Poole Harbour Prosecutions

[cgf10]

Whilst reading the Echo this morning, in amongst the drink drivers I noticed some successful prosecutions for speeding in the harbour. Three in one go is a lot, the total costs and fines are quite a lot so hopefully it will discourage and calm people down
In The Dock: 7 people who have appeared in court from Poole (From Bournemouth Echo)

[treerat]

Costs are more for speeding in the harbour than nicking loads of stuff and being locked up!

[bartiny]

TBH I am not surprised, whilst staying at Redcliffe farm for 2 weeks this September we did at least 6 return passages through the harbour, and the behavior of some was bordering on being reckless, at times it seemed like a free for all, I honestly thought that I had misunderstood the 10 knott limit.

I for one am pleased to see some action being taken against these knobs.

[Ovey]

I have no problem with speeding/reckless boat owners being fined. But why should a "traffic" offense covet a higher fine than burglary/robbery/etc?

It seems that the easy option in more cases is to go for the road-user (whether at sea or on land) as they must have more money because they own a boat/car, etc.

[PeterM]

I'm sure someone will correct me .....but I seem to recall the limit was introduced in response to an incident where large wash from a pasing vessel caused a chap to fall out of his tender and die.

Hence why the 'traffic offence' is regarded as serious ( oh and as boaters we are all minted aren't we ? )

To be fair and knowing the guys that 'enforce' the limits - they would rather have words than dish out fines ....

[Ovey]

But a speeding offense where the wash 'may' cause someone to fall out of their tender (I'm not belittling the incident, but it's hopefully unlikely to happen again), or somebody breaking into homes, rifling through belongings and taking what they want or even abusing someone in the process of taking what they want. I know which I would come down more harshly on!

[boristhebold]

I wish they would fine 10 times as many people, they could if they wanted to as there are plenty of oppourtunities. The problem is a lot of powerboat owners and some sailors dont know the rules of the road and dont bother finding out about the speed limits or dont think they will get court. Us who operate from Poole Harbour are constantly having issues with people who dont know the rules or the speed limits and it makes for a stressful day out. even in winter people think the relaxation of the 10 knot limit applies through the harbour entrance which it doesn't.

As to wash, yes a real pain if your doing 10 knots through harbour entrance and a large powerboat is doing 30knots, im surprised more people dont come to grief.

Nuff said, it will always be an issue.

[cgf10]

IIRC there was also a nasty ski boat accident which resulted in a boat getting T-boned and a death. After this they introduced the current speed limit

[bartiny]

Originally Posted by Ovey

I have no problem with speeding/reckless boat owners being fined. But why should a "traffic" offense covet a higher fine than burglary/robbery/etc?

It seems that the easy option in more cases is to go for the road-user (whether at sea or on land) as they must have more money because they own a boat/car, etc.

I think it is more to do with 'sending out a message' and 'making an example' to get irresponsible boaters to think twice.

[longjohn]

Originally Posted by PeterM

I'm sure someone will correct me .....but I seem to recall the limit was introduced in response to an incident where large wash from a pasing vessel caused a chap to fall out of his tender and die.

Hence why the 'traffic offence' is regarded as serious ( oh and as boaters we are all minted aren't we ? )

To be fair and knowing the guys that 'enforce' the limits - they would rather have words than dish out fines ....

Ironically many planning craft create less wash at speed on the plane, than they do off the plain (say at the harbour speed limit) pushing a wall of water in front of them!

[mick]

Originally Posted by longjohn

Ironically many planning craft create less wash at speed on the plane, than they do off the plain (say at the harbour speed limit) pushing a wall of water in front of them!

Mine makes a hell of a wash at low speed I always get told off when we go on Thames by the scullers

[diver 1]

Agree mine also makes a hell of a lot more wash / motion at 9/10 knots than on the plane at ~16 knots. But they need to set a defined rule which they have, otherwise it is a free for all.

[jyasaki]

Here in the US, speed restricted areas are generally 3 or 5 mph. The general catch-all is that a boater is responsible for any and all wake damage (assuming they can be caught.)

The 10 knot limit mentioned is a max limit; if your boat throws a wake at 10, you should be slowing down more (I'm sure this is going to generate a reaction...)


jky

[cptsideways]

As regulars, we tend to pootle on tickover, as at 10mph our makes a mountain of water to climb up & I reckon uses 3x times as much fuel at 10mph than 18mph its happy lowest planing speed.

Though from October-April there is no limit in the main channel is that still correct?

As for the fines, thats typical, low life scum drug dealers get £40 fines for dealing crack for their 10th offence. One speeding ticket gets you a £400 fine in Dorset anyway.

[Steve_B]

I was a witness to one of these incidents and I would not worry about the fines.
In this particular case, it was a large Sunseeker, travelling at about 14-16kts and creating wash bigger than the overfalls at Pevrill Ledge on the same day.
To my knowledge this threw several people on a commercial fishing vessel to be thrown on to the deck.
The helm and passengers on the Sunseeker were just waving and having a "party". I would have added a zero to his fine!!

[HughN]

Surely the fastest any craft should be travelling is the lower of either the speed limit or the speed at which its wash may be a problem to other users?

[Ovey]

I think the "No wake" sign (and limit based on this) would be a better angle to approach from?

[cgf10]

Originally Posted by Ovey

I think the "No wake" sign (and limit based on this) would be a better angle to approach from?

I agree, I don't know how some paddleboarders manage to stay on sometimes

[ShinyShoe]

No wake really hard to prosecute. What is excessive wake? Even a canoe will leave a little wake in calm water but not one which is excessive.

The fines themselves are not excessive £200-£250. If you get caught speeding in a car, have a job so can reasonably afford to pay, and end up in court, and plead not-guilty you should expect to pay at least that much if found guilty. At least 1 case didn't bother to turn up to court. Bear in mind that they can't give you points and tot you in a boat so the discouragement may need to be higher?

The sting in the tail is the costs part. I assume they are high because the enforcer (Harbour Authority) is allowed to recover some of their costs of policing the speed limit. I think those costs are different from it the CPS brought the case. I dont know if there is an option for a straight fine like in your car before going to court. If so that would be a fixed fee and no costs...

Fines are based on ability to pay.

If you took the story based on whats in the paper these guys were caught speeding like you or I might get caught by a speed camera. We know thats not how it works in harbours. You get caught, bollocked, a record kept, caught again the same day or give them lip then you get fined. Maybe even multiple bollockings first unless you are driving like a tw@t.

Look at the other cases - a guy sent a text to a girl, went to her house, phoned her up and hung around outside and at one point followed her in (bet you could say you thought you were invited in...) - thats half the spotty teenagers in the land. = Six weeks in prison (suspended).

You'd need to be in court to know what really happened and see if these were excessive...