Red Diesel

Chris Murray · 19 June 2005, 12:58

I have copied this from the RYA site:

"To extend the derogation for a further period, the UK Government must inform the European Commission and provide information in support in the first half of 2005.

The Commission will consider the request and must, within three months of its receipt, either present a proposal for authorisation of an extension by the European Council, or inform the Council of the reasons why it has not proposed such authorisation. The initial focus must therefore be to ensure the UK Government takes appropriate action to secure the derogation. "

Does anyone know if the UK Government has taken action yet?

After the end of this month, it looks like it will be too late.

Chris.

eupa · 19 June 2005, 13:33

I think chris - this is double talk..

There are directives established by Brussels ( perhaps the only good thing they have ever done)- clearly stating that excise duty, is ONLY applicable to road transport. It means that no excise duty is applicable on gas used for boats (pleasure) , mowing machines, hedge trimmers ect ( will have to look the directive up).

The problem SHOULD not exist as regards red diesel for boats as there are fuel pumps selling the stuff all over the place - and if the worst comes to the worse you can use heating oil ( if you send me a private mail - will tell you how to get rid of **********in red. The problme lies with gasoline. as there are very few outlets in marinas- and if there were to sell excise free gas-you could be sure that they would have a whole squad of cutoms gits on site everty minute to see if it did in fact go into boats and not cars.

Farmers are allowed to use red diesel and you can bet your bottom dollar where some of the red diesel ends up....

Jonathan

Chris Murray · 19 June 2005, 19:47

Thanks for your comments Jonathan.

I am really in two minds about which engine - Etec or diesel.

I can't help thinking that diesel engine prices will plummet AFTER I have bought my boat. After all, car prices don't vary much between petrol and diesel engines.

I do like the "umph" that petrol gives and - as I shall be towing my boat - I shouldn't have to pay marina prices for petrol too often. On the other hand, even if fuel prices were the same, there's no doubt that diesel goes quite a bit further ...

Regards,

Chris.

Rob Jones · 20 June 2005, 09:56

an article in Rib and sports boat mag this month indicated that an atlantic 21 fitted with a diesel engine would have a cruising range of circa 75nm on a full tank (cant recall the tank size) costing around £20.

Is this possible??

A 75nm trip in my boat would cost around £180.

Not sure if my engine is in dire need of a service or that I read the article wrong.

Scary Des · 20 June 2005, 10:56

A bit strange because I thought that the Artic is an outboard only rib

but if it was a pacific 22 (from the same stable)it would use about 1 litre per NM and at 0.32 p per litre it is not far off

Des

eupa · 20 June 2005, 11:07

I am really in two minds about which engine - Etec or diesel.

Its really your choice and nobody can really advise you.
Look at this way- 95% of all outboards are gasoline, while 95 % of all Inboards are Diesel.( give or take a few%'s) and all things being equal the choice goes down to where are your putting your engine. In our case - we needed all the free deck-place possible - so the engines ended up outside the boat (i,e outboards) and we needed powerful engines at the same time.

Nobody has yet managed to produce a good outboard diesel more than 80 hp-perhaps yanmar... but there are horror stories abound on this.
Motors for boats is dominated by the US market and the question of diesel vs gasoline doesnt even come into the arguement. In Europe- we are always looking for the "cheap" solution because we get taken to the cleaners taxwise
everytime .

As regards boats --- I think its best to close your eyes as regards costs and ask yourself " where do I get the most enjoyment.??" Nothing beats hearing 2* 200 yams going from idle up to 2500- it just sends shudders to the yacht types

jonathan

JIY · 20 June 2005, 17:02

A day trip from my home port of Troon, to Tarbert (Loch Fyne) and return via Kyles of Bute is about 75nm. Fuel used at 31knots is usually about 72 litres (slight seas) , so at 42 pence/litre my day's fuel cost is about £30.

I guess £25 in the smaller engined Pacific is therefore possible.

Pete7 · 20 June 2005, 18:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Jones

A 75nm trip in my boat would cost around £180.
Not sure if my engine is in dire need of a service or that I read the article wrong.

Rob, thats £2.40 per mile

think it needs a service.

Rob Jones · 21 June 2005, 08:57

What would you suggest?

A service or engine tune up?

I just replaced the gearbox oil myself last month, reading a previous thread it would appear a service is just the gear box, plugs, and a carb clean.

I have just sent my propeller into Steel Developments for a refurb.

I am so frustrated as every time I take th boat out it costs me a fortune. The tank holds 100l of fuel - I would be lucky to get 40nm out of it. As I'm new to this game I figured that it was normal. Then I discover a diesel would do 75nm for £20.

From what I can gather people seem to be getting 1nm per litre - which would have meant I could have gone to the Scillies and back on 1 fill (100l) instead of the 300l.

All advice much appreciated

Pete7 · 21 June 2005, 09:12

Which engine have your got, is it the 115 4 cyl 2 stoke ? if so they weren't the best engines mercury ever came up with, but you ought to manage about the 1lpm rather than 2.5 lpm.

That petrol is going somewhere, so leaky fuel pump ? or carbs, fuel lines etc. Probably worth a trip to the dealer to solve this one, with a full service to include timming and compression check etc. It should pay for itself very quickly.

JIY, the Pacific does approximately 1 lpm, @ 25 ppl

so thats the Scillies and back for £20 (sorry Rob)

Pete

Rob Jones · 21 June 2005, 09:24

Reckon I will get it into to Pacer Marine next month.

JIY · 21 June 2005, 14:24

25 pence/litre Pete

...hold the pump, i'm on my way down!!!

Andy Gee · 22 June 2005, 08:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by JIY

25 pence/litre Pete

...hold the pump, i'm on my way down!!!

Me too

Just got todays prices in from Highland Fuels @ 31.9p trade based on 10000ltrs

Andy

JIY · 22 June 2005, 11:01

Andy, I'd have to carry a few extra cans to hold 10000 litres!

Andy Gee · 22 June 2005, 13:14

me too!! its for the work, but gives an indication of prices and we use that every other week. Filled up at kip for 35p inc VAT and 32p inc at Campbeltown a few weeks past. For the first time ever I think its cheaper at the marinas athan the wholesalers!!

Andy