laws in England are useless. Just because you have the ICC SHOULD NOT allow you to drive just about anything up to 30ft. Incidentally some of the biggest idiots on the water who generally show no lack of respect to other boat users while "showing off" are the jet ski brigade.

[Poly]

Originally Posted by michael1234

If not then why can a novice pilot buy and use a V6 300 hp outboard without any training whatsoever?

how often do you believe that happens? I suspect it is relatively rare that someone's first boat is 300HP, pretty unusual that the get no formal training and even rarer that there is no basic handover training or 'helpful friend' around to guide them.

[wavelength]

aah yes european exams and our past clients who live over there. One came back here for L2 as they could do a course in one european state for £xxxx hundreds of pounds but in the neighbouring country it was much cheaper but had to be done in the local language which he did not speak.
Provider told that didnt matter as they would give him the multi choice question paper and also the answer paper. All he had to do was copy the answers onto the question paper and he would get his licence. Go out in a boat? - no didnt need to do that!
Pay tax on m'boat to pay the wages of the army of new civil service/local govt officials to come and check m'boat??, no thank you. I seem to think it was the size of the civil service and other govt employees that got certain countries into a situation were they had to be bailed out of their financial woes

We do not cost the government millions in lifeboat call outs, most of which in England could be avoided

and its not the govt that pays for the RNLI and independent lifeboats in the UK - we look after our own.

[chris.moody]

Originally Posted by kerny

Just a thought!! I have a P 2 ticket and also ICC license which allows to drive any motor yacht / boat up to 30 ft. I have only ever driven a rib no larger than 6.4 metre. I personally would not attempt to hire something up to the max without someone with experience to show me how. But I could if I wanted to.

So having qualifications does not mean that you are competent, if you know what I mean.

+1

My commercial licence allows me to skipper powered vessels up to 24m in length, but I would be silly to attempt doing that as I'm not experienced in vessels of that size. In fact when I took out this years PL insurance I asked them to limit it to 15m length maximum.