Suspension Seating

[Hightower]

Trouble is Mat, you'd think someone was sitting on him if spacehoppers where used .

[John Kennett]

Originally Posted by Hightower

So how much movement should a seat have? 200mm?

There seem to be two approaches to suspension seating: the Ullman-style jockey seats, or more conventional bucket seats.

For jockey seats then long travel might be important so that you can still use your legs to assist. With bucket seats I'm not convinced that long travel suspension is important though (in fact it might even be a hindrance), providing there the suspension efficiently absorbs the impact energy.

A completely different approach might be to incorporate something like Sorbothane or Astrosorb as used in Forcefield Body Armour into the seat mountings.

John

[Hightower]

Or even use Engine mountings to mount the seat base to, will give about 5mm of movement.

Like these:
http://www.tradekey.com/product_view/id/43006.htm

[Martin]

Thanks for all of the replies some really useful comments

I also found these, similar thing to what has been mentioned

http://www.capitalseating.co.uk/prod...&appid=46&rid=

The bucket seats are presently pedestal mounted so I am wondering whether anybody makes a replacement pedestal part which contains some form of damping arrangement.

Martin

[Martin]

Something like this

http://ridesoftly.com/default.htm

Martin

[jwalker]

Originally Posted by John Kennett

....With bucket seats I'm not convinced that long travel suspension is important though (in fact it might even be a hindrance), providing there the suspension efficiently absorbs the impact energy.

Would you like to explain your reasoning, JK?

[John Kennett]

I'm thinking mainly of race-type seats in a fast boat, but it may apply in other cases too. I'd want to keep my body in a fairly consistent position relative to the controls and not be bouncing wildly up and down. If the energy can be effectively absorbed with the minimum of vertical travel, then so much the better.

Of course this opens up the discussion to how long is long, and how fast is fast.

Long travel suspension is important in cars and bikes that go over rough terrain because they need to keep the wheels in contact with the ground. I'm not sure that the same principles apply to boat seats.

What fundamental benefits do you see in long suspension travel for seats?

John

[John Kennett]

Originally Posted by Clive

sorry i didnt get time to mess with my tractor today. had to ride a horse.
its my job. i will try again tomorrow but trust me its the same seat.
it has an adjustable damper and about 8 inches of forward/backward movement wish i had kept the box.
i have found the invoice and it was closer to 60 quid and it didnt fall off any lorrys.
and it stands up very well to the weather (no cab on that tractor) after 5 years use it looks the same as th day i put it on

I don't think a tractor seat is likely to be suitable for two reasons: the shock loading from a powerboat banging into a head sea is going to be very different to a tractor bumping over a field; also something that withstands the weather in normal use often fares much less well when exposed salt water.

At that price it would probably be worth someone giving it a try though.

John

[John Kennett]

Originally Posted by Martin

However I want to replace the bucket seat with some form of suspension seat. I am aware of Ullman Jockeys which I am sure are very effective and equally as expensive.

Are there any alternatives to consider, if not I will bite the bullet and buy an Ullman seat if it keeps her safe from injury.

Whilst it's good to see that more options are appearing on the market, going back to your specific application I would be very wary of most of them as they do little more than lull you into a false sense of security. They might be useful for a bit of added comfort, but I wouldn't want to rely on them in your situation.

Assuming your wife is generally fit, then the most practical answer would probably be to fit jockey seats and for your wife to stand up rather than sit at all. If that's not an acceptable option, then I'd suggest the Ullman seats (actually I'd probably suggest seriously considering whether a RIB was actually a good idea).

Bucket seats with suspension may seem to be a good idea, but if they work well then you will tend to use the boat harder, because it's fun. At the point where you come off a wave just that bit harder than the suspension can handle, a damaged back is going to become very vulnerable.

Not knowing the details of you wife's back condition, I would definitely suggest that you get medical advice on what the likely outcome of a harder than planned landing might be, and take that into account too.

John

[Hightower]

Originally Posted by John Kennett

Of course this opens up the discussion to how long is long, and how fast is fast.

Long travel suspension is important in cars and bikes that go over rough terrain because they need to keep the wheels in contact with the ground. I'm not sure that the same principles apply to boat seats.

So you don't think it's important to keep ones backside in contact with the seat at all time then?

My the way John, I thought I'd tell you. Martin hasn't got a RIB, it's a largish Cruiser. I think the Ideal solution for Martin would be to try the tractor seat bases that Clice can supply. At £60 it's a cheap enough gamble. I for one would be interested if it works.

[jwalker]

Originally Posted by John Kennett

I'd want to keep my body in a fairly consistent position relative to the controls and not be bouncing wildly up and down.

I've used my seats for a couple of years and I consider them to be far better than jockey seats.

They need to be set firm enough that the suspension doesn't compress for normal sitting weight nor does it move for smallish waves.

There is no sensation of bouncing wildly up and down. The boat comes up and you stay put, the boat falls and you stay put so the occupant's ride is more level than the boat's ride. There is much less movement relative to the controls than you get on jockey seats where you are located only by your knees. I do feel though that a harness is a very worthwhile addition to the seat to restrain your torso from fore and aft movement. The sort of movement where, when standing at a jockey seat, you might risk coming into contact with the boat's structure.

If the energy can be effectively absorbed with the minimum of vertical travel, then so much the better.

My choosing to fit suspension seats was driven by the same reasons as Martin has for his enquiry, namely, I wanted to continue boating. In a well supported sitting position the load is distributed over a reasonable area of your lower body and your back is held in a good position for carrying the loading from the upper part of your body. To minimise the load on your spine, the load per unit of time needs to be as low as possible and this is achieved by having a long travel suspension with a correctly rated progressive spring system which will not bottom out.

Bucket seats with suspension may seem to be a good idea, but if they work well then you will tend to use the boat harder, because it's fun. At the point where you come off a wave just that bit harder than the suspension can handle, a damaged back is going to become very vulnerable.

Well that's up to you as a driver. On a leisure boat, a good driver won't create that situation.

Long travel suspension is important in cars and bikes that go over rough terrain because they need to keep the wheels in contact with the ground.

Maybe aye, maybe no. At high speed over rough ground which tends to be potholes, a vehicle ride will be much smoother if the wheels don't follow the ground. If the roughness tends to be bumps, it may be different.
At 60mph, the track up to my house is nice and smooth.

[Clive]

Assuming your wife is generally fit, then the most practical answer would probably be to fit jockey seats and for your wife to stand up rather than sit at all. If that's not an acceptable option, then I'd suggest the Ullman seats (actually I'd probably suggest seriously considering whether a RIB was actually a good idea).


If his wife is fit i will come out on every trip and she could sit on my lap my arse is quite well padded and should offer some shock relief

[John Kennett]

Originally Posted by Hightower

So you don't think it's important to keep ones backside in contact with the seat at all time then?

Yes, but the major forces that the seats are going to have to deal with are downward. In my experience at least, being thrown upwards out of your seat is rather less common than crashing down into it!

My the way John, I thought I'd tell you. Martin hasn't got a RIB, it's a largish Cruiser. I think the Ideal solution for Martin would be to try the tractor seat bases that Clice can supply. At £60 it's a cheap enough gamble. I for one would be interested if it works.

Ah. I thought the had a Shakespeare RIB. I'll get Biggles onto the case and have him evicted!

John

[John Kennett]

Originally Posted by jwalker

I've used my seats for a couple of years and I consider them to be far better than jockey seats.

I wasn't actually thinking of your type of seats (and I was referring to fast boats! ).

As you mentioned, the damping is critical too. I've driven one particular RIB with seats that were more like a fairground ride!

There sometimes seems to be the perception that longer suspension travel is always better though, and it's not as simple as that. Out of interest, what's the maximum travel on your seats' suspension?

Well that's up to you as a driver. On a leisure boat, a good driver won't create that situation.

Sure, but even good drivers get it wrong occasionally. If the consequences are likely to be severe (and we don't know if that's the case or not in this instance), then it may be a risk that's not worth taking.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing against suspension seats, and I'm not saying that they won't be the right answer for Martin and his wife. However, just fitting a pair of truck seats might not be the best solution.

John

[Rogue Wave]

Originally Posted by John Kennett

. However, just fitting a pair of truck seats might not be the best solution.

John

I would have thought they would have been quite appropriate in a Traktr Cab!

Didn't Alan Priddy fit truck seats into Spirit/Jolly Sailor ?

As I am getting older I have been thinking about Suspension seats and have decided they would be perfect if I had Piles of money!

[John Kennett]

As far as I remember, Spirit of Cardiff had regular car seats (from a Citroen I think).

If you had piles of money then sitting on a rubber ring would probably be the ideal solution.

John

[Rogue Wave]

Originally Posted by John Kennett

If you had piles of money then sitting on a rubber ring would probably be the ideal solution.

John

now that reminds me of a story of a famous rib builders wife running down the pontoon at the SBS with his pile cushion. Shouting to him that he'd forgoten it.

I am sure Alan told me the were truck seats, is he around to confirm?

[John Kennett]

No he's in Mexico right now: www.livelylady.net

John

[jwalker]

Originally Posted by Rogue Wave

I am sure Alan told me the were truck seats, is he around to confirm?

He told me they were Citroen seats.

[Millermob]

What about citroen truck seats ?