Tragedy at Padstow - 5 May 2013

[kerny]

It say's Mr+Mrs Milligan had taken a powerboat course so even if they were made to take it, it still didn't prevent the accident from happening.

For me it's better someone wanting to take a course than someone being forced to take a course.

[ashbypower]

Leading a horse to water is one thing......

So we are trained to drive cars, and are issued with a licence... so I guess the only accidents involve un trained drivers Mmmmmm

[C2 RIBS]

Coroner can only make representations to others, but it carries weight usually with organisations like RYA.
Interested in answer to builders and MAIB too as they can only ask and make representations I think

[Boatnomad]

Originally Posted by ShinyShoe

Coz the compulsory qualification would be the one the driver had.

+1

Nick Milligan's widow tells inquest of 'big mistake' that no one used boat's kill cord | Daily Mail Online

[Simon B]

This is a horrific tragedy, I have been reading through the full report, its sobering stuff. The kill cord is issue is clear however there seems to be a reluctance to talk about what actually caused the accident;

"Mr Milligan then
reached across, in front of his wife, took the helm in his right hand and the throttle in
his left, and then increased the engine throttle setting to full as he turned the helm to
starboard"

What made him do this may never be known, that it was a very foolish thing indeed to do is very clear to experienced boaters with modern high torque electronically managed engines equiped with high performance props.

[Poly]

Originally Posted by C2 RIBS

Interesting comments from the coroner "A coroner is calling for a review of training for speedboat users following the death of a father and daughter." ""They should consider making them compulsory."

Although that is how the BBC headline reports it the bit in bold is actually a quote from Mr Milligan's brother. The coroner actually said she would "write to the Royal Yachting Association (RYA) asking it to review whether training for leisure powerboats should be made compulsory in some cases." Which is a somewhat less melodramatic statement.

Assuming it is a formal action by the corroner the RYA will be required to respond, but not necessarily to agree with her (or any subtext that she may be implying or the BBC maybe reading between the lines).

[Mollers]

Originally Posted by Simon B

What made him do this may never be known, that it was a very foolish thing indeed to do is very clear to experienced boaters with modern high torque electronically managed engines equiped with high performance props.

The consensus is, that Mrs. Milligan had made a final turn to make an approach to the mooring.
She had turned towards a shallow sandy shore, Mr. Milligan was fearful that because of slow nature of the turn, they were in danger of grounding. He reached across to apply more helm and throttle inorder to tighten the turn. The rest is well recorded.

[C2 RIBS]

Originally Posted by Poly

Although that is how the BBC headline reports it the bit in bold is actually a quote from Mr Milligan's brother. The coroner actually said she would "write to the Royal Yachting Association (RYA) asking it to review whether training for leisure powerboats should be made compulsory in some cases." Which is a somewhat less melodramatic statement.

Assuming it is a formal action by the corroner the RYA will be required to respond, but not necessarily to agree with her (or any subtext that she may be implying or the BBC maybe reading between the lines).

Thought that is what I posted, hey ho

[Simon B]

I'm going to think about how kill cords can be better managed, I'll cable tie mine to my lifejacket for now and buy a whole bag full for our trainees, who can do the same. The idea of detaching the killcord needs to change possibly.

I already take people through how a hook occurrs and demonstrate it, its much less pronounced in our Ribcraft 6.8, I believe because we dont have as much power to lift the bow up. Most of diving boat handling is done trimmed slightly in too.

[Lark]

I seem to remember that in the book Heavy weather power boating, one of the authors argues for not using kill cords in rough conditions, so that if the helm goes overboard, the person who takes control doesn't have to loose time restarting the engine (amongst other reasons). Does anyone agree with that advice? (I realise it's off topic from the Padstow tragedy)

[PeterM]

Originally Posted by Lark

I seem to remember that in the book Heavy weather power boating, one of the authors argues for not using kill cords in rough conditions, so that if the helm goes overboard, the person who takes control doesn't have to loose time restarting the engine (amongst other reasons). Does anyone agree with that advice? (I realise it's off topic from the Padstow tragedy)

Depending on situation and set up I can see pros and cons, the 'most likely' situation will be the boat has in gear start protection and the departing helm is unlikely to have helpfully dropped backed to neutral on their way out !

So your looking at get to helm, get to neutral, kill cord on -turn key and off you go as a minimum. The merc boxes don't need a second cord ( handy but also risky for clear reasons) , I 'think' modern engines like Yam/ suzy will allow you to restart without a cord for something like 30 secs after its pulled out - precisely for the above reason in time saving.....

[Simon B]

It might have been Alan Priddy if I have remembered his name right. There are pros and cons at least if your helm has heaved themselves overboard you'll be nearer to them if the motor stops dead.

I dont handle our boat in anything like challenging conditions so will be connected at all times. Next question is how do you safely train out avoidning hooking?

[lakelandterrier]

This event did not happen in rough or extreme conditions though.

[boristhebold]

Originally Posted by C2 RIBS

Interesting comments from the coroner "A coroner is calling for a review of training for speedboat users following the death of a father and daughter." ""They should consider making them compulsory."
BBC News - Cornwall speedboat deaths: Coroner call for training review

"The inquest heard the speedboat's manufacturer APV Marine had rejected a formal recommendation from the Marine Accident Investigation Branch (MAIB) to review the design of its hull."

I was interested in why the manufacturer rejected the reco to review the hull design, after the specific mention in the report about the sudden increase in heel over angle and also a mention of this in some magazine test report a while ago im surprised that people of same model arn't asking some questions ? Other older models dont have the same sudden heal over issue. Naturally the full throttle and tight steering had major issues to why the incident happenned but the report did seem to suggest that the hull design coudl have made the issue more likely to occur. Any 8.5M cobra owners out there been thinking about this ?

[chris.moody]

On watching the videos of the actual testing of Milly where they provoked a hook, the hook did not look a particularly violent one. If you go WOT and hard over on the steering in anything with a big engine it's going to get interesting.

[Pikey Dave]

Originally Posted by Lark

.........Does anyone agree with that advice?

Nope

[Poly]

Originally Posted by Lark

Does anyone agree with that advice?

Originally Posted by Pikey Dave

Nope

Well I certainly don't think it is relevant to the average leisure boater or to conditions that even the more adventurous people on here will normally find themselves in. IF there is an argument for removing the kill cord (and the RNLI agree with the sentiments in the post so it may be valid) then it should be a conscious decision in those specific circumstances rather than a generic excuse for not bothering in the 99% of occasions when the balance of risk is clearly the other way. If you are the sort of person who does boat in those conditions then I guess you'd be thinking about alternative risk mitigation strategies, and have the wherewithal to make your own decisions.

[Mollers]

It's a scenario which crosses my mind from time to time. Me being spat out in heavy seas and Mrs M having to restart and recover. I might just nip down to the solicitors on Monday.

[willk]

Originally Posted by Mollers

It's a scenario which crosses my mind from time to time.

It often crosses my mind too. In my scenario, she isn't always able to rescue you...

[Mollers]

Originally Posted by willk

It often crosses my mind too. In my scenario, she isn't always able to rescue you...

"Isn't always"? My run through ends with never.