This sad story.....

Wight Skipper · 10 May 2006, 19:35

......is being discussed on a yachtie forum I use. Makes one think.

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showflat.p...0/fpart/1/vc/1

Alice · 10 May 2006, 19:41

This is too sad for words. What ever happened regarding the safety boat driver, no one can imagine how he must be feeling over this.

What the hell happened for the kid to be in the water so long? There must be a sailing school or something similar in serious trouble. Surely if his parent(s) were aware they'd have called the lifeboat. My kids are 10 and 12 and sail dinghies. The second I can't see them,I'm in the boat and after them.

ADS · 10 May 2006, 19:43

Done a fair bit of competitive sailing around the country in the past, and have found the main problem stems from inexperienced rescue boat helms, often parents who mean well but don't really have a clue. Usually in ribs completely unsuited to the task (big 7m+ massive outboard on the bk etc), all the gear but no idea. Stripey seats have no place on a race course, a rescue rib should be Orange. The RYA use Tornado 5.1's and Yamaha 4strokes, ideal comibination, small and easy to handle, quick enough in an emergency, and well balenced with a lot of internal space for race marks etc.
Very sad story, I expect there to be a full investigation into it, and a shakeup of 'the experience required' to drive a safety boat. My thoughts are with the boy.

EDIT, just read more of the YBW, and erm, none of thats relevant, seems it was a genuine accident and the safety boat helm was highly qualified.

Yuley · 11 May 2006, 15:07

What has the colour of the seats got to do with ability & competence of the helm/crew????

If I ever need rescue I couldn't care less if im picked up by a bright PINK rib with Zebra pattern seatcovers !!!

Bizzare Opinions Abound.

ADS · 11 May 2006, 15:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yuley

What has the colour of the seats got to do with ability & competence of the helm/crew????

If I ever need rescue I couldn't care less if im picked up by a bright PINK rib with Zebra pattern seatcovers !!!

Bizzare Opinions Abound.

True, if I was in serious difficulty I wouldn't care who rescued me or in what craft. However, often when dinghy racing if you capsize a rescue boat nails it over to you, in a racing situation I would decline assistance as I would be disqualified with outside assistance, and merely askthem to standby. However, you often get spectator ribs far too big for the task who come over to assist whether you like it or not. V6 Merc ticking over, no thanks, had enough amauteurs put their prop through my sails, I would sort my self out, you have to remember a 7.5 rib looks massive from a small dinghy.

However, as the YBW thread shows it was a well qualified safety boat helm on a safety boat, i was just reiterating the point that safety boat helms should be experienced and that safety boats should be suitable for the task.

codprawn · 11 May 2006, 15:47

A prop is a prop no matter what boat it's fitted to.

Maybe for certain safety boat apps they should use a guard. Not a good idea to make it compulsory though - then ALL safety boats would need them and the amount of power lost in surf etc would be dangerous - which is why the RNLI don't use them.

Don't see why they can't be fitted to most safety boats covering dinghy sailing etc though.

Also I can understand why the bloke wanted to get him out of the water so fast - it is different in the summer but in early spring when our water is at it's coldest then people don't last very long - more people prob die from the cold than drowning.

Alice · 11 May 2006, 16:10

A 6yo kid was killed by a 6hp on a beach near us a couple of years ago. That was despite the efforts of a surgeon and an Intensive Care nurse, both of whom happened to be on the beach at the time.

hannah · 11 May 2006, 18:00

Thats really sad ... and yer makes u think
I feel for the little lad XxX

Nos4r2 · 11 May 2006, 22:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

A prop is a prop no matter what boat it's fitted to.

Maybe for certain safety boat apps they should use a guard. Not a good idea to make it compulsory though - then ALL safety boats would need them and the amount of power lost in surf etc would be dangerous - which is why the RNLI don't use them.

Don't see why they can't be fitted to most safety boats covering dinghy sailing etc though.

Maybe we need some of these over here for the rescue boats...

Specs are here.I think they are USA only though.

http://www.smalloutboards.com/etec405060.htm

codprawn · 11 May 2006, 22:42

They don't have the sudden power needed fpor many situations - they are just too inefficient.

I was suprised to see that in my Clymer suzuki workshop manual it shows similar waterjet suzuki outboards from years ago so nothing new - never seen one though!!! made from 1985 to 1991 apparently.

Tim M · 11 May 2006, 23:45

Johnson used to make them too.

jyasaki · 12 May 2006, 00:02

Yamaha still does:

http://www.yamaha-motor.com/outboard..._jet_2006.aspx

FWIW, that E-tec thingie looks to be nothing more than a shrouded prop. Not really a jet.

jky

Nos4r2 · 12 May 2006, 00:09

Yep-was apparently done for the US forces so they didn't chop themselves to bits.

roycruse · 12 May 2006, 01:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

Maybe for certain safety boat apps they should use a guard. Not a good idea to make it compulsory though - then ALL safety boats would need them and the amount of power lost in surf etc would be dangerous - which is why the RNLI don't use them.

Every RNLI surf rescue craft Ive ever seen has had a prop guard - who says they don't use them.

Compulsory prop guards for all rescue craft is definitely the way to go.

Although I pull along side people in the water 10s of times a day when wakeboarding - not really any different except the person you are collecting is usually bright and alert which may not be the case in a rescue.

EDIT - i even found a link http://www.rnli.org.uk/who_we_are/bo...ipment/arancia

EDIT2 - come to think of it ZapCats have compulsory prop guards too when racing - don't think anyone is going to accuse them of being "dangerously" under powered in surf as a result either

codprawn · 12 May 2006, 02:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by roycruse

Every RNLI surf rescue craft Ive ever seen has had a prop guard - who says they don't use them.

Compulsory prop guards for all rescue craft is definitely the way to go.

Although I pull along side people in the water 10s of times a day when wakeboarding - not really any different except the person you are collecting is usually bright and alert which may not be the case in a rescue.

EDIT - i even found a link http://www.rnli.org.uk/who_we_are/bo...ipment/arancia

EDIT2 - come to think of it ZapCats have compulsory prop guards too when racing - don't think anyone is going to accuse them of being "dangerously" under powered in surf as a result either

Very true - just commenting on what some experts had to say. Why don't the RNLI fit them to inshore boats? And the SA surf rescue team featured in the latest RIB mag don't either.

Alice · 12 May 2006, 08:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

A prop is a prop no matter what boat it's fitted to.

Maybe for certain safety boat apps they should use a guard. Not a good idea to make it compulsory though - then ALL safety boats would need them and the amount of power lost in surf etc would be dangerous - which is why the RNLI don't use them.

Go googling for 'cort nozzle' Codders, read and ingest.

steedthrust · 12 May 2006, 11:29

RYA Policy Was quite surprised at reading that, always thought they should be compulsory. There was a mention in the YBW forum that getting whacked by a prop, throws the chopped leg clear but getting macerated between a prop & guard isn't so good.

Terrible news.

codprawn · 12 May 2006, 13:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alice

Go googling for 'cort nozzle' Codders, read and ingest.

I don't need to "google" to know what a KORT nozzle is - I have had rides on enough tugs fitted with them to know what they are capable of.

Anyway what has a Kort nozzle got to do with it? At low speeds they increase thrust hence their use on tugs but ovber a certain speed their drag outweighs the benefits - hence you don't see many high speed craft fitted with them!!!

Alice · 12 May 2006, 15:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by codprawn

I don't need to "google" to know what a KORT nozzle is - I have had rides on enough tugs fitted with them to know what they are capable of.

Anyway what has a Kort nozzle got to do with it? At low speeds they increase thrust hence their use on tugs but ovber a certain speed their drag outweighs the benefits - hence you don't see many high speed craft fitted with them!!!

... and I was a part of a fabricating team that built CORT NOZZLES!!!!

ADS · 12 May 2006, 15:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alice

... and I was a part of a fabricating team that built CORT NOZZLES!!!!

Put your hand bag away