Have Picton gone bust?

A.C. · 21 October 2008, 19:53

Thread on the 'Boatmad' site saying Picton have folded today. Does anyone have any info on this, is it true?

RichardB · 21 October 2008, 22:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by A.C.

Thread on the 'Boatmad' site saying Picton have folded today. Does anyone have any info on this, is it true?

Interesting - website was down the past few days. I was trying to look up Cobra's

codprawn · 21 October 2008, 22:49

Dave Picton sold out a year or two ago - he just sells boats now - bet he saw the writing on the wall..............

nikster · 22 October 2008, 10:28

went pop over the weekend - recievers number 01722 432 651

Already people interested in moulds etc and sure will re-invent themsleves...!!

PeterM · 22 October 2008, 12:07

Quite a lot of these boats in the solent all quite newish . Not sure what sort of warranty they had , but would this be picked up by anyone now ?

nikster · 22 October 2008, 13:26

ive never known of a company willing to insure a failed companies products - as with all things you pay's your money, you takes your chance!! rumour mill saying VAT bill was big part of the problem??? so if you paid VAT on a new cobra in the last year - you may be paying for it twice soon..... watch for HMRC letters popping through the door...!!! and yes i think they can..........?

Doug Stormforce · 22 October 2008, 13:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikster

rumour mill saying VAT bill was big part of the problem??? so if you paid VAT on a new cobra in the last year - you may be paying for it twice soon..... watch for HMRC letters popping through the door...!!! and yes i think they can..........?

I don’t know the details of this case but am unsure why someone with a VAT receipt would have to pay again.

The crown / HMRC are one of the first people to get paid from the sale of assets when a company goes into receivership/liquidation. For that reason it’s a fairly safe strategy for them to cause the company to go into receivership.

John Kennett · 22 October 2008, 13:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikster

so if you paid VAT on a new cobra in the last year - you may be paying for it twice soon..... watch for HMRC letters popping through the door...!!! and yes i think they can..........?

I'm pretty sure that's not correct. The purchaser doesn't have any VAT liability to HMRC.

John

Phil · 22 October 2008, 14:47

1. Crown preference ceased to apply from September 2003 under the provisions of The Enterprise Act 2002; the idea being that the company's assets be spread amongst a wider class of beneficiaries particuarly unsecured creditors.

2. No way can HMRC call upon a purchaser to pay the company's VAT liability which is theirs and theirs alone

nikster · 22 October 2008, 15:33

mmmmm not going to get into an argument here - but a fairly well known case involves a commercial invoice raised and VAT payment made for a vessel - which in turn was never paid to HMRC so being as the vessel was used commercially and the operator was trying to reclaim VAT on his purchases the 2 needed to marry up. Bottom line is the VAT was never paid on the boat, so they made the operator pay again as the vessel was in commercial use.

Phil · 22 October 2008, 18:19

well VAT can be complex but the crucial difference between your point is that VAT is essentially a tax on consumers not middlemen i.e. commercial operators whether builders ,dealers commercial users etc who are part of the chain of charging and reclaiming

99.9% of punters are end users so do not get involved in reclaims. They have (hopefully) a VAT invoice marked "paid" which is end of

hope this helps

ribraff · 22 October 2008, 18:40

To get back on subject, I think we'll be seeing cobra ribs reincarnate shortly.

codprawn · 22 October 2008, 23:24

Heard a nasty little rumour today - don't know how true it is but I was told that they deliberately went through and will be buying the moulds back - a cheap way to relocate perhaps? Bridgend too far away from the South Coast?

Never mind the poor buggers out of work - doubt they will get any redundancy either if a new company was formed. Nice one just before Christmas.

Of course I could be totally wrong.

Observer · 23 October 2008, 04:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikster

mmmmm not going to get into an argument here - but a fairly well known case involves a commercial invoice raised and VAT payment made for a vessel - which in turn was never paid to HMRC so being as the vessel was used commercially and the operator was trying to reclaim VAT on his purchases the 2 needed to marry up. Bottom line is the VAT was never paid on the boat, so they made the operator pay again as the vessel was in commercial use.

Perhaps not going to get into an argument because you don't really know what you're talking about? I don't know the case you're referring to, but the first, general principle of VAT law is that liability to account for tax lies with the supplier, not the purchaser (this is not the case where the transaction is not taxable because it involves export/removal of goods from one country to another). You may have heard about the 'carousel fraud' where HMRC have sought (unsuccessfully) to make innocent purchasers liable for VAT paid to a supplier from whom they purchased goods, which wasn't subsequently paid on to HMRC. Unless there are special circumstances (such as bad faith or complicity in deliberate evasion or fraud), the situation you described simply wouldn't happen. I'll eat my words if you can produce evidence to the contrary, but I'm not holding my breath.

nikster · 23 October 2008, 09:14

oooo somebodies tired??....will see what i can dig up - calm down!

Jono · 23 October 2008, 12:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

Heard a nasty little rumour today - don't know how true it is but...

..I'll repeat it anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

Of course I could be totally wrong.

..don't let that stop you spreading gossip.

codprawn · 23 October 2008, 12:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jono

..I'll repeat it anyway.

..don't let that stop you spreading gossip.

Why not the media do it all the time..................

Dirk Diggler · 23 October 2008, 12:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

Of course I could be totally wrong.

No, I'm not having that, you seem to know everything!

codprawn · 23 October 2008, 12:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jono

..I'll repeat it anyway.

..don't let that stop you spreading gossip.

Why not the media do it all the time..................

Anyway the bloke seemed pretty genuine and rather pissed off - he may have got it wrong of course but he seemed pretty sure.

Bridgend isn't that big a place.

Channel Ribs · 23 October 2008, 12:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jono

..I'll repeat it anyway.

..don't let that stop you spreading gossip.

Isn't that the point of internet fora? To air one's views and share gossip?

So long as no one gets called names or damaging statement are spread with malice, Codders made it pretty clear that it was hear say he was passing on.