RYA VHF Radio Course Now Takes 2 Days

[jlandells]

I took my course last month. Sadly, the school insist they've sent the paperwork off, but the RYA insist they haven't received it! Hope this doesn't mean I end up having to sit the new format tests in the new year...!

[Ribochet]

Originally Posted by Snakedoctor

The length of this course is one day in the Netherlands. Guess RYA decides the duration not the EU.

Hi Snakedoctor

Welcome to RIBnet

Maybe you want to read the following document and review your post

HARMONISED CEPT TRAINING PROCEDURES FOR THE SHORT RANGE CERTIFICATE (SRC) FOR GMDSS non-SOLAS VESSELS.

In particular paragaph 2.1: Course instruction time may be accomplished by self-study, formal training, or a combination of these and total study time is reccommended to be at least 10 hours.
.

[willk]

Originally Posted by Ribochet

The RYA is not to blame for this one - indeed they have kept it simple for years .

The reason for the changes are that a number of the EU countries don’t accept the UK SRC as it currently does not comply with European Conference of Postal and Telecommunications Administrations (CEPT) requirements for course length and examination.

The SRC here has been two days for a long time. You cover a lot of theory and SAR related stuff as well as the basics and some practical stuff. They're not teaching you how to use a VHF, they're training you to be part of a global network

[lakelandterrier]

Originally Posted by willk

The SRC here has been two days for a long time. You cover a lot of theory and SAR related stuff as well as the basics and some practical stuff. They're not teaching you how to use a VHF, they're training you to be part of a global network

I'd say most people don't want to be "part of a global network" they want to be able to communicate legally, with confidence, when the need arises. I fail to see what logic says 10 hours is the minimum to operate a push to talk button, send a mayday / panpan etc understand what channels to use / not use and theoretically learn basic VP. Isn't that what the real need is?

[willk]

Originally Posted by lakelandterrier

I fail to see what logic says 10 hours is the minimum to operate a push to talk button, send a mayday / panpan etc understand what channels to use / not use and theoretically learn basic VP. Isn't that what the real need is?

Maybe if you'd done the full two day course, you'd have a better appreciation of it's value...

[ashbypower]

Clearly there are people with very different abilities and not ALL pay scant regard to there knowledge and or ability. Only saturday I had on a SRC course 2 very well educated people, both Dr's ... Their end of course feedback form comments were :
A great day, learnt a lot and I am leaving with a far greater Knowledge and very much more confident in the use of radio... One also commented a longer time using the radio would have been nice.......They usually have around 3.5 - 4 hrs !!!!

[ShinyShoe]

Originally Posted by lakelandterrier

I'd say most people don't want to be "part of a global network"

No-one wants to be part of it. Its not like facebook - you don't choose to be part of it - if you transmit on the network you MUST be part of it. But if my life depends on someone receiving my mayday via a relay station I'd be kind of hopeful that the relay station was trained to be part of that global network rather than a Sunday boater who didn't bother learning what he was doing. Its not quite as simple as re-tweeting!

Likewise I'd prefer that I don't get overspoken either by a well meaning 'relayer' or by someone who didn't think they needed to listen to 16 before pressing the PTT

[Poly]

Originally Posted by lakelandterrier

I'd say most people don't want to be "part of a global network" they want to be able to communicate legally, with confidence, when the need arises. I fail to see what logic says 10 hours is the minimum to operate a push to talk button, send a mayday / panpan etc understand what channels to use / not use and theoretically learn basic VP. Isn't that what the real need is?

Actually my biggest criticism of the (existing) training was that it focussed far too much on the stuff you mention and not enough on the 'value' that VHF could bring to my everyday boating.

I wonder if anyone will use the 1.5 days VHF and add in another 0.5 day of wider "safety" stuff? Many people don't have a liferaft, and aren't planning long offshore cruises so the full sea survival course might be overkill but added to the VHF course you could cover a wider range of safety stuff that would be useful to many.

[Dirk Diggler]

Originally Posted by Poly

Actually not enough on the 'value' that VHF could bring to my everyday boating.

??? How many "radio checks" does one man need?

[Poly]

Originally Posted by Dirk Diggler

??? How many "radio checks" does one man need?

radio checks WERE covered on the course, can't say it was a particular highlight of the course!

Here are some of the features of modern VHF/DSC that I'd like to have been covered. I did ask the instructor but other than acknowledging that "some radios have those capabilities" he didn't seem to know:

- position polling: one of the more common routine radio calls between vessels is to try and meet up / find each other. Position polling can help.

- group calling: again potentially useful for coordinating "flotillas". Nobody could tell me if it was a good idea (or not) to put all the UK CG's in one group and group call them rather than worrying about which was the closest station - especially since I frequently boat near a boundary (Belfast - Stornoway).

In addition we didn't spend any appreciable time on possibly the most common call that people will make to the CG - reporting in with passage plans. So whilst I can tell you exactly what the CG expect to hear in a distress or urgency situation - I still don't really know the expected format of a good 'transit report'.

I realise quality varies with instructor but the emphasis was very much on its distress use (which is only emphasises by all the other GMDSS stuff like EPIRBs that is covered). I expected some guidance on when I should be calling VTS and what I might expect to tell them (or hear on a listening watch that might be useful).

In addition I think some of my cohort may have benefited from actually plotting the positions that they "overheard" on their simulated calls, and from going from a chart position to distress call rather than a set of coordinates.

I think probably more could have been made of VHF weather forecasts and subfax (or is it subfacts?) broadcasts which are routinely made. Yes they are common sense but I'd hazard a guess that >1/2 the people on my course didn't really understand them.

[SPR]

lol - Poly - you did your course before Clyde closed down - if I am not wrong ! so your question was NOT a question!

but ...

group calling - you can't physically add stations to Group - A Group MMSI is issued from ofcom and each radio is programmed with that number to be part of the group.

So to answer your question - you can't add the all coastguards to a group. For this to happen the coastguard would have to be part of a group in first place that Ofcom had issued , by entering thud group number into there radios and you had to call them a pre-determined group number.

transit report -

by voice

A.

whatever coastguard , whatever coastguard
this is your name , your name
routine
over

the coastguard will tell you to go to 67 and standby
you say going to 67 and standing by...

move to ch 6 7

B.

wait till coastguard to call you

Whatever coastguard , your name

just letting you we have x number people in board, we are going to x or doing y we expect to be off the water by time , you hold my cg66 over

they will acknowledge you tell you let them know when off water and have a nice day over

then I would say will do - thanks - listening to ch 1 6 - out

wait few seconds then go back to 16

if using DSC - place individual call to coastguard and they will switch you to working ch usually 67 automatically. then follow above B.


Hope I not missed anything - typing on iPhone lol!

S.

[Trimix]

Interesting reading this thread, Im about to do the course in a couple of weeks. Hopefully it will answer the questions raised.

Ive got the radio, just need an antenna and then Im ready for it.

How do you get your MMSI number, do you have to send off your cert. once you have passed the course ?

[Ribochet]

Originally Posted by Trimix

How do you get your MMSI number, do you have to send off your cert. once you have passed the course ?

You will get your Radio licence from Ofcom

Ofcom | Ship

No you do not need a Short Range Certificate to get a Radio licence

[chris.moody]

If using DSC to call the coastguard they will switch you to their working channel. At that point I would call them again on the new channel, not wait for them calling me. Should I wait for them to call me?

Never actually called the coastguard (CG) via DSC as I always use a marina (or Portsmouth QHM, or another boat) for a radio check. It seems wrong to tie up the CG on a routine call if you are calling someone else anyway, and can just ask them at the end of the call if your "transmissions are good and readable".

--
Tigga - Avon SR4 Rescue with 40hp Yamaha 2 stroke

[John Kennett]

Does anyone actually regularly use DSC? We've had a RIBnet group MMSI for the best part of a decade but as far as I know it has never been used by anyone. Maybe there are enough DSC radios out there to make it worthwhile now?

http://www.rib.net/forum/f27/ribnet-...bers-8943.html

[donegaldan]

Originally Posted by chris.moody

If using DSC to call the coastguard they will switch you to their working channel. At that point I would call them again on the new channel, not wait for them calling me. Should I wait for them to call me?

Never actually called the coastguard (CG) via DSC as I always use a marina (or Portsmouth QHM, or another boat) for a radio check. It seems wrong to tie up the CG on a routine call if you are calling someone else anyway, and can just ask them at the end of the call if your "transmissions are good and readable".

Just a quick heads up on the test procedure for radio check.
It is recommended that you carry it out to the CG, firstly on Low power and if unsuccessful, High power.

There are a number of reasons that we to test to CG,
1. Its the CG that your will want to reach when you are in trouble, not an adjacent craft - Mayday relays get messy when unnecessary.
2. CG record correspondance, so in adherence to your ships licence, you are recorded as carrying out your radio test (you still record on your ships radio log)
3. The CG can be busy, and be sympathetic if you hear they are busy, but Radio Checks are part of their remit, and don't feel like your routine calls are a hindrance, Routine calls including filing a TR are the bread and butter of CGs

Now, I appreciate you are probably in much busier waters than I, and that radio chatter can get quite busy, and also in the event of an incident that you may be surrounded by other craft to offer assistance. But under the european CEPT radio licence, the CG are who we carry out radio tests to.

DSC wise, I know over here there is very little use of it by mariners, but we still instruct people to use it, integral part of the VHF SRC 2 course, and I gotta say, big fan of the instructions "If donegaldan falls out, press and hold the red distress button" !
I know the CG will move you to a working channel after calling them using DSC, but you at least have verified the digital component of your radio, thus testing it fully.

But if you get tied up in all the rules and regs you could kill a whole day testing

[donegaldan]

Originally Posted by John Kennett

Does anyone actually regularly use DSC? We've had a RIBnet group MMSI for the best part of a decade but as far as I know it has never been used by anyone. Maybe there are enough DSC radios out there to make it worthwhile now?

http://www.rib.net/forum/f27/ribnet-...bers-8943.html

The position Poll feature is quite neat, if you are in the same stretch of water, and want to know where your buddy is... Saves calling it out over the radio, and if automatic response is setup his set will just respond, can be nice and quick to find a buddy in a busy bay.

Also BIG fan of the the "Distress button" for visitors aboard my craft...
If anything should happen me.....

[willk]

Originally Posted by donegaldan

Also BIG fan of the the "Distress button" for visitors aboard my craft...
If anything should happen me.....

I'm not convinced that red button will be much use for a coma induced by a surfeit of sandwiches, crisps and venison burgers...

[donegaldan]

Originally Posted by willk

I'm not convinced that red button will be much use for a coma induced by a surfeit of sandwiches, crisps and venison burgers...

Now you can't beat a good old "bambi" burger from Jura....
Especially if she comes off a BBQ after being at sea all day

[Ribochet]

Originally Posted by donegaldan

Just a quick heads up on the test procedure for radio check.
It is recommended that you carry it out to the CG, firstly on Low power and if unsuccessful, High power.

There are a number of reasons that we to test to CG,
1. Its the CG that your will want to reach when you are in trouble, not an adjacent craft - Mayday relays get messy when unnecessary.
2. CG record correspondance, so in adherence to your ships licence, you are recorded as carrying out your radio test (you still record on your ships radio log)
3. The CG can be busy, and be sympathetic if you hear they are busy, but Radio Checks are part of their remit, and don't feel like your routine calls are a hindrance, Routine calls including filing a TR are the bread and butter of CGs

Now, I appreciate you are probably in much busier waters than I, and that radio chatter can get quite busy, and also in the event of an incident that you may be surrounded by other craft to offer assistance. But under the european CEPT radio licence, the CG are who we carry out radio tests to.

DSC wise, I know over here there is very little use of it by mariners, but we still instruct people to use it, integral part of the VHF SRC 2 course, and I gotta say, big fan of the instructions "If donegaldan falls out, press and hold the red distress button" !
I know the CG will move you to a working channel after calling them using DSC, but you at least have verified the digital component of your radio, thus testing it fully.

But if you get tied up in all the rules and regs you could kill a whole day testing

Great post Dan

Once again this shows the important of listening to the advice of an "expert" which you clearly are