Insurance question

Ovey · 06 October 2014, 11:37

I have a general question about boat insurance (specifically the outboard motor).

I am shopping around for a new policy and currently have a 2003 Yammy F115AETL on the back of the boat, which is insured for £4500. Most insurers seem happy with this price but state that I'd only get market value for it should it be damaged/stolen (current book price is around £2900 apparently), and they won't allow me to go much more than £4500 on it due to it being 11 years old.

Bearing in mind a direct replacement doesn't come up for sale second hand very often (I've been looking around for this very reason), and a new one is at least £9500, what would happen in the event of the engine being stolen? I'd be looking to sell the boat as bare bones as I couldn't afford the shortfall of £6k+ to get a replacement. Is it just a case of hoping it never happens??

bartiny · 06 October 2014, 11:50

From reading my policy they take price new, then deduct 10% per annum upto a maximum of 70%.

Ovey · 06 October 2014, 11:57

Yeah, that's how they get the £2900 book price for mine after talking to them.

I'd be hard pushed to find a replacement for £2900 though, should it disappear off the back end for any reason!

Boats&Outboards · 06 October 2014, 12:59

Without wanting to upset you further, here's a screenshot of what the insurance company have as a value on your engine. Its a guide supplied to us by the loss adjuster's

The first figure is list price (ex vat), the 2nd is estimated retail and the last is trade in. According to the loss adjuster they look to allow You to get back something in between the last 2 figures.

This is last years figures, as we haven't yet got the 2014 one.

[ATTACH]99673[/ATTACH

Peter @ Boatsandoutboards4sale
07930 421007
www.BoatsandOutboards4Sale.co.uk

Ovey · 06 October 2014, 13:06

Strewth! I'd best not lose it then or I'll have a pretty expensive rowing RIB when I can't afford a replacement engine!

Searider · 06 October 2014, 13:20

I occasionally have to value engines that have become uneconomic to repair for insurers - typically if they have been submerged.

I'll use a combination of:
Threestokes guide
What's for sale on boatsandoutboards
What's for sale on eBay
Ebay completed auction prices.

I'll also ask if the customer has called some dealers to see what is available.

Insurers generally are happy to pay the fair market price in my experience.

The main problem is with an older engine where there is very little availability. What's my 2001 800hrs opti 150 worth?

SteveHall · 06 October 2014, 13:20

Peter - Do you have the full list? Im after this information for my 2006 / 2007 Etec 175.

Ovey · 06 October 2014, 13:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Searider

I occasionally have to value engines that have become uneconomic to repair for insurers - typically if they have been submerged.

I'll use a combination of:
Threestokes guide
What's for sale on boatsandoutboards
What's for sale on eBay
Ebay completed auction prices.

I'll also ask if the customer has called some dealers to see what is available.

Insurers generally are happy to pay the fair market price in my experience.

The main problem is with an older engine where there is very little availability. What's my 2001 800hrs opti 150 worth?

That's useful, and sounds pretty fair. I'd imagine most valuers would "probably" do similar. I'm just surprised that I couldn't even pay extra to "up" the cover to help narrow the gap between what I'd get and what I'd need to fork out, should the worst happen.

SteveHall · 06 October 2014, 13:34

I would like to do the same, pay a higher premium to have a like for like, or an agreed value.

Ovey · 06 October 2014, 13:42

I could be wrong but I believe an agreed value is based upon what you paid for the engine (or what it was worth at the time of taking out the policy). So for mine being 11 years old (despite being barely broken in at 230 hours!!) I would be able to quote it at £4500 (or less based upon the guide posted above) and get that back with an agreed value, but it would still leave me short on money to replace it as the cheapest on B&O at the moment is £9995.

Searider · 06 October 2014, 14:00

In general with an "Agreed Value" policy you and the Insurer Agree the value you want covered and you pay the appropriate premium.

I know of agreed value policies for large, often classic, vessels - but don't know if it's possible to have an agreed value policy for a small craft.

SteveHall · 06 October 2014, 14:06

I can see the reasons why - but for an honest person who is subject to some low life scum taking what we have worked hard for we lose out massively.

Searider · 06 October 2014, 14:45

"Moral Hazard" is what it's referred to!

Ovey · 06 October 2014, 14:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveHall

I can see the reasons why - but for an honest person who is subject to some low life scum taking what we have worked hard for we lose out massively.

Yup, it seems that way!

jyasaki · 06 October 2014, 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Searider

I know of agreed value policies for large, often classic, vessels - but don't know if it's possible to have an agreed value policy for a small craft.

I have a Agreed Value policy on my 18' Polaris Inflatable. I pay a little more for it, but the depreciation hit is substantially less. This is in the US, though. Worth a shot to ask your provider.

jky

gtflash · 06 October 2014, 19:49

I enquired about an agreed value policy today. It's available in uk.

Shocked me to find my boats worth 9k, engine approx 8k market value and trailer which is 2 yrs old for 8.5m is worth 1k

Pikey Dave · 06 October 2014, 19:49

I have an agreed value for BP from Mercia Marine.

kerny · 06 October 2014, 20:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

I have an agreed value for BP from Mercia Marine.

I think that's the way to go, but does that agreed value come down after each year or do you up your premium each year to keep it the same ?

captnjack · 06 October 2014, 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerny

I think that's the way to go, but does that agreed value come down after each year or do you up your premium each year to keep it the same ?

Agreed value and the premiums for agreed value basically stay the same year after year. Why would it go up unless the risk of paying out £4500 changes? I don't think my premiums have changed more than about 1-2% total in 7 years with the same agreed value limits and the same insurer.

Pikey Dave · 06 October 2014, 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerny

I think that's the way to go, but does that agreed value come down after each year or do you up your premium each year to keep it the same ?

The value stays the same year on year. The premium rises incrementally each year by about the rate of inflation. I'm paying more or less the same as I did 6 years ago in real terms.