HELP! Brig vs Grand (Ukraine)

[urbee]

Hello, fellow Ribbers (if thats the term!)

We're deciding on a brand sparkling new RIB boat to add primarely to an appartment at the beautifull Croatian coast as a rental. We assume the boat will be rented modestly up to about 90 days per year and mostly to leasure travelers and possibly families.

We have some experience with ZAR boats and less with others (have been more a hard-hull boaters) in our time but are more and more fascinated in the smooth wave ride of RIBs. Also, when it comes to renting the boat to relatively non experienced renters it presume its safer to offer RIB's.

We have narrowed down to Brig versus Grand. If you ask me why - don't me - the design. We know leasure customers rent with their eyes and they are both very attractive boats. The second thing is it looks like you get a lot of bang for your buck. Our budget is around 55.000 EUR for a whole with an engine and a trailer to go with.

I am sure you have heard of both brands - from my investigation they have started as a Brig factory and have been involved with aerospace in the past (pre-1991) in Ukraine. Then, about 15 years ago they splitted into two compaines.

From my research there are not much details on any of them over the internet - at least not from the owners. So i'm trying to get as much feedback as possible to decide more easily.

The models we're attracted to are either

- Brig Eagler 6.7
- Grand Golden Line G650

They are very similar in the design and functionalities but from the first look it seems that Brig is more of a sturdy "military" look and Grand went into more luxurious way. They are in similar length (6.5 and 6.7m) and require similar engines.

Since the whole idea is to offer/buy a different and fully equipped boat we're thinking of putting on a lot of extras:

- 175 ccm drive by wire Yamaha or Suzuki (does not matter i guess but more towards Yamaha)
- Electric winch and anchor
- Simrad 7" GPS
- Premium Fusion radio & speakers
- cooling box
- bimini top
... etc

Now to the important thing - which one?

I know this forum has some posts regarding the quality issues with Brig and Grand. THere is lack of Grand details which seems its relatively new and maybe not so popular in the UK and around. From googling around i have found posts about Grand especially having quality issues but the posts involve older and smaller PVC boats. The two i am looking are Orca Hypalon tubes and should be different quality.

Does ANYONE have experience with the two boats from the past 5 years or so? I have found out Grand had some issues in the past (takeovers from different owners etc) and presumably found a new owner with money which means the production has increased and the quality should also. But as the boat models are relatively new (few years) there are not much owners around to tell. And its hard to get details from the retailers of them as i would like to get objective oppinions.

I'm worred that maybe both of them could be lower quality even though they don't look so. I dont want to be too subjective on the fact they are made in Ukraine. They can't be the best on the market for this price but it seems like a good optimum between price, performance and the design.

Both brands have a local retailer and distributor which would give us support in case of any issues but i'm a bit afraid by the fact that for any kind of unknown quality problems the rental season could be shortened or lost. I know people tend to do sh*t with other people's boats and that there are tons of drunk'n'driving and hitting stuff around at least on the adriatic coast.

Brig looks to me like a more rigid decision while Grand looks luxurious - what i'm worried that the additional gear that Grand has could be a problem in a rental like:

- the front Inox rails are "glued" to the Hypalon - are people going to rip that open when holding/jumping/getting off the water?
- the rear steps seem very practical but very fragile when going eg. from a gas pump for novice sailors. You bump that and its permanent.

I have also been given other warnings abour Grand quality but cannot decide if that is just competition talking (sure every distri will give you much subjective oppinion about their competitives) or is it honest?

I'm positive the seller would give me good support in terms of maintenance and everything but still i'm not able to decide.

Please HELP me with your experienced advices to decide ASAP.

And lastly - i would like to use it myself also, if it was only rental i would go cheap and bare boat as possible but for a combination - i rather give more and enjoy it myself also.

Brig:



Grand:

[Jojosrib]

Hi,
I would PM Lisilou. My understanding is that she has a Grand and previously owned a Brig Navigator. From memory, very happy with both boats.
I have owned a 610 Brig for 2 years and put on 100 hours. It primarily gets used for waterskiing and scuba diving. We get upto 50k offshore with 4 divers but we’re fussy about weather when we go out. It has handled everything we have asked of it and never given us cause for concern. The Brig has provided a tonne of enjoyment for the family and still looks newish.
I’ve never been in a 6.7 but it looks a pretty good boat for touring to me. I hope this helps.

[urbee]

Thanks for this. I was expecting someone else to post and review but it seems there are really not a lot of Brig / Grand users out there.

I have already filtered out Grand and Brig users here and contacted her also with a kind request for a review.

[Lisilou]

Hi Urbee.
JoJo’s right. We used to have a Brig 610 Nav & didn’t have any cause for concern quality wise. It performed well & could handle rougher seas than I would choose to go out in. In fairness, we only had her a season simply because we wanted to go bigger. I will say I found the throttle position on the 610 Nav not the best for me personally but that was the only issue I had with it.
In the search for bigger, we looked at Brig again & also the Grand GL750. The Grand ticked every box for us & it pipped Brig at the post aesthetically.
A year on & we’ve no regrets whatsoever. We use her every opportunity we get which is fairly often. As far as quality goes, so far so good. No corners cut that I can see. In fact, quite the opposite. It’s simply a great boat that handles very well indeed.
All that said...7.5 meters is very different to 6.5 so perhaps not a fair comparison but if it’s quality you’re worried about on either the Brig or the Grand...don’t be.
L

[Vollty]

Hi Urbee
I have owned my G580 for around a year & a half now and am really pleased with it. When originally looking at what to go for, I was looking at the G580 & Navigator 570. The Grand impressed me the most.....the layout & storage was much better then the Brigg. The Grands are generally wider then the equivalent Brigg models......the 580 has the console in the center & does not feel cramped at all, where as even the Eagle 6.7 has an off set console. The quality of a navigator 570 that a friend purchased fell far below the G580. I know you are looking at the next size up so don't know how relevent this info is to you. The quality of the Eagle 6.7 does seem much better then the navigator from what I have seen.

[hyndlandguy]

I bought a Brig Eagle 8 this summer and love it. No issues whatsover and the build quality is fantastic. A lot of boat for the money in my opinion. I am sure the Eagle 6.7 will be equally as nice

[Cshack]

Hi, i just finished me second season with the Eagle 6 on the Great South Bay in New York. the conditions can change dramatically hour to hour and i even though i am a novice boat owner, i have felt extremely confident in the Brig. it's a also a real head turner. i cant tell you how many people ask about this boat. it's functional, sexy, high perfoming, stable, and very high quality.

My only complaint is the strange design of the bow cleat on the Eagle 6. However on the 6.7 they have replaced this single strange cleat with two traditional cleats.

you can customize the boat when you order it, colors, flooring, fabric colors, radio, nav system. i would think hard about the bimini cover as i think it would be a real pain to raise and lower, but perhaps then can install it permanently if you really need it.

hope this helps.

[urbee]

Thanks. I've decided to go with a Grand 650 and will report my experience as a user and also as a lessor.

The only thing i'm afraid now is the potential damage in a rent-a-boat situation that i know IS going to happen but i have to set my mind straight and not worry too much - it will just need some more regular maintenance, i guess.

[jackslate]

I previously had a Grand G650 as I was given a really good deal on the boat and liked the look go the the layout. I did look at the BRIG Eagle 650 but at the time could not afford one.

I did not have any complaints about the Grand and the build quality was inline with the cost of the boat. The only criticisms that I did have from a functional point of view was that the throttle was too close to the steering wheel and I was easy to hit while helming. The rear bench seat with the table looked great but in practice there was not enough space to sit around it.

From a performance point of view to was definitely a fair weather RIB as the ride was not very comfortable when the sea chopped up at all and it id tend to bow steer. Saying that it is a leisure RIB and not meant for rougher conditions.

I am now a skipper of a 200ft yacht and we have and BRIG Eagle 6.7 as a chase boat. I am extreamly happy with it. The finish and the layout in allot better and the quality in noticeable. However the real difference is in rougher conditions (we have certainly taken it out in some challenging conditions) the ride is noticeably better than the Grand. It just feels more solid and better put together.

Now I am in a position to upgrade I will be looking at trading my G650 for and Eagle 6.7 and maybe an Eagle 8 if my budget will allow it.

[midlife]

Brig all day long

[Salty Pete]

One issue not covered so far.

The nicest looking boat when it's new, may not be the nicest looking boat in a year's time.

For hiring and resale value I would be looking at a robust RIB with an aluminium hull, console and superstructure.

Fibreglass (GRP) looks nice when it's new but after it has bee scuffed and chipped the new wears off very quickly.

Ali, can be sanded and recoated and look like new.

[xpertski]

Wonder how Stingher features in this comparison - seems a similar ish type of Rib ...

[Poly]

Originally Posted by xpertski

Wonder how Stingher features in this comparison - seems a similar ish type of Rib ...

Are Stingher not quite highly regarded and priced accordingly?

[Poly]

Originally Posted by urbee

Also, when it comes to renting the boat to relatively non experienced renters it presume its safer to offer RIB's.

depends what you mean by safer. Safer to them? To the boat? To other boaters?

. Our budget is around 55.000 EUR for a whole with an engine and a trailer to go with.

what are your rules on chartering - in the UK you’d have quite a lot to spend on surveys, liferaft, etc

From my research there are not much details on any of them over the internet - at least not from the owners. So i'm trying to get as much feedback as possible to decide more easily.

and what there is you should treat with some suspicion. When Brig emerged in the UK they astroturfed this forum (and presumably others) with false posts https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astroturfing

The models we're attracted to are either

- Electric winch and anchor

A frequent source of problems on charter yachts - and a risk for trapped fingers etc - is it worth it?

The two i am looking are Orca Hypalon tubes and should be different quality.

perhaps, or perhaps just a different material put together by the same people.

which means the production has increased and the quality should also.

mmm... the two are not correlated - plenty of places see the opposite happen

I'm worred that maybe both of them could be lower quality even though they don't look so. I dont want to be too subjective on the fact they are made in Ukraine. They can't be the best on the market for this price but it seems like a good optimum between price, performance and the design.

can you find anyone else chartering them out? That’s always the indicator to me - if someone is losing money by not having a boat on the water the good boats usually win out.

I know people tend to do sh*t with other people's boats and that there are tons of drunk'n'driving and hitting stuff around at least on the adriatic coast.

in which case I’d get some really robust thing with a small engine to reduce the harm - or better still keep away and point customers to someone local who wants to deal with those headaches.

- are people going to rip that open when holding/jumping/getting off the water?
- the rear steps seem very practical but very fragile when going eg. from a gas pump for novice sailors. You bump that and its permanent.

they will break all that and more and find ways to break stuff you didn’t know about...

Are you local to fix these issues?

And lastly - i would like to use it myself also, if it was only rental i would go cheap and bare boat as possible but for a combination - i rather give more and enjoy it myself also.

Probably a mistake! They are going to wreck your pride and joy. You are going to spend your time fixing issues on a boat that was never designed for heavy abuse. How are you going to deal with the people who anchor up at 10am, leave all the electronics on and have a dead battery at 7pm and can’t get the engine started?