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13 June 2023, 07:05
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#1
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Member
Country: UK - England
Town: Colchester
Length: 5m +
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 2,956
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Toe out on boat trailer wheels
If you look ar boats on trailers that have been standing for some time you will often a moderately alarming toeing out of the wheels at the bottom. Me and my mate who is a bit of a trailer Nerd have come to the conclusion that this is the rubbers in the 'indespension' axle compressing over time. The solution is to just store you trailer/boat on blocks
Here is how mine were on a quite new axle
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13 June 2023, 11:01
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#2
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Member
Country: UK - England
Town: Frinton-on-Sea
Boat name: RibRoulete
Make: Highfield
Length: 6m +
Engine: Honda 150 FBW
MMSI: 232043399
Join Date: Aug 2020
Posts: 249
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Your friendly trailer "nerd" does he fancy teaching me how to service the breaking system on mine?
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13 June 2023, 11:21
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#3
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Member
Country: UK - England
Town: Colchester
Length: 5m +
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 2,956
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhill
Your friendly trailer "nerd" does he fancy teaching me how to service the breaking system on mine? ![smilie](https://www.rib.net/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif)
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If you have a large tow car the best way to service the trailer brakes is to get it all working very well. Then back of the breaking mechanism in the rod so it only 'just' comes on. I have not told you this but it will prevent that below. In my view the brakes we have on boat Trailers in this country if dunked in the sea which is generally inevitable are simply not up to the job. This is generally why I will only tow unbraked long distances.
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13 June 2023, 15:07
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#4
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Member
Country: USA
Town: NorCal
Boat name: SHARKY
Make: AB
Length: 4m +
Engine: Honda BF75 & BF5
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,053
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Toe out or negative camber? If the wheels lean in from the bottom to the top that is camber. Toe would be the front of the tires pointed out away from the trailer.
Toe out would destroy tires very quickly. Heavy camber wears the tires on the inside edges. Neither are good for a boat trailer.
How expensive are the replacement rubber parts? I'd probably just call it routine maintenance. Too much work putting jack stands/blocks under and removing them every time you need to move the trailer.
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13 June 2023, 15:45
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#5
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Member
Country: UK - England
Town: Colchester
Length: 5m +
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 2,956
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_C
Toe out or negative camber? If the wheels lean in from the bottom to the top that is camber. Toe would be the front of the tires pointed out away from the trailer.
Toe out would destroy tires very quickly. Heavy camber wears the tires on the inside edges. Neither are good for a boat trailer.
How expensive are the replacement rubber parts? I'd probably just call it routine maintenance. Too much work putting jack stands/blocks under and removing them every time you need to move the trailer.
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Ok with the whole camber thing. You cant replace the Rubbers that would mean a whole new axle and the new one would do the same. New axle about £450 nowadays and several weeks wait.
Putting them on the blocks is no biggy. Did it in about 7 mins
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13 June 2023, 20:44
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#6
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Member
Country: USA
Town: NorCal
Boat name: SHARKY
Make: AB
Length: 4m +
Engine: Honda BF75 & BF5
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,053
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So 14 minutes just to move the trailer.
I sure wouldn't replace them with the same axles. Get something of better quality when they fail.
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14 June 2023, 06:20
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#7
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Member
Country: UK - England
Town: Colchester
Length: 5m +
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 2,956
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_C
So 14 minutes just to move the trailer.
I sure wouldn't replace them with the same axles. Get something of better quality when they fail.
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I rather think you don’t understand the whole Boat Axle thing in the U.K. there is effectively only one maker available which is Peak and this is how they are. You only need to do this if the boat is stored on the trailer for a long while in which case 7 mins not 14 is no time at all. All axles with pressed rubber suspension units will do this. It has nothing to do with quality
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14 June 2023, 06:21
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#8
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Member
Country: UK - England
Town: Colchester
Length: 5m +
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 2,956
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The title should be negative camber and not toe out
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15 June 2023, 06:41
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#9
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Member
Country: USA
Town: NorCal
Boat name: SHARKY
Make: AB
Length: 4m +
Engine: Honda BF75 & BF5
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,053
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Easedalenovice
I rather think you don’t understand the whole Boat Axle thing in the U.K. there is effectively only one maker available which is Peak and this is how they are.
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I definitely did not know you only had one option for trailer axles. We have so many to choose from with most being solid axles using leaf springs, along with independent axles. We also use hydraulic brakes or electric over hydraulic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Easedalenovice
You only need to do this if the boat is stored on the trailer for a long while in which case 7 mins not 14 is no time at all.
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7 minutes to remove them, trailer gets moved, then 7 minutes to reinstall the blocks is 14 minutes. Longer than it takes to prep, launch and recover the boat and prep for trailering home. Everyone's time is different depending on lifestyle. *shrugs* I'll admit I would be too lazy to deal with blocking.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Easedalenovice
All axles with pressed rubber suspension units will do this. It has nothing to do with quality
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Quality could also be considered longevity. No other options though...
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15 June 2023, 09:12
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#10
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Member
Country: UK - Scotland
Town: north ayrshire
Boat name: charlie girl
Make: S/R5.4/regal3760
Length: 10m +
Engine: Suzukidf70 2x6lp 315
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,927
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_C
I definitely did not know you only had one option for trailer axles. We have so many to choose from with most being solid axles using leaf springs, along with independent axles. We also use hydraulic brakes or electric over hydraulic.
7 minutes to remove them, trailer gets moved, then 7 minutes to reinstall the blocks is 14 minutes. Longer than it takes to prep, launch and recover the boat and prep for trailering home. Everyone's time is different depending on lifestyle. *shrugs* I'll admit I would be too lazy to deal with blocking.
Quality could also be considered longevity. No other options though...
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There are several axle manufacturers supplying the uk market. Its not realy a huge issue, you do see odd trailers with the wheels sat squat but generally only real old ones which have probably been overloaded most of their lives. Bearings, hubs & brake components usually rot out well before the rubber components deteriorate to the point of running tyres off to any great degree. Axles are relatively cheap in real terms & once they get to a certain age & degree of corrosion its a fairly cheap & easy operation to replace them, once replaced you have everything new as they come complete with brakes hubs etc. I couldn't be bothered faffing about blocking off a trailer every time I wanted to move it.
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15 June 2023, 11:01
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#11
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Member
Country: UK - England
Town: Colchester
Length: 5m +
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 2,956
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beamishken
There are several axle manufacturers supplying the uk market. Its not realy a huge issue, you do see odd trailers with the wheels sat squat but generally only real old ones which have probably been overloaded most of their lives. Bearings, hubs & brake components usually rot out well before the rubber components deteriorate to the point of running tyres off to any great degree. Axles are relatively cheap in real terms & once they get to a certain age & degree of corrosion its a fairly cheap & easy operation to replace them, once replaced you have everything new as they come complete with brakes hubs etc. I couldn't be bothered faffing about blocking off a trailer every time I wanted to move it.
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I say again as I sad originally..... Blocking off is only if you are going to store it quite a long time.
Axles in the UK used to be cheap but no longer.... Try and buy one in real life and see the cost and also the time you have to wait.
Also when you buy in the UK almost all roads lead to Peak
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15 June 2023, 12:28
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#12
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Member
Country: UK - Scotland
Town: north ayrshire
Boat name: charlie girl
Make: S/R5.4/regal3760
Length: 10m +
Engine: Suzukidf70 2x6lp 315
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,927
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Easedalenovice
I say again as I sad originally..... Blocking off is only if you are going to store it quite a long time.
Axles in the UK used to be cheap but no longer.... Try and buy one in real life and see the cost and also the time you have to wait.
Also when you buy in the UK almost all roads lead to Peak
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You never heard of any of these?
*Al-ko, Knott, Avonride, BPW, and Indespension.
When you need hubs bearings shoes back plates etc you could be spending in the region of £300 plus a load of labour at that point an axle at around £500/600 becomes a realistic option
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15 June 2023, 18:22
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#13
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Member
Country: USA
Town: NorCal
Boat name: SHARKY
Make: AB
Length: 4m +
Engine: Honda BF75 & BF5
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,053
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beamishken
There are several axle manufacturers supplying the uk market. Its not realy a huge issue, you do see odd trailers with the wheels sat squat but generally only real old ones which have probably been overloaded most of their lives. Bearings, hubs & brake components usually rot out well before the rubber components deteriorate to the point of running tyres off to any great degree. Axles are relatively cheap in real terms & once they get to a certain age & degree of corrosion its a fairly cheap & easy operation to replace them, once replaced you have everything new as they come complete with brakes hubs etc. I couldn't be bothered faffing about blocking off a trailer every time I wanted to move it.
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Thanks for the further explanation.
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16 June 2023, 10:58
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#14
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Member
Country: UK - England
Town: Manchester
Make: Ribcraft
Length: 5m +
Engine: Suzuki 140
Join Date: Dec 2021
Posts: 41
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life is way too short for this
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16 June 2023, 17:36
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#15
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Member
Country: UK - England
Town: Up North and right a bit
Make: XS500/Merc340/Bic245
Length: 5m +
Engine: Mar 60/20/3.5/Hon2.3
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdbxyz
life is way too short for this
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Yeah, but he’s not wrong to be fair and good advice.
Never experienced the negative camber issue but we always store on blocks over winter to save axle rubbers settling and stressing tyres.
Just good practice at the end of the day.
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16 June 2023, 18:29
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#16
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Member
Country: UK - England
Boat name: Redneck
Make: Excel
Length: 3m +
Engine: 20 efi & 9.8 2s
Join Date: Jul 2020
Posts: 3,282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chipko
Yeah, but he’s not wrong to be fair and good advice.
Never experienced the negative camber issue but we always store on blocks over winter to save axle rubbers settling and stressing tyres.
Just good practice at the end of the day.
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I do exactly the same with the caravan over winter. No axle rubbers of course, but saves tyre flat spotting and side wall cracking.
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16 June 2023, 18:36
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#17
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RIBnet admin team
Country: Ireland
Length: 4m +
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 14,859
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chipko
Just good practice at the end of the day.
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Apparently it makes yer boat 7 minutes harder to nick as well
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16 June 2023, 19:12
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#18
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Member
Country: UK - Scotland
Town: Easdale
Boat name: Miss Isle
Make: Solent 6.9
Length: 6m +
Engine: 225 optimax
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,427
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And saves flat spots on wheel bearings!
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I was born not knowing and have had only a little time to change that here and there.
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17 June 2023, 15:02
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#19
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Member
Country: UK - England
Town: Colchester
Length: 5m +
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 2,956
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So a good idea all round………… I wonder who told me to do it
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17 June 2023, 19:48
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#20
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Member
Country: USA
Town: NorCal
Boat name: SHARKY
Make: AB
Length: 4m +
Engine: Honda BF75 & BF5
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,053
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willk
Apparently it makes yer boat 7 minutes harder to nick as well ![wink](https://www.rib.net/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif)
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"IF" I was a thief I would careless if it was on blocks or not. Connect to trailer and drag it away. Zero time lost and damage would be non existent from wood blocks. Noise would be minimal too. *Shrugs*
Living in a mediterranean climate I am not sure what this winter off season is? For us winter is when the winds often die down and its time to go boating/diving.
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