Solent Hazards

matiboy · 04 March 2003, 19:08

Would welcome some advise on cruising around Solent area, usually only do Warsash to Cowes / Osborne area, longest trip was to Yarmouth / Needles.

Seem to manage to miss Warsash spit, Bramble bank and Calshot spit probably more by luck than judgement and getting away with it for last 10 years

As well as physical obsticals interested to hear of cetain dangerous tide/wind combinations in certain areas which are notorious and best avoided

Even on Sunday afternoon wind died off to leave a very flat looking Solent so nipped over to Cowes briefly, one minute flat next you hit some tide against wave/wind giving a quite eery short steep wave

many people say the Solent is sheltered I actually think it has some peculiar waves (further confused by jet ferry wash) and can get quite rough ?

Any other definate No No's I should know about

Ribald · 04 March 2003, 19:50

Matiboy,

If you are coming from Bembridge round to Ryde watch out for the Ryde Sands. Have a look on the chart to see what I mean.

It's not only yachties that get caught out there - I've seen a few ribs as well

and if you're going at speed, much damage could ensue

Richard B · 04 March 2003, 19:54

Matiboy, I've got a copy of the Video "Solent Hazards" (well, it's two videos actually)...

I'ts an aerial view of all the hazards with some great footage of people hitting some of them! (oops, sorry if anyone was the yachtie who spectacularly hit the ledge just off the needles!).

Send me a PM if you want to borrow it.

matiboy · 04 March 2003, 20:07

Yep found them ( Ryde Sands ) fortunately was at anchor, came back from fish and chips to find someone had pulled the plug out, gave me a few more hours to sightsee Ryde though

Aging Youth · 04 March 2003, 21:01

Hi Matiboy,

If you venture further East towards Langstone Harbour watch out for the East/West Winner Sand Banks. These banks can catch out the unlucky few each and every year.

Also don't forget the submarine blocks just east of South Parade Pier they are very large concrete blocks laid for about a mile offshore with navigation gates spaced at intervals.

Further East towards Chichester Harbour big Sand Bar at Entrance, can be extremely rough at times.

If I am running around a low tide I stay at least a mile off just playing it safe & keep my sounder on at all times.

Hope this helps you.

Richard B · 04 March 2003, 21:15

Matiboy - your PM box is full! (And out of idle curiosity, how many PMs can you get before it fills up?)

Also I'll state the absolutely obvious... The Submarine barrier. (Anyone know how deep underwater it it?)

matiboy · 04 March 2003, 21:20

will empty mailbox rapidly !!!

had 47 sent items and about 30 received

I guess its best practice to not save a copy of your messages sent and delete unimportant ones sent

Andy · 05 March 2003, 00:33

Hazards in the Portsmouth area from Hayling/Bemberidge to Gilkicker Point/Ryde

Area hazards

Shipping

The entire area of operation is used continuously by shipping of all types. Large shipping remains within the shipping lanes marked by Bouyage. Small boats will use the entire solent

The small ships lane for Portsmouth harbour is on the Port side as you enter.

Within Portsmouth Harbour stay clear of Navy vessels
Within Portsmouth Harbour watch for the green Gosport Ferries that run across the harbour constantly, and move quickly.

Camber dock, the location of the Primary Slipway in Portsmouth is also the mooring point for the Isle of White car ferries, which enter/leave the dock regularly. These ferries cause wash with their bow thrusters that can push a boat off course easily. Signs that they are about to move are: bow thruster activity, no mooring lines and the ships captain standing on the side bridge looking at the surrounding waters.

Large tankers passing through the Solent to and from Southampton. Appropriate clearance should be given.

Fast hovercrafts run regularly between Southsea beach and Ryde

Others

Hamilton Bank – gets very shallow although rarely dries. Large craft will avoid crossing it, don’t get in their way.

West of Portsmouth Harbour a post shows the limit of the submerged structure of HMS Dolphin.

Unlit yellow bouys off Spit Bank Fort mark the Mary Rose stay 300m clear.

Horse Sand Barrier – Sub Marine Barrier: runs between Horse Sand Fort and Southsea beach just east of Southsea Pier. This is made of submerged concrete blocks marked by posts. They are visible when the tide is low and can damage a boat if run over at all states of tide. Pass through the barrier at either the inner or outer passages which are marked by port and starboard post marks.

A long thin spit called the Debnigo extends like a snake from Puckpool point to No Man’s Land Fort, this should be avoided.

Ryde sands: These extend some way out to sea and gets very shallow or can dry in parts. The extent of the hazard is marked by posts.

Fishermen: The solent is a popular shore fishing site. Keep an eye out for lines, especially entering or exiting Portsmouth Harbour, or around Southsea beach and Gilkicker Point.

Tides and Weather

The Solent is subject to strong tides, especially in the mouths of either Portsmouth of Langstone Harbours. At times large standing waves can be seen it both entrances and can easily knock a boat to one side or overturn small craft.

Tide, wind and shallow conditions can result in some large chop making the Solent a hostile place. This chop can be disturbed and difficult to read. Care should be taken when the chop combines with the wake from a passing ferry, as this makes conditions more extreme. However if you hug the coastline calm conditions can normally be found, but watch for grounding near the shore.

Hope this helps

matiboy · 05 March 2003, 10:08

Quote:

Originally posted by Andy
Tide, wind and shallow conditions can result in some large chop making the Solent a hostile place. This chop can be disturbed and difficult to read. Care should be taken when the chop combines with the wake from a passing ferry, as this makes conditions more extreme. However if you hug the coastline calm conditions can normally be found, but watch for grounding near the shore.

Would agree with you on this point in a 5 metre rib some of these sudden wave formations can be quite alarming. Rember once cutting across Calshot spit at high water, wont do that again hit sudden short steep waves which werent pleasant

Have also experienced wind against tide coming in and out of langstone on a dart catamaran, the hulls were permantly underwater because of huge rolling waves

You would have thought the council would do something about these waves !! We dont expect potholes on our roads.

Never having gone offshore at all or behind the Island would I be right in saying that the waves would develop more of a regular pattern possibly with a larger swell ?

Alan Priddy · 05 March 2003, 12:55

The best thing for you to do is find someone who knows the area well and ask them to take you for ride in your boat. As others have said, there are many hazards in the Solent but if the raggies can do it so can you. Alan P

Andy · 05 March 2003, 13:17

The back of the Wight has the potential of large rolling waves from the S, SW which are far easiler to read, however there are areas of disturbance around St Catherines Pont and St Catherines deep. The tide causes some fun conditions, especially if the wind is Easterly or Westerly.

Also as I said earlier that hugging the coast in the Solent can help but at times you can get wave reflection off the shore that hits the oncoming waves and that can be very interesting. The best place I have seen that is off Gosport in a SE wind.

As Alan said it's all manageable if you have the correct boat, good wet weather gear and use the throttle to match the conditions. It's all these conditons that make the Solent interesting and a great playground to learn. People slag the Solent, but its a great place with a massive variety of stuff to see and do.

Then for the real fun, night work adds another great dimension and skills challange. The eastern Solent is very well lit in terms of bouyage and light from the shore. The Western Solent becomes very dark as there are much less light sources.

Peter J · 24 September 2004, 20:35

Can I resurect this thread from 18 months ago to ask..........

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy

Hazards in the Portsmouth area from Hayling/Bemberidge to Gilkicker Point/Ryde

Horse Sand Barrier – Sub Marine Barrier: runs between Horse Sand Fort and Southsea beach just east of Southsea Pier. This is made of submerged concrete blocks marked by posts. They are visible when the tide is low and can damage a boat if run over at all states of tide. Pass through the barrier at either the inner or outer passages which are marked by port and starboard post marks.

Has each block got a post that is visible at high tide? Can you always see enough to pass between them or should you always take the Boat Passages what ever the tide? Do Jet skiers use them as a slalom course?

robin · 24 September 2004, 20:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter J

Can I resurect this thread from 18 months ago to ask..........

Has each block got a post that is visible at high tide? Nope
Can you always see enough to pass between them Nope or should you always take the Boat Passages what ever the tide? Yup, most advisable

All very clearly marked on the appropriate chart (recommended reading)

Robin

Andy · 24 September 2004, 22:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter J

Has each block got a post that is visible at high tide? Can you always see enough to pass between them or should you always take the Boat Passages what ever the tide? Do Jet skiers use them as a slalom course?

Use the boat channels, they are easy to see and dont take you out of your way.

Simon Hawkins · 24 September 2004, 23:04

If you are mainly concerned with central solent ie. southampton water to cowes then be careful of shipping as their are many single screw ships that do not have much manourveribilty.

With regards to sea conditions the solent is a tricky piece of water. If you have a spring tide against a force 4 plus then the sea state can become very choppy with the frequency between waves being short and sea becomes very confused especially when their is lots of traffic.

Areas to be careful of in this area of the solent is Calshot Spit, Prince consort and egypt point as the tides run very strong in these areas and when the wind is against them then you will get high crests usually breaking.

Another point worth noting is If you decide to venture out to the needle through hurst straights and the tide is with the wind it will seem nice and calm. If the tide then turns while you are out their then hurst is not a place to be if you and your crew are not competant in rough water. Therefore plan your trip so that you get the tides and winds correct.

Simon

Pete7 · 24 September 2004, 23:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter J

Has each block got a post that is visible at high tide? Can you always see enough to pass between them or should you always take the Boat Passages what ever the tide? Do Jet skiers use them as a slalom course?

Nope, only the ends are obvious, one is a fort and the other the beach. the sub marine barrier has a bend in it near the fort. Each block is about the size of a rib with a similar size gap in between but its very rare to be able to see them. Use the channel about half way if you want to cross the barrier. Did put some divers on them but it wasn't up to much.

Pete

timboli · 25 September 2004, 07:56

With regard to the needles,conditions in the needles channel can be very bad in a strong south westerly.A 36 foot sailing boat from Fairview Sailing was overcome there in February 97,it was found drifting dismasted in the Solent with the remainder of the crew in a bad state,3 died.
I have been told that if conditions are bad,the inshore passage hugging Hurst Castle should be used.

Simon Hawkins · 25 September 2004, 21:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by timboli

With regard to the needles,conditions in the needles channel can be very bad in a strong south westerly.A 36 foot sailing boat from Fairview Sailing was overcome there in February 97,it was found drifting dismasted in the Solent with the remainder of the crew in a bad state,3 died.
I have been told that if conditions are bad,the inshore passage hugging Hurst Castle should be used.

That is correct but if the conditions at the needles are that bad then Hurst will be bad aswell. If going through hurst then do not go too close to the mainland side as their are some shallows know as the trap.

Simon

tim griffin · 26 September 2004, 08:40

All the replies are very good and highlight areas in the Solent that are dangerous in certain sea conditions, a basic navigation course ie Dayskipper will teach you how to read a chart and passage planning , pilotage ,shapes and symbols along with chart work courses to steer and so on and the most important one tides the book by Peter Bruce SOLENT HAZARDS is excellent,
better still would be to invest in some training a level 2 course would be a excellent starting point and cruising in company another option if you are reluctant to undertake training lots of people have benifited from this, as it adds confidence and a good social outing Richard and Louise and also the Jackeens seem to be the main organisers of such events and are very nice friendly people. Please dont take this post the wrong way i am not having a go at you re your question but just feel that you would enjoy your boating if you had a bit better knowlege and you would get more enjoyment from it.
regards Tim
www.griffmarineservices.co.uk

Peter J · 26 September 2004, 12:19

Tim,

I have got Peter Bruce's book and have got RYA level 2 and have been thwarted twice from having a cruise with Louise & Richard. I will get there one day!

I fancied a trip out to the forts some time and the book, being really written for yotties, wasn't too clear if a shallow draughted motor boat need worry about the barrier, hence the question to the forum. I just wanted to be sure how to plan my route.

This forum is great because it answers questions that you didn't ask but when you see the answers your realise you should have. (eg the hurst castle/needles stuff - I was planning a trip out there too.)

Peter.