Marker bouys

[stevedonna]

Originally Posted by ShinyShoe

The link rope between pots - the advice is length > depth of water. That is so you are only hauling 1 pot at a time.

But remember that your rope will float. so if you are in 20ft of water (20ft riser at high water) then when you troll/drift to where you are going to drop the next pot the rope will be at an angle. So lets assume you make that rope 30ft then using pythagoras 30x30 = 20x20 + distance from first x distance from first. So thats 22ft from the first. When settled on the bottom there will be 8ft of rope spare. if that takes a 4 shape you have two right angle triangles 11ftx11ft + depthxdepth = 15ft x 15ft. So at a water depth of 10ft the rope will be on the surface. If you are working on an engine / keel clearance of say 4ft then the rope may be floating at strike height when the water depth is 14ft... 14ft feels deep enough that other boats wouldn't be scared to be there...

I think I'd put a little weight in the link rope too.

Fuse wire from my experience removes fingers!

Hmmm I think I know which one you were in my class at school .

My thoughts now are that I need to know what depth I will be dropping the pots in before I set them up , then I need to use the rope in a way that means I can alter it next time . I thought at first I would set the pot to pot rope up as a one off but clearly not as it will alter . So if I use weights on the pot to pot rope they will need to be movable .

I am thinking one length of rope through all three pots . So it's reusable next time , if that makes sense


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[A1an]

Being pots I would rig and set them individually, that way you can cover a wider area and pinpoint certain patches/ledges etc, you also don't have coils and coils of rope on board.

[stevedonna]

Originally Posted by A1an

Being pots I would rig and set them individually, that way you can cover a wider area and pinpoint certain patches/ledges etc, you also don't have coils and coils of rope on board.

That was my original idea but feedback suggested a line of three to stop them moving with the tide . My thoughts were spread the traps more chance .


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[A1an]

I've had pots move a few metres, maybe 50 at most but that was my fault as rope was too short and the bouy took the weight of pot.

Give them enough rope and a little weight and they'll be fine, unless you are setting them in a tidal rip. lobster pots are generally set close in and in little coves and bays.

[stevedonna]

Originally Posted by A1an

I've had pots move a few metres, maybe 50 at most but that was my fault as rope was too short and the bouy took the weight of pot.

Give them enough rope and a little weight and they'll be fine, unless you are setting them in a tidal rip. lobster pots are generally set close in and in little coves and bays.

I know it must vary a lot but what sort of depth do you set the pots at


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[jyasaki]

For Dungeness crab, we use about 8 lbs of lead per pot ("pot" in this case is a wire mesh box about 30" on a side, and 10 or 12" deep.)

Not sure what kind of water you're working; in Monterey we work the 250' (+/- 50 feet) line, no tidal influences, but can get pretty strong currents, winds and swell. The only time I've had my pot moved was when someone stole the contents.

jky

[A1an]

Some pots could almost be lifted at low tide, some are in 10/15m

Creels are generally in 25-32m

These depth are because of the type of water around here.

Salted mackerel will stop the crabs eating the bait before the lobster or prawns get in.

[stevedonna]

Originally Posted by jyasaki

For Dungeness crab, we use about 8 lbs of lead per pot ("pot" in this case is a wire mesh box about 30" on a side, and 10 or 12" deep.)



Not sure what kind of water you're working; in Monterey we work the 250' (+/- 50 feet) line, no tidal influences, but can get pretty strong currents, winds and swell. The only time I've had my pot moved was when someone stole the contents.



jky

Thanks but I think it's I different kettle of fish !


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[stevedonna]

Originally Posted by A1an

Some pots could almost be lifted at low tide, some are in 10/15m

Creels are generally in 25-32m

These depth are because of the type of water around here.

Salted mackerel will stop the crabs eating the bait before the lobster or prawns get in.

Okay yes that feels more on the lines I was thinking . Even more reason to set my creel pots separate from lobster pots .

Can you write me a note to the wife I now need to have more bouys


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[A1an]

When we went round Jura one of my thoughts was that I wouldn't mind setting a pot or two along that coast, it looks perfect.

The sound of Mull has a lot of Skate in it, you generally find Skate and Prawns on the same ground, they both like a muddy bottom. Unfortunately for you it's VERY deep. Not something you would attack without a hauler.

[stevedonna]

Originally Posted by A1an

When we went round Jura one of my thoughts was that I wouldn't mind setting a pot or two along that coast, it looks perfect.

The sound of Mull has a lot of Skate in it, you generally find Skate and Prawns on the same ground, they both like a muddy bottom. Unfortunately for you it's VERY deep. Not something you would attack without a hauler.

We are a family of four on jura for the first week of holiday so will have more time . Second week on mull we have another family of five joining us and my parents so won't have as much time . So looks like it has worked out okay .

Write me a note for a hauler as well while your at it .


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[ShinyShoe]

Originally Posted by stevedonna

Hmmm I think I know which one you were in my class at school .

Oy! We can't all be hunky sportsmen you know...

My thoughts now are that I need to know what depth I will be dropping the pots in before I set them up , then I need to use the rope in a way that means I can alter it next time . I thought at first I would set the pot to pot rope up as a one off but clearly not as it will alter . So if I use weights on the pot to pot rope they will need to be movable .

I am thinking one length of rope through all three pots . So it's reusable next time , if that makes sense

That makes sense to me. I'd be tempted to have my weights on a simple carabener and then a quick bight in the line where you want it and clip it on. When you are finished unclip and store weights in a bucket and rope will coil tidy again.

I've tried to draw out what I described earlier as I'm not sure how clear it was.

Figure 1a shows the effect of the depth on the distance between pots, 1b shows what happens if there is no weight on the between pots rope. 2a Was what I described earlier of a weight on the between pots line.

2b is a new problem for you! there was mention of 15ft down placing the weight. I think if you drop that in 20ft of water and the tide drops by 10ft the weight will be sat on the bottom with 15ft of loose line above it.which means about 5ft is spare, Thats 5ft of line that may be close to your prop on retrieval. So I think the weight needs to move. That got me thinking mathematically what that might look like and I came up with a few equations:

The data you need (in my opinion) is:
dmax - the maximum water depth you will be setting in at maximum tide height
dmin - the minimum water depth that you would expect the tide to drop to over your creels
C - the length of rope you plan to put between our creels (yes I've seen the above - but that does mean more buoys doesn't it!)
P - the distance below the water that you expect a propeller to be and so the distance you want any floating rope to be
dset - the depth you are setting in.

Once you have all of that, you need to decide how long your buoy to creel rope (B) will be. It must be greater than or equal to dmax.

Then you can work through the numbers - dmin will tell you where to put the weight. You may need a second weight if the answer is less than B you do.

Then calculate H and L. I suspect L will almost always be about 1/2 of C.

dmax and dmin are probably relatively difficult to know but if you are looking at a chart and thinking I wouldn't want to go any shallower than here - that will give you your dmin once you calculate out for tide heights. And the same for dmax - where is the furthest out you might go? Adjust that for high tide and make that dmax.

So then that only leaves dset. As you'll see its only used to calculate H and probably not that crucial...I'd suggest calculating the tide height for the spot height you used for dmax and dmin at roughly the time you plan to set them and see what it looks like as an answer.

I'm pretty sure someone will be along in a minute to say the pro's have never used an equation in their lives. But I suspect they may learn the results that the equation might give...

[stigoftd]

the ones i use are set to the deepest i will work them 100ft so riser line is 110ft and the same with joining line if ime setting in 50ft i just hank up the riser and cable tie off and re set the weight to the 15ft mark [where the hank is] i usualy set 2 - 3 a string if on sand [depending on tide run] if dropping singles i have always used a small bendy grappel anchor set 30 od ft behind the pot
weights i have a simple length of lead tube hammerd the end drilled hole and set a ss carbine in it
i like it simple all i need to do is load up and go and work the rest out off the fishfinder when ime at my chosen spot

[stevedonna]

Originally Posted by ShinyShoe

Oy! We can't all be hunky sportsmen you know...





That makes sense to me. I'd be tempted to have my weights on a simple carabener and then a quick bight in the line where you want it and clip it on. When you are finished unclip and store weights in a bucket and rope will coil tidy again.



I've tried to draw out what I described earlier as I'm not sure how clear it was.



Figure 1a shows the effect of the depth on the distance between pots, 1b shows what happens if there is no weight on the between pots rope. 2a Was what I described earlier of a weight on the between pots line.



2b is a new problem for you! there was mention of 15ft down placing the weight. I think if you drop that in 20ft of water and the tide drops by 10ft the weight will be sat on the bottom with 15ft of loose line above it.which means about 5ft is spare, Thats 5ft of line that may be close to your prop on retrieval. So I think the weight needs to move. That got me thinking mathematically what that might look like and I came up with a few equations:



The data you need (in my opinion) is:

dmax - the maximum water depth you will be setting in at maximum tide height

dmin - the minimum water depth that you would expect the tide to drop to over your creels

C - the length of rope you plan to put between our creels (yes I've seen the above - but that does mean more buoys doesn't it!)

P - the distance below the water that you expect a propeller to be and so the distance you want any floating rope to be

dset - the depth you are setting in.



Once you have all of that, you need to decide how long your buoy to creel rope (B) will be. It must be greater than or equal to dmax.



Then you can work through the numbers - dmin will tell you where to put the weight. You may need a second weight if the answer is less than B you do.



Then calculate H and L. I suspect L will almost always be about 1/2 of C.



dmax and dmin are probably relatively difficult to know but if you are looking at a chart and thinking I wouldn't want to go any shallower than here - that will give you your dmin once you calculate out for tide heights. And the same for dmax - where is the furthest out you might go? Adjust that for high tide and make that dmax.



So then that only leaves dset. As you'll see its only used to calculate H and probably not that crucial...I'd suggest calculating the tide height for the spot height you used for dmax and dmin at roughly the time you plan to set them and see what it looks like as an answer.



I'm pretty sure someone will be along in a minute to say the pro's have never used an equation in their lives. But I suspect they may learn the results that the equation might give...

Sorry fell asleep . It was before the last entry not during !! I am on iPad so will print your drawing and study accordingly .

Taking Alan's comments and yours which differ slightly I am thinking of perhaps setting heavy lobster pots on there own but perhaps my two creel ones together as they are lighter .

That way I get to try both methods .

Many thanks


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[stevedonna]

There were hunky good looking sporty types
Geeky swats
Good looking hunky sporty and clever
That leaves one category ....
Me


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[paintman]

Originally Posted by stigoftd

definatly a good point but if you drop one then drift drop no 2 then drift etc you shouldnt have much to worry about as the comercial guys are steaming off at 6 knots shooting 1/2 a mile of rope and 20 od pots each string but you can never be too cautious and always carry a divers knife when out alone
bait salted doggie - mackerel - gurnard left to go a bit pongy works a treat but fresh works well too
weight wise i usualy fit 2 big sash weights to each lengthways inside the pots but sounds like your already sorted

They do indeed, but you'll find that many smaller boats in use - esp those doing it small scale & those fishing for personal use - still shoot by dropping manually over the side as they idle along. Always struck me as much more dangerous than shooting over stern chute which lets the pots shoot themselves.

Which reminds me, OP you need to check the shellfish laws in the area you intend to fish as the rules are very strict according to minimum sizes & maximum number per day you are allowed to land as an unregistered vessel. Berried female lobsters & those with a notch cut in the tail MUST be returned.

[stigoftd]

i believe it is 6 crab and 2 lobster a day round here [or it was the last time i checked] more than enough for personal consumption
no v notch lobsters and no burried lobster - crab and there is a min size of the carapace but that info differs location wise
all i do is keep the mahusive ones anything else gets put back
have you ever thaught of trying prawn pots ? its the next one i want to try for bait and eating

[stevedonna]

Originally Posted by paintman

They do indeed, but you'll find that many smaller boats in use - esp those doing it small scale & those fishing for personal use - still shoot by dropping manually over the side as they idle along. Always struck me as much more dangerous than shooting over stern chute which lets the pots shoot themselves.

Which reminds me, OP you need to check the shellfish laws in the area you intend to fish as the rules are very strict according to minimum sizes & maximum number per day you are allowed to land as an unregistered vessel. Berried female lobsters & those with a notch cut in the tail MUST be returned.

My understanding is all theory or rib net advice . But yes I am aware of two lobsters a day plus small and ladies back . What do you mean by buried lobsters ?

Never gave langoustine a thought in terms of size or amount . I think my green sense combined with it will take more calories to process it than I get from eating would result in me throwing small ones back .



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[Barrowboy]

Originally Posted by stevedonna

I know it must vary a lot but what sort of depth do you set the pots at


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As an ex WAFI I always used to find the 20m contour was the place that 'yacht traps' would normally be set.....

[gtb]

Originally Posted by stevedonna

What do you mean by buried lobsters ?

"Berried female lobsters"